FFL

[chumrunner]

holy hell, you're a patient man! this riverside ffl sounds about as reliable as your potential buyer.
if your buyer is a calgunner/ do us all a favor and leave him a negative Itrader rating. even if i had a change of heart, i'd honor the deal and man up with the $$$.

[Hoolpe]

You need to out the FFL and flake so everyone here knows to avoid them like the plague.

[stitchnicklas]

You need to out the FFL and flake so everyone here knows to avoid them like the plague.

+1,000,000

[longarmshortlegs]

What's the name of the Riverside shop?

If Riverside was claiming that the problem was on your end (with your FFL) then why not call or go to your FFL and call Riverside while you are standing in front of them?

[chumrunner]

You need to out the FFL and flake so everyone here knows to avoid them like the plague.

X 10

[dlouie87]

sorry to hear... but why would you ship it without receiving payment first?

[Antihero47]

I hope its not Bright Spot, they don't sound like they would do something like that however. Centerfire sounds possible, but J&W Guns sounds more suspect.

[Omega13device]

sorry to hear... but why would you ship it without receiving payment first?

It helps if you actually read the thread...post #14.

[jstotts]

tagged.

It sounds like JW Guns to me.

[getafterit]

something dont smell right here...A couple of members posted that you can have the pistol shipped back to you directly. NOT TRUE! Ifs its a hand gun it must be shipped from FFL to FFL. Rifles and shotguns are exempt from this rule.
As to the sour deal, you should have called ATF when this deal first went south. Why do you care about putting an FFL dealer out of business. If they are doing shady things then they need to be out of business.
At this point they are flat out refusing to return your property. You really need to call the ATF and report it.

[tenpercentfirearms]

something dont smell right here...A couple of members posted that you can have the pistol shipped back to you directly. NOT TRUE! Ifs its a hand gun it must be shipped from FFL to FFL. Rifles and shotguns are exempt from this rule.
As to the sour deal, you should have called ATF when this deal first went south. Why do you care about putting an FFL dealer out of business. If they are doing shady things then they need to be out of business.
At this point they are flat out refusing to return your property. You really need to call the ATF and report it.

So much FUD in this thread.

First, as was stated earlier, the firearm (whether it is a long gun or a handgun makes no difference) cannot be shipped back to the seller because it was not sent to the FFL as a gunsmithing transaction. It must be returned to a dealer and it must be DROSed back to the owner.

Second, what is the ATF going to do? Has the FFL broken any Federal laws? No they have not. Worst case scenario is they are stealing your firearm, which you will need to notify the local police about.

However, they might just be slow and not treating you as a priority since they are making no money on your handgun. They didn't get a transfer fee from the buyer and now they have to go through all of this trouble to send this handgun back.

Call the dealer and tell them you will give them $20 for their time if the gun is shipped this week. Then if they ship it, give them the $20 or don't. That one is on you. However, you might want to give the FFL a reason to ship your gun. Right now they are doing charity work.

And the bigger lesson for all of us is to make sure that funds through PayPal or GPal clear into your checking before shipping anything. Or just deal in money orders.

Good luck and let us know if the ATF cares.

[247Nino]

Want me to call Paco and Smiley, they live in Moreno Valley, they'll get your gun for sure.

Call the ATF!

[getafterit]

So much FUD in this thread.

First, as was stated earlier, the firearm (whether it is a long gun or a handgun makes no difference) cannot be shipped back to the seller because it was not sent to the FFL as a gunsmithing transaction. It must be returned to a dealer and it must be DROSed back to the owner.

Second, what is the ATF going to do? Has the FFL broken any Federal laws? No they have not. Worst case scenario is they are stealing your firearm, which you will need to notify the local police about.

However, they might just be slow and not treating you as a priority since they are making no money on your handgun. They didn't get a transfer fee from the buyer and now they have to go through all of this trouble to send this handgun back.

Call the dealer and tell them you will give them $20 for their time if the gun is shipped this week. Then if they ship it, give them the $20 or don't. That one is on you. However, you might want to give the FFL a reason to ship your gun. Right now they are doing charity work.

And the bigger lesson for all of us is to make sure that funds through PayPal or GPal clear into your checking before shipping anything. Or just deal in money orders.

Good luck and let us know if the ATF cares.

I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing that up.
As for what is the ATF going to do? Are you saying that they couldnt care less about an FFL holder stealing guns? I would guess different.
Either way, call both local LE and the ATF. For that matter call the DOJ and tell em this POS flat out told you they are not sending your gun back.
Sure they are not making anything on the sale but then again maybe they never asked the seller for anything either in light of the sale falling through.
Ten percent, please keep in mind that WE are not the dealers so we rely on what WE are told from the dealers we deal with. That said, even some dealers get it wrong from time to time or dont care enough to cross every T and dot every I.
I know you are probably going to say that we can study up on the matter. I would say to that, not all of us are in the firearms business. When this is what you do for a living it is much easier to spend hours researching the ins and outs.
But I regress, thanks again for clearing it up.

[dieselpower]

Sorry Ten% you are alittle bias here and a little wrong as well.

BATFE will certainly care if a FFL holder is not following the laws they agreed to when issued the license...its a REQUIREMENT for holding the license.

They were shipped a firearm. They were asked to ship the firearm to another FFL. They confirmed it was shipped and was in fact not shipped..two or three times if I am following this correctly.

Yes, they have not been paid for this. Please show me in the law you MUST be paid for handling firearms. You are licensed by the federal Government to deal in firearms and that license has rules. Not one single rule FORCES you to charge another person set amount to handle firearms. A bill is due and will be paid...that is it.

If you, as an FFL accept my firearm, you, as the FFL, are responsible for it. When you act in any way, outside of the law, you can and will be held accountable for your actions.

When you are ORDERED to ship a firearm to another persons who LEGALLY owns ...you don't have the right in any way to refuse that. If a bill isn't paid, that stops the shipment by other law. In this case there was no agreed bill and NO legal reason to LIE about shipping a firearm AS PER THE LAW.

10% you have done a huge service to CA with the OLL thing. In fact we wouldn't have OLLs if it wasn't for you...but sometimes your way of thinking scares the **** out of me. I am sorry to say this, but I don't trust you as a business man. I will have a beer with you, but giving you property or money...sorry not happening.

[getafterit]

well said dieselpower