Single Shot Exemption Explanation/Database Thread

[terdog]

Does your range check all firearms for legality? If so, Id find a different place to shoot.

[MotoriousRacing]

Thanks for the answers!

Perhaps are misunderstanding the use of the SSE. The item needs to be DROS'd in an exempt configuration to get the exemption from the roster. The conversion is done for that purpose alone. The intent is to use it in the factory configuration, not the exempt configuration.

I guess the laws don't make sense to me. Since the SSE/reconversion is so easy, it seems against the law to acquire and posess on off-roster gun this way.

Why would you expect to be hassled? There are other legal ways to end up with an off-roster configuration, and no one has any reason to question those. You acquired it legally, so what is the problem?

I've actually never gone to a range, I've done all my practice in the desert near Lake Havasu. I assummed a range could be somehow liable if they allowed off-roster guns, or if the state becomes even more anti-gun, that there could be potential random DOJ inspections in the future.

[terdog]

It seems you are trying to apply COMMON SENSE to this situation. Remember, we are dealing with the LAW. Common sense does not apply here.

[kemasa]

Is there potential to get questioned, hassled, etc. just for showing up at the range to fire the re-converted to factory specs handgun? How are you getting around this? Do I have to actually buy a conversion kit (longer barrel) so I can convert it when going to the range? If so, what would be the point of practicing with a different barrel than I would use in a SHTF scenario?

I don't think you are understanding the question that is being asked, which is can you shoot the firearm when it is in the SINGLE SHOT CONFIGURATION. This is NOTHING about after it is converted back to normal.

If you look at the quality of some the single shot barrels and how the barrel was created, you might think twice about whether you would want to use it ever for anything other than as a paperweight or to technically convert a firearm to single shot. I say technically since if the firearm can not be shot with it, then could it raise some issues.

[LBDamned]

Thanks for the answers!



I guess the laws don't make sense to me. Since the SSE/reconversion is so easy, it seems against the law to acquire and posess on off-roster gun this way.



I've actually never gone to a range, I've done all my practice in the desert near Lake Havasu. I assummed a range could be somehow liable if they allowed off-roster guns, or if the state becomes even more anti-gun, that there could be potential random DOJ inspections in the future.

most ranges don't exam your guns (not to any great detail anyway)... the only one that I go to that gives more than a glance in OC Sheriff's range - and they are just making sure there are no Sat night specials coming in... and it's highly doubtful they would realize a certain gun is not on DOJ roster... none of the other ranges I frequent would bother with it.

[MotoriousRacing]

I just purchased my first handgun (on-roster BuckMark) and am already wanting a G19 Gen4 FDE. I believe I understand the SSE and the gunsmithing, but this is what bother's me.

FAQ

Q: Can I shoot my gun in single shot exempt form?
A: Yes, and in theory nothing out of the ordinary should happen. Is it recommended? No.???

Is there potential to get questioned, hassled, etc. just for showing up at the range to fire the re-converted to factory specs handgun? How are you getting around this? Do I have to actually buy a conversion kit (longer barrel) so I can convert it when going to the range? If so, what would be the point of practicing with a different barrel than I would use in a SHTF scenario?

Perhaps are misunderstanding the use of the SSE. The item needs to be DROS'd in an exempt configuration to get the exemption from the roster. The conversion is done for that purpose alone. The intent is to use it in the factory configuration, not the exempt configuration.

Why would you expect to be hassled? There are other legal ways to end up with an off-roster configuration, and no one has any reason to question those. You acquired it legally, so what is the problem?

I definitely misunderstood the answer above .

Ultimately, understanding a random inspection is not likely (at this time), how is one to explain having an off-roster gun if put in that situation? Simply saying "I modified it" is supposed to allow you to keep the gun and stay out of trouble, just because the law doesn't say I can't modify it? Isn't the purpose of the roster to tell which guns are allowed to be owned as configured by the factory, and which guns could only be owned if "permanently" modified as single shot?

Thanks for putting up with questions from a newb.

[CaliB&R]

Isn't the purpose of the roster to tell which guns are allowed to be owned as configured by the factory, and which guns could only be owned if "permanently" modified as single shot?

Nope, the roster just says what guns Dealers may sell new to civilians. If its SSE/SAE, PPT or intra-familial transfer, then the roster means diddly jack.

[anoldguy]

I've had a 9mm converted to Single Shot because it was 'at the time' off-roster. It had been on the approved list up until November 2009, but the manufacturer didn't renew when I wanted to purchase a new one so I did the SSE. Who in their right mind would be able to know when mine was purchased versus one that had been on the apporved list up until Nov. 2009 (I purchased mine in 2011)? They'd have to see my DROS and compare it to when I purchased it to know when it had gone 'off' list. If the one you are considering has ever been approved, then I'd never worry about anyone ever even checking. But I wouldn't imagine any range would be that sharp.
M

[dspiel]

I tried ordering a XDM from buds yesterday and this morning they cancelled my order. I called them to explain that I am wanted it shipped to an 07 FFL that can do the conversion and they would not honor the order regardless.

[mrdd]

That is a known issue with buds. Their policy.

ETA: If you look at the first post of this thread, it has a list of vendors who will not ship off roster to CA, and buds is at the top of the list.

[dspiel]

Update: Called Impact Guns and they were willing to ship the gun so I ordered from them.

[mrdd]

There you go.

[kemasa]

Ultimately, understanding a random inspection is not likely (at this time), how is one to explain having an off-roster gun if put in that situation? Simply saying "I modified it" is supposed to allow you to keep the gun and stay out of trouble, just because the law doesn't say I can't modify it? Isn't the purpose of the roster to tell which guns are allowed to be owned as configured by the factory, and which guns could only be owned if "permanently" modified as single shot?

The answer to any question about any firearm that you legally own is: I legally own this firearm. Nothing more. People tend to get in trouble by being stupid and saying too much. Remember, you have a right to remain silent.

The law is to harass people. There are MANY ways to legally own a firearm which is not on the certified list, such as a PPT, being a resident of multiple states, moving from outside of CA into CA, intrafamilial transfer, etc.

If you slightly change a firearm on the certified list, then it can not be transferred by a FFL unless the person is exempt or the transfer is exempt (PPT).

The certified list is claimed to be about safety, but then police are exempt from have a firearm which is tested to ensure that it is safe (based on the claims of the reason for the law, not my view). Any firearm which was unsafe would result in the manufacturer being sued out of existance.

[MotoriousRacing]

Thanks for helping out. I'd like to straighten out a few things in my mind. Sorry if the answers are in the previous pages.

Recipe:
1. Convert to single shot
2. DROS and wait
3. Deliver
4. Re-convert

Regarding the recipe;

1. When buying an off-roster handgun from an out-of-state vendor (riflegear is out-of-stock), does the out-of-state vendor have to make the SSE conversion before shipping to a FFL, or can the receiving FFL make the conversion?

2. (Silly question, but hey...) Is it correct to assume that I will get the manufacturers stock barrel/hardware along with the SSE barrel/hardware when I take possession?

3. Can I do the reconversion myself or is it required to be done by an FFL or gunsmith?

Thanks again for explanations.

[kemasa]

3) Typically it is easy to exchange the parts since it is typically the same as taking it apart for cleaning, but it depends on the firearm. I have not heard of any that require a gunsmith, but that does not mean that there is not one that does.

2) It depends. From what I have seen, you don't get the factory parts until you return the SSE parts. This is to ensure that they get the parts back.

1) It depends. In theory, anyone can do the conversion, but there is some question as to whether it is considered manufacturing, depending on what has to be done. The manufacturing FAQ says that installing a precision trigger on a firearm that the FFL intends to sell is manufacturing, which does not make sense to me, but I don't make or enforce the laws. So, it depends on who is willing to do the conversion.