Disapointed with Livermore Range RO's

[M1A Rifleman]

There are nine members of the board of this club, this matter came up at last nights meeting and the entire board is looking into the allegations and will take appropiate measures to correct any infractions found.

The non movement of firearms during a cease fire has been the rule since the club reopened some five or six years ago, Not a new rule, a long time user of the facility would be aware of that rule.

The "Asian RO" was being constructive in his comments as it's possible that someone could bring a gun to a range not knowing it may or may not be legal.
It has happened I assure you. A "smirk" is not a good response.

Thank you all for your opinions, we appreciate your concerns.

Rich Bronge, Pistol/Rifle Range Manager & Board Member

Thanks Mr. Bronge for responding. I have attended the range since it reopened and think it is one of the best, and have always been surprised at how friendly the RO's are. The "Thank you and come again" was always a nice touch. This year, I have only got to the range twice. Last week and the week before. I did not recall these rules in the past, non the less, I have no issue with ANY of the rules regardless if I agree with them or not.

As I stated, my issue is with the two RO's, the one using the mike being one of them. Not only did I get the chance overhear his discussions and see his gun handling during a cease fire this last week. I had the opportunity to observes his behavior the week before.

I did not catch the name of guy this this last trip. I admit, I did bristle when his first words to me were that my rifle was illegal. He may not have intended anything more than thinking I was ignorant on the subject of my own rifle.

Regarding the attitude of the one with the mike, is there a phone number and person I can contact to discuss, as his post seems to confirm his negative attitude.

[AAShooter]

There are nine members of the board of this club, this matter came up at last nights meeting and the entire board is looking into the allegations and will take appropiate measures to correct any infractions found.

The non movement of firearms during a cease fire has been the rule since the club reopened some five or six years ago, Not a new rule, a long time user of the facility would be aware of that rule.

The "Asian RO" was being constructive in his comments as it's possible that someone could bring a gun to a range not knowing it may or may not be legal.
It has happened I assure you. A "smirk" is not a good response.

Thank you all for your opinions, we appreciate your concerns.

Rich Bronge, Pistol/Rifle Range Manager & Board Member

Glad to hear it, thanks for the update.

[Arby]

Ask for me the next time you come to the range, I'm usually there every Saturday & drop in most days. Rather not publish my number here.

[Latigo]

Holy Cow!! I read through all of this and saw that dude's response and I'm blown away. Call me naaive but I actually hadn't realized it was this way on your ranges. Our family has a private 500 yard range and now I think we're just spoiled. Man o man...... You guys have my sincere sympathies. I never imagined it was that hard or that crowded on those ranges.
The range dude defintely has a sever attitude problem. Too bad there's not enough competition for guys like him.
Anyone ever in my AO that wants to shoot, just say so. The only RO is Ma and she doesn't say a word. She just taps the back of your head with a Darning Egg if you get out of line or don't eat enough for lunch.

[MacOtac]

Wow, Rich Descoteaux you just won the most unprofessional RSO award! What a D-bag....

[M1A Rifleman]

Ask for me the next time you come to the range, I'm usually there every Saturday & drop in most days. Rather not publish my number here.

Rich, Understood.

I'll send you a Private Message with my contact number - I assume you have this setup. If not, are you available at the Ranges general number?

[big red]

Folks, the problem here should not be to fix the blame but fix the problem. Egos got bruised and attitudes exposed and that hurts. Constructive ideas and a lot of practice to make perfect seems to be a more positive approach to this issue. I have never been to Livermore but we can't afford to blackball a range or lose one when we could use more not less. Some retraining, a sit down discussion, maybe a little remodeling as to the location of the rules, or whatever it takes to make it a better place. No one is out there to ruin the place so let's all work to make it better. Once you get the egos off the table and admit no one is perfect and people will admit to possibly being wrong or they could have done it better then you would be surprised how much better the range can be. Remember a safe and properly run range first and egos second.

[IPSICK]

Sounds like a range I'll stay away from with self-important windbags like this on staff.

Lost any motivation I had of using that range as well. Handling a firearm during a cease-fire should be an absolute no-no for EVERYONE. I get talked crap to by Harvie at San Leandro all the time but he's just talking crap and he doesn't do something unsafe like Rich.

[John Browning]

First thank you for the comments and suggestions regarding the RSO duties at LPRG. Now lets take a minute to look at your comments ..... all of you.

1. Rather than ***** on this web site, come forward and state your name and e mail so we can address your complaints individually.
2. If anyone thinks that the RSO duties are easy and that we deal with reasonable people who actually have brought some measure of horse sense to the range with them..... your wrong.
3. To give you a simple idea of what we RSO's see on a daily basis think this: People shoot like they drive. Now look around at the people driving and see what we deal with.
4. Have any of you trained, papered, know what your doing shooters out there had a gun pointed at you and had the person say " it's not loaded"?
5. As for the gun in or out of the case during a cease fire. This has been a range rule forever. It's not going to change because your upset with it. Suck it up or find another range. May I suggest Manteca. It's a place that's a wreck waiting to happen, a free for all, might be your cup of tea.
6. The reason that we on the Mic say " may I have your attention please- everyone look at me is because your too busy shooting the **** to listen to range commands, when you are involved in a screw up because there's no such thing as an accident according to YOUR military you will say I didn't hear that command - I wonder why. Again find another less safety oriented place to shoot!
7. We are ALL volunteers, we do not get paid. We are there so YOU have a place to legally shoot that thing you shoot. So abide by the rules or leave!
8. I would be more than happy to discuss any of these rules with you strait up face to face if you have the courage to defend your position.
9. The rules are posted in several places as you come in to the office area. Ask yourself ....... have I read those rules before I acted like a fool on this discussion page!
10. the rules are for EVERYONE'S safety, put in place so YOU and everyone else is doing the same thing at the same time and not what you DAMN WELL PLEASE WHEN YOU DECIDE.

I am the guy that's full of himself and I am a certified RSO plus I also am a LPRG Board Member so you tickled the fancy of the right guy. Come up some Sunday and I'll let you run the show just so you can see how easy it really is, if you have the good ol American guts to take me up on it that is.
The name is Rich Descoteaux and I'll be glad to talk to anyone with a problem that does not hide behind a website using some name other than their own.

What a D-bag. I've seen your RSOs, and they have some pretty bad safety violations. A few of them have no common sense. Few of them have people skills. I could give a crap how certified they are because they are terrible at their job. There is NO excuse for an RSO playing with equipment while someone is downrange. I've seen this myself. It is BS.

With attitudes like yours, we should be putting you in a closet where you aren't allowed within earshot of the public. For many people who are on the fence about shooting and guns, you are the voice and face of the gun community and often their first contact with a "gun guy." I've seen firsthand how self-important certified RSOs like yourself create an environment which makes new shooters and fence-sitters so nervous and feel so self-conscious that they leave and never come back. Way to go.

Being a certified RSO (really, big deal) does not make you wise as evident by those who play with guns on the table while I'm posting targets. Likewise, because I'm just a customer off the street, doesn't mean that I'm a dolt.

Your basic excuse is that some customers may be morons, so the solution is to treat all of them like they are morons. However, self-anointed geniuses like you don't need to observe range rules or even common sense, because you're a certified RSO. You should be kicked off the board for your attitude and safety violations.

[LoneWolf1]

I was there today, for a good part of the day. RO's were two older gentlemen, both friendly and only had to say something once today, that I noticed, when when someone walked ahead of the yellow line during a cease fire.

It seems like the best days to go are during the weekdays.

On a side note, I did notice that the guy shooting next to me had a Mag-Magnet on his BB. He did at least take it off before he cased his rifle to leave.

[cmichini]

You should contact the President and Board of Directors ASAP regarding your experience, especially if the RSO is handling a firearm during the target change period.

This x 1000.

The RO being a tool not knowing what the **** he's talking about with the AW situation is bad enough. The guy with the teeny weenie that wants everyone to 'respect mah authoratay' is funny, if not annoying.

However, the asshat violating safety rules, acting as if he was really a Range SAFETY Officer, needs to be called out, and corrected.

[capitol]

I remember one time this particular RO was walking the line checking guns to make sure they were unloaded during a cease fire.

After the RO goes by some guy walks up to the bench, loads his gun and starts shooting his target.

As you can imagine the shooter got an ear full at full volume, but the most disturbing part was the shooter wasn't kicked off the range.

[biloutkast]

Try going to USI. The R/O's are friendly and they keep the noobs in check.

[John Browning]

Try going to USI. The R/O's are friendly and they keep the noobs in check.

I wish that RSOs would help the noobs out, rather than have to pick on those who know less than them, which is pretty much just the noobs.

You can be safe, smart and still make the place welcoming. Being an ******* to new shooters doesn't translate to a safer range.

[caldude]

I shoot at Livermore all of the time, and was there on Sunday. Obviously some people are bothered by things more than others. Yes, the safety infractions and racist remarks would turn me off also, but the other stuff wouldn't bother me. Even Alvin, who used to yell at everybody there, never really bothered me. At least he seemed to keep an eye out more for safety infractions that the current group of RSOs seems to.

As far as the rules go - they may not all make sense, but they are the range rules. If you don't like them, find somewhere else to shoot.