GPal (Gunpal) problems?

[eaglemike]

This was in reference to Ben's referring to himself as an employee of GeoVario, and holding the raffles/sweepstakes in GeoVario's name, when he had already left GeoVario.

Do you have proof of this? Just wanting to be sure...... again, this should be addressed in another thread, if needed. Even if it was true, there could have been an agreement for Ben to act as the executor in this instance. Let's deal with the current stuff, ok?

[cj1026]

Do you have proof of this? Just wanting to be sure......

The owner of GV has said so himself.

[Casual_Shooter]

While I appreciate and have participated in the ongoing discussions about GPal, I'm sad to see the effect it's had on the community.

We've started to turn on each other.

[eaglemike]

The owner of GV has said so himself.

Can you provide this? I'm talking about the timing, sweepstakes involvement, etc.

[cj1026]

Can you provide this? I'm talking about the timing, sweepstakes involvement, etc.

Go read his posts on CB. The minute his quotes end up here the thread will be closed.

[eaglemike]

Go read his posts on CB. The minute his quotes end up here the thread will be closed.

No, I'm not going to chase stuff on another forum. I'm quite positive that all the stuff posted there isn't accurate. I took a look early on, and it was just a dog-pile.

Let's stay on topic.

I'm also quite sure that posts containing only accurate information will not be deleted. If you can't trust the forum owner and staff, well......... just say so. I trust them.

[BigJB]

As a Calguns member I'm ashamed of what's going on here. This is detrimental to the community itself. It's detracting from the growth, the popularity and the good that this community does. It's a distraction and a destructive influence at a time when we should be seizing the opportunity to capitalize on our valid judicial, social and legislative gains.

For those reasons, I'm uneasy and upset.

Furthermore, threads are still being deleted. Ben comes online every few days and entire threads criticizing how the Gpal situation is developing just mysteriously disappear. This is not helping the situation at all. KES, it's time to change the rules on this. You have to take drastic action to protect the community here. Ben isn't making this right. If it continues much longer it might well take down CGN itself, along with gpal, from a pr standpoint. There's too much to lose here to let Ben's experiment destroy all that you have created for us.

I implore you. Cut the cords. End gpal administrative rights in their subforum and embrace the criticism. Lend no embrace, perceived or conceived, to the notion that CGN has any complicity in the BS being perpetrated here. Ben has laid his egg, let him eat it. Don't let him take down CGN with his problem.

To Ben, make this thing right. From what you've said, you're trying. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt. Your companies' failures, whether your fault or not, are affecting our community in a most detrimental way. Do nothing more to entangle the CGN community in this disaster. Separate yourself and work to reconcile your business issues. If at some point you put things back on an equilibrium, rejoin us. Do not expect or enjoin us in your business issues or make us party to your problems until such time as you can represent yourself as a professional who will not embarrass our community.

Those are my two cents. Heed my advice as I've offered it or ignore it. I'm not here to pick a fight, only trying to help.

I second this right here.

[cj1026]

No, I'm not going to chase stuff on another forum. I'm quite positive that all the stuff posted there isn't accurate. I took a look early on, and it was just a dog-pile.

Let's stay on topic.

I'm also quite sure that posts containing only accurate information will not be deleted. If you can't trust the forum owner and staff, well......... just say so. I trust them.

Ok I will. I don't trust them.

[paul0660]

it was just a dog-pile.

It still is. Not much of value but the best BC pics.

[cadillacmike]

I don't understand why you quoted me. Please read and understand - I don't think a discussion of the sweepstakes/GeoVario/etc belongs in this thread about GPal. If there is any issue there, clear it up separately.

That is what I said. If you want to discuss those other things, please start a separate thread.

The reason why it surfaced is a post from Geovario's self named owned mentionging Mr Cannon in the earlier sweepstakes, and the details conteined in his own post.

There remains simple fact that the common denominator in all of this is Mr Ben Cannon. That's why people have brought it to this thread.

I for one do not think a separate thread would last 48 hours from being started.

[eaglemike]

The reason why it surfaced is a post from Geovario's self named owned mentionging Mr Cannon in the earlier sweepstakes, and the details conteined in his own post.

There remains simple fact that the common denominator in all of this is Mr Ben Cannon. That's why people have brought it to this thread.

I for one do not think a separate thread would last 48 hours from being started.

If people could keep a discussion civil and accurate, I'm pretty sure it would last. The problem is people keep growing the story, making stuff up, skewing instead of staying civil and accurate.

There's a few people here that I would buy out their contributions to the sweepstakes if they would shut up and go away. IMO they wouldn't be saying jack if they had won the prize, which makes them sore losers.

[fredieusa]

Hey 10%. I have read a lot of your posts and I know you have done far more that many for CA RKBA. In short , without meeting you, I like you. My post below is not personally directed at you but more towards all people "around" Ben, who are letting this happen.

I dont think GPal is going to up and fly overnight. This Gpal thing has (had !!?!) the potential to rival PayPal, so why will GPal scam crumbs now when shortly they will (would have..) be/been making lots more and all legit? So the theory that all this is happening intentionally is flawed to me.

I believe it is some sort of flap that is causing this which (at this point) is likely out of GPal's control. Now blaming GPal for not having the sight to foresee this blunder is something GPal is squarely responsible for.

Now somethings beyond GPal's control have affected the company. Unfortunately GPal didn't handle it as well as they should have and they still aren't coming right out and informing their customers what is going on. We have been in discussions with Ben about this.

How come Ben's friends do not have the foresight to slap some sense into him? All this big fiasco is the result of not communicating. Give people the details, right down to the nuts, bolts and washers and this drama would not have gone to this level.

Since Ben's friends are now personally being tarred, what is preventing ben from coming out and stating some facts. Some times it just helps to be there so people can use you as a punching bag and that alone keeps the drama low. Ben's not around!

Ideally Ben should have cut and past transactions details of hitches in response to each customer that has an issue pending. Like nuts and bolts.. i.e.

-date time transaction was processed and cleared/processed/forwarded by GPal, and any associated unique ID that people can refer to when contacting their bank
-names, addresses and contact for the bank/clearing house/institution where the transaction is held up-Unique ID or some thing that the person can refer to when contacting the bank where the transaction is stuck
-Anything concrete that will show that GPal did what they are supposed to and on time.

Lack of details and information, in addition to the lack of presence/communication (even if it means being there so folks can use you as a punching bag) created situations like the one we are facing now. Mind you its just not the mods but anyone associated with Calguns or anyone who calls CGN their home is tarnished (that is how they feel anyway).

Now here are some questions..

- Is Ben understaffed, seen so much explosive growth that he is a month behind processing transaction? What is the holdup? As you have stated that you have been in discussions, i am sure you know what the root cause of all this drama is. Now if you declare that you are not at liberty to discuss, you will only add air to the fire and give further the cause to the people you and many others suspect have personal issues with Ben and are behind this.

For Pete's sake tell Ben to take notes from British Petroleum.

I suppose I could yell at Ben Cannon everyday. That I am sure is a real effective way to get things done. I am sure it motivates you to fix things beyond your control when you are yelled at everyday. That sounds real constructive.

Are you suggesting that he is loosing motivation?

No need to yell BTW, just have him communicate. Have him state the facts, that is all.

At this point it doesn't matter what anyone says. Until people get their money, they aren't going to believe anything anyway. As is evident in this thread, people will make up rumors and jump to conclusions no matter what anyone says. I suppose it is human nature.

You are underestimating the power and effect of communication. Or are you suggesting people are not capable of understanding?

Yes, there maybe/are folks out there that find him too greasy / that have personal issues and will go above and beyond to harm Ben, however that is no excuse for him to loose common sense and lock himself up in a room, giving the appearance he is about to elope.. lol

No wonder the guys is in such a hole, if this is the advice he is getting.

I might. I might not. It really doesn't matter what I say here as I could lie and say I would or I could lie and say I wouldn't. In the end what I say doesn't matter. Either people get their money or they don't (I am still waiting on my money as well).

You are underestimating people again. regardless of what "spin" others may put on it, it is important that there is communication.

And that really is probably the largest problem here. Transparency. Many of these issues could have been avoided had transparency been used. I unfortunately don't have an answer why it wasn't used. Only Ben can answer to that.

Again, so what is preventing him to come on out? You do communicate with him, tell him to start making some posts. Let folks vent and they will feel better.

Someday this GPal fiasco will end. Either GPal will pull through this and good things will come of it or they will fail and we will move on.

However, Calguns.net will survive, the Calguns Foundation will keep winning cases, and we all will keep talking about guns online. As much as some people want anyone and everything related to GPal to die, it isn't going to happen. And it shouldn't be anyone's desire either. The huge amount of victories and knowledge we share on here is much more important than our financial losses at GPal.

I am afraid you are wrong. We will gain a reputation that will stick. Sure, we may remain large but this will cost us at some level or another.

Moments like these distinguish men with character from the rest. One must strive to do the right thing.

Lastly, I think it was prudent thinking of folks that have not come out and stuck their necks out.

[Vin496]

If people could keep a discussion civil and accurate, I'm pretty sure it would last. The problem is people keep growing the story, making stuff up, skewing instead of staying civil and accurate.

There's a few people here that I would buy out their contributions to the sweepstakes if they would shut up and go away. IMO they wouldn't be saying jack if they had won the prize, which makes them sore losers.

The conversations are civil, they only go south when they start getting edited, or when someone starts up accusing the people talking about this as just dog piling and having an agenda.

Your clearly not following what is being said on other forums as you stated, but let me tell you some things have started to come out, that are not rumors.

The gentleman who owns Geovario has stated that Ben left in November/December of 09. That means the last sweepstakes was run for no reason that would benefit CG. Even the owner of GeoVario has stated he may have been duped and needs to talk with Ben concerning this.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1018909&postcount=2003

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1019197&postcount=2063

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1019276&postcount=2078

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238590

No where in this CG thread above was it ever mentioned that Ben was no longer with GeoVario, that the proceeds from this will be purely for him. Whether to pay off old debts or to fund his lifestyle(who knows). One thing for sure though is that the proceeds were not used to buy equipment to help CG, like it was stated it would be used for. Not to mention the fact that when he was asked to account for the money, he could never get that info, because it was too difficult to figure out.

I know your just going to say I'm a sore loser, but that's not the case. I bought 1 $10 ticket a long time ago for the Barret. I don't care I didn't win. What I care about is that we were asked to give money on the presumption that it would be used for CG, and as time goes by, it's starting to look more and more, like that may not be the case.

[eaglemike]

The conversations are civil, they only go south when they start getting edited, or when someone starts up accusing the people talking about this as just dog piling and having an agenda.

Your clearly not following what is being said on other forums as you stated, but let me tell you some things have started to come out, that are not rumors.

The gentleman who owns Geovario has stated that Ben left in November/December of 09. That means the last sweepstakes was run for no reason that would benefit CG. Even the owner of GeoVario has stated he may have been duped and needs to talk with Ben concerning this.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1018909&postcount=2003

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1019197&postcount=2063

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showpost.php?p=1019276&postcount=2078

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=238590

No where in this CG thread above was it ever mentioned that Ben was no longer with GeoVario, that the proceeds from this will be purely for him. Whether to pay off old debts or to fund his lifestyle(who knows). One thing for sure though is that the proceeds were not used to buy equipment to help CG, like it was stated it would be used for. Not to mention the fact that when he was asked to account for the money, he could never get that info, because it was too difficult to figure out.

I know your just going to say I'm a sore loser, but that's not the case. I bought 1 $10 ticket a long time ago for the Barret. I don't care I didn't win. What I care about is that we were asked to give money on the presumption that it would be used for CG, and as time goes by, it's starting to look more and more, like that may not be the case.

You don't know where the money went, correct? Why don't you just ask the parties involved, instead of speculating??????

IIRC the Barrett sweepstakes was loooong before Ben left GeoVario. Did you get your $10 worth from being on the forum, knowing you contributed to the forum?

[tacticalcity]

An objective question: What percentage of the Gpal transactions are having issues?

I ask because there is a big difference between, lets say half the transactions having issues, versus 1% of the transactions having issues.

Every single withdrawal I made since June was late. I would complain about them in batches to support (and it would take a number of weeks to reach someone in support). I would be forced to wait for the first withdrawal to reach the point of being more than 7 days late, meanwhile I am starting more withdrawals as the money comes in from my business, and by the time I actually reach somebody to discuss my matter I have at least 3-4 that are more than 7 days late so I get them to work on them all at once. So for example, the first in the batch would take 21 days, the next 20, the next 14 and so on. By the time the money from the first batch would make it into my account, I would have another batch of late withdrawals I needed addressed. The process would continue again and again until I finally I had no choice but to stop doing business with them.

According to the support rep I spoke with last, his name was George, after the initial ACH bank problems and they switched banks the withdrawal process went from being automatic code to a manual process in which a human being on there end needs to handle each withdrawal and push some buttons on form. This was supposed to have been fixed "any day" several months ago. It hasn't been. Until it is, this mess is going to continue. It needs to become an automated process where the customer clicks the button and the software handles the withdrawal from there on. Gpal simply does not have enough man power to review the transactions and manually process them.

So based on my experience, and conversations I have had with others and with the Gpal support staff. I would say it is safe to assume 100% of the withdrawals are having this issue.

Now, I want to stress I do not know the above to be true for sure. I've heard a lot of things from the Gpal support guys I don't entirely trust. But it makes sense to me, given the end result. So I'm giving George the benefit of the doubt that he is accurately describing the problem despite Gpal not meeting his promised deadline of when it would be solved.

I am not trying to add to the rumors and FUD. I'm simply trying to make sense of it all.

No money is being stolen. You will eventually get your withdrawal. Which to somebody not experiencing the problem might think is a minor thing. However, it ends up becoming a very huge deal. There is a ripple effect.

In my case I believed Ben Cannon when he told me back in June the problem would be fixed "any day now" and it was a one time problem. When it happened for the second time I gave him the benefit of the doubt. Suddenly I'm in serious trouble, because the money he promised a month ago would be in my account in any day is not.

Mean while I've maxed out my personal credit in order to fill orders that missing money was meant for, eating bargain cereal and PB&J for every meal, and struggling to figure out how I am going to come up with the Gas money to visit my 91 year old grandfather who broke his hip right in the middle of all of this and is in the hospital.

During all of this my customers never felt the pinch. I filled their orders immediately, even if meant doing damage to my own credit by skipping car payments and other bills. I had to rob Peter to pay Paul big time.

So something like late withdrawals, that sounds really minor at first, can completely through a person's life into chaos.

Running a small business, in this economy is hard enough. Gpals late withdrawals which was compounded by empty promises from Ben Cannon and his support staff, but me in a really bad financial and personal situation. They seriously screwed me over.

The miss information being the biggest problem, as if not for that I and others could have planned accordingly and avoided the entire mess. If they had simply been upfront about how long it was going to take them to make the process automated again, and how long we could expect delays, we could have made other TEMPORARY arrangements while they sorted it out, and kept us as loyal customers. We understood they were a new company, and were doing business with them on moral grounds more than anything else. So if they had said they need some time to sort their issues out and shut down temporarily, we would have been there for them once everything was fixed and they were back up. This would have given them time to fix the code, and offer support for the comparatively small number of late withdrawals compared to the massive number they have now. This would have preserved their good reputation, and not overwhelmed their support staff. By misleading us, they burned a ton of bridges and completely ruined their own reputation and soiled Calguns' reputation by association. It is all very sad, even more so since it is an ongoing problem and Gpal is still not being upfront about the nature of the problem or when it will be solved. They are taking on new customers when they already know they are unable to service the ones they have. It just makes no sense at all. Everyday this continues they dig themselves into a deeper hole, and in a very real way drag Calguns into that hole with them.