Officer Safety & CGN?

[Uriah02]

Am I the only one seeing the irony that LEOs on the boards don't want to be associated with CGN due to a small minority fringe offenders on these boards, kind of the same way how LEOs don't want to grouped into the same category as rogue, overbearing, abusive LEOs who also exist in a very minority population?
As a Iraq war vet I hate to be grouped into the same category as the small group of soliders who murdered civilians in the war, there are bad apples in every group, we can't let a few sour the whole bunch.

[TRICKSTER]

Am I the only one seeing the irony that LEOs on the boards don't want to be associated with CGN due to a small minority fringe offenders on these boards, kind of the same way how LEOs don't want to grouped into the same category as rogue, overbearing, abusive LEOs who also exist in a very minority population?
As a Iraq war vet I hate to be grouped into the same category as the small group of soliders who murdered civilians in the war, there are bad apples in every group, we can't let a few sour the whole bunch.

I don't think you see the safety issues involved for LEO's. It's not just "being associated" with CGN that is the problem.

[themailman]

I don't think you see the safety issues involved for LEO's. It's not just "being associated" with CGN that is the problem.

Us VS Them continuation...

Care to elaborate?

[geeknow]

^^^ I dont get it. What safety issues are you referring to?

[Ron-Solo]

Us VS Them continuation...

Care to elaborate?

It is about being targeted specifically because of your profession. The job draws the ire of the few, sometimes to the point of being physically dangerous. I have had my life threatened many times, some more credible than others, and also the lives of my family have been threatened.

When you come into a forum and a group of the members are constantly on the attack because of what you do, it is natural to group together with fellow LE for the comradeship and protection, hence the "us" part of the equation. We can't control the "them" part of the situation.

There is safety in numbers.

It has nothing to do with looking down upon people or not wanting to interact outside of the group. It is about staying in your comfort zone.

[themailman]

It is about being targeted specifically because of your profession. The job draws the ire of the few, sometimes to the point of being physically dangerous. I have had my life threatened many times, some more credible than others, and also the lives of my family have been threatened.

When you come into a forum and a group of the members are constantly on the attack because of what you do, it is natural to group together with fellow LE for the comradeship and protection, hence the "us" part of the equation. We can't control the "them" part of the situation.

There is safety in numbers.

It has nothing to do with looking down upon people or not wanting to interact outside of the group. It is about staying in your comfort zone.

Ron, have you had a serious threat come from CGN?

[Ron-Solo]

Ron, have you had a serious threat come from CGN?

I have had a member put up a photo of a headstone with my name on it when he didn't like the response given. I have been insulted more times than I can count by fellow members, and have experienced hostile comments many times.

Serious threat against my safety, not really. Made uncomfortable, yes. I dealt with those kinds of individuals for 32+ years. I don't intimidate easily, nor do I suffer fools easily.

Good question by the way.

Aloha,

Ron

[geeknow]

OK, I understand better now. Thanks. It's really not all that different from being an ffl here, then. I guess we have something in common there...

[rag9393]

Ron, have you had a serious threat come from CGN?

Don't you read some of the comments made by some members? Condoning the death of an officer for pointing a taser at a dog? Not a specific threat but a backhanded slap that has the potential to be taken as a veiled threat because of what someone does for a living. Some people are just ***holes.

Oh and btw, I'm not a full time cop yet but a reserve who has had the same basic academy as the regulars.

[oaklander]

Yes, I remember that event. The person is a friend, and I think that part of what happens is that folks get together and "kibbutz" about things that bother them. I am glad I was there to help intercept things. . .

I do not see any disconnect with LE and CGN, or with the gun rights movement in general. While there are certainly "irrational" people on both sides of the issue, the VAST MAJORITY of everyone sees things exactly how they are:

There are a FEW doofus Calgunners, and a FEW LE folks who should maybe have picked a "different line of work." I think we can all agree on that. . .

The problem is that those two "fringes" often come into contact with each other. Those two small subgroups make ALL OF US LOOK BAD. . .

It again goes back to my main point that I have been saying for the last several months now - "NEVER BE THE CRAZIEST PERSON IN THE ROOM."

Before about three/four years ago (right around the formation of CGF), the CA gun rights movement was characterized by extreme "stridency." The pro gun folks were angry, and were just doing random angry things (shouting at City Council Members, sending mad emails to politicians, and things like that). I know this because I was one of them!!!

I started to realize that we are all reasonable people here, even most of the anti-gun folks. So I started to change, and I asked other people to change.

Now we have some nice harmony, and the TRUTH is that we are getting a lot more done by forming coalitions, and be being "nice" than we ever got done by being mean and angry. This is not to say that we don't have a big legal steamroller when we need it. But we are needing it less and less, as politicians and decision-makers realize that the easiest thing to do is just to listen to us.

If folks do not believe me, just look at Pleasant Hill, and Sunnyvale. Both "towns" realized that it would be a large political mistake, given the new playing field here, to do ANYTHING ANTI-GUN. We could not have pulled this off, even 12 months ago. . .

This is because we now hold political power. We will lose that power if we get the reputation of being irrational, or angry, or not connected to reality. . .

I implore everyone to tone down rhetoric, and to listen to folks. Listen to their concerns, and look for common ground. We all have common ground, we just don't see it sometimes. . .

I've gone to 2 events up north here and for the most part they were positive. I was on guard then and on guard now. The first one could have gone south had not Oaklander said something and I attempted to make a joke afterwards. The wording was something along the lines of "except for LEO's doing ...." I forgot what the exact words used were. The intent, the way I took it, was clearly going to be his displeasure at how LEO's or some LEo's conduct their business.

Either way, do what you guys are going to do, just be aware of your surroundings like always.

[TRICKSTER]

Us VS Them continuation...

Care to elaborate?

Have you ever had anyone threaten to kill you, your wife or children because of your occupation? I have on several occasions.
Have you ever had your boss call you at home and tell you that some inmates were heard discussing a hit on you and your work partner so to watch your back?

These people posting on CALGUNS are anonymous, If I were to work an event, I would have no idea if they were related to someone that I arrested, or just some nut who hates LEO's and wants to do them harm in some manner. I'm sorry but there are some members here that I would never give my name or identifying info to because they are plain nutters. I am not talking about the members here that disagree with certain laws. I am talking about those who endorse the killing of LEOs such as in the thread that I originally posted about, or those that support turning over Boarder Patrol agents accused of roughing up a couple of drug smugglers to the drug cartels for "punishment".
So yes, if you want to call keeping myself and my family safe "Us VS Them" then I guess it is, but I am willing to bet that you do not work in an occupation where you have to worry about you or your family being targeted by "them" .

[Ron-Solo]

Rag9393,

I don't think mailman was being snarky with his question. It was posed in a manner that was civil and relevant to the thread (at least the way I took it)

I answered to the best of my ability about things directed specifically at me.

(I had a member jerk me around on a gun sale in the private sector sales forum specifically because he knew I was a cop. I drove 45 minutes to complete the sale and he no showed, but left me a couple of pm's asking if I enjoyed the drive and how cool it was that I wasn't able to sell the gun. It was handled very well by a couple of the mods.)

[KaTooM]

I am not a Leo,

Reading this thread bums me out. People condoning Cop killing, Cops on the offensive against the Calguns community, human nature seems to feed on the us vs them mantality.

I have called 911 two times in my life, the last one was this year. I broke all the protocals and invited them in. Half a dozen sheriffs in my living room and they clearly new who I was.

They were very profesional and did not over step there bounds. They did there job and thanked me for letting them in to clear my house and back yard.

The real problem in this world is organized crime...

[Falconis]

Hey Oak, I think it's the constant rhetoric displayed by the other side combined with the fact there appears to be indifference at the moderator level due to the constant barrage. I am sure you most of all understand people are here of their own free will and time. Asking people, especially LE members, to either donate time and or money borders on ridiculous when the attacks are as atrocious as the ones described in the now deleted thread or people constantly go off on irrational tirades. Today is a bad day for me so even the people playing stupid here are kind of getting on my nerves.

To top it off, to ask us to invite people we know here knowing all this occurs is almost unfathomable to me. I really do not want to be judged by the company kept here. I am talking about the few that really have nothing positive to contribute.

Asking us to find common ground with some of the nutbags here is almost insulting. Considering the thread being discussed especially. There is no way in hell I will find common ground with an ******* that advocates or rationalizes a cop getting killed while performing his or her duties. That's just ****ed up.

I think you can agree I atleast try to see the rational basis behind some arguments and discussions. But sometimes, with THAT vocal minority, there just isn't anything to really talk about. That in a nutshell I think will continue CGN's reputation and prevent positive growth. The silence from the mods and sometimes the active participation (only going off of other's posts) doesn't help matters either. I do realize people get put on time out, or just outright banned, but no one seems to know about those cases or rarely knows about them and it doesn't seem to put a dent in the stride of those who wish to just spout off without consequence.

A good example of that is the pullnshoot25 who was given 8 chances. Not only was he given 8 chances ( I don't know what he did), you had other people wanting to give him another to burn another bridge. I think that level of immaturity also does this site's rep harm.

[2shotjoe]

Here are some quotes in response to the news article where the posters tried to justify the killing of the officer. You decide if "maybe it just comes out a bit wrong, or is completely misunderstood and taken as anti-LEO advocacy or something of the sort."

"Responding to a verbal disturbance, well first they need to MYOB, Entering private property without a warrant and being ordered to kill the dog is bad. Its justified to protect your family and property from anyone killing to kill and destroy. If he has illegal possession of a firearm, he should be charged with that.

Did he in fact give a warning? I don't know if it did happen or just him making it up. If yes, then it is justified if the person did not stop. Right now it just looks like they were storming his place and kill whatever is in their way.

My opinion may be harsh, but everyone needs to MYOB. Nanny state laws need to go away."


Another poster wrote..

"First of all guys the officer was trespassing and was told as much by the owner."

He then went on to write.

"If one of your neighbors jumped over your wall and started threatening to kill one of your dogs assuming you love them you would be justified in stopping them. Unfortunately in this situation the officer felt his badge was more important than the gentleman's rights and love for his dogs and failed to realize he needed to remove himself from that situation instead of getting himself in deeper."

Funny that I am used as an example, not sure to respond on my stance but I am not anti-LEO, and did not take the druggie side after I got some facts. I can see it on both sides but I never received responses to fill in that knowledge gaps. The unknowning is more dangerous since there is lack of knowledge to have a full understanding if it was performed to his training and procedures.

Those questions are still unanswered but I sided with the LEO since he went for a none lethal force. I think that was the first anti-leo thread I responded too.

I don't have a record, no tickets and have a few family members as LEO.

Seeing some statistics would be helpful to downplay some questionable topics. I'd like to see more PRO-LEO threads since they are not mentioned much.

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