CA DROS Delay

[ruination]

[WingDings]

PPT in Cerritos today. Asked the guy behind the counter what percentage (on average) were coming back as “delayed”.

Said “about 20%” at his location.

Insane.

[Dc2 r guy]

I'm going through the same issue right now.
Did 2 separate private party transfers

8/5/22 - Dros
8/11/22 got the call from turners.
waiting on my letter from the DOJ


8/7/22 - Dros
8/15/22 - Got the call from ammo bros.
waiting on my letter from the DOJ

No update yet but I did purchase another firearm this time at Gun Effects

8/18 Dros
Picked up 8/28

[LMan57]

Well, today makes 30 days since I submitted my Live Scan to the DOJ I checked, and all it says is In Progress. I called the other day and they told me they are running about 90 days before they complete the background checks and that they are swamped with the requests. Gee, I wonder why

[SkyHawk]

Not trying to hijack thread. I moved to AZ almost three years ago and still being delayed on almost everyone of my purchases. I never get cleared right away anymore. Don’t know if this has to do with this newer administration or not. Last time I cleared immediately was two years ago. Just went in to get a Sig macro 365 and delayed again. 4th purchase in 5 months. Everyone delayed. So yesterday when delayed I decided to call about it. Was told if I have ever been arrested/ not convicted ! Arrested that I will be delayed. I asked why, since they always clear me by day three and it’s obvious I have don’t have anything that prohibits me on my record. Was told it did not matter , that anyone who’s been arrested will be delayed. Does not matter how long ago or for what. Is this something new? Crazy how they are in my opinion making up things as they go a long. Also was told to do a VPI number. May have acronym wrong. Was told it’s where I release them to have open access to my past and they keep it on file. Even though I don’t have a record.

You need to get a VAF (voluntary appeal file) at NICS and they will assign you a UPIN which you will write down in the UPIN field on every 4473 you do, which the FFL will transmit with your background check request, which will clear up any delays - usually instantly.

https://www.fbi.gov/services/cjis/nics/national-instant-criminal-background-check-system-nics-appeals-vaf

I Have Been Denied a Firearm Multiple Times or Experience Delays – What Should I Do?
Voluntary Appeal File (VAF)

Anyone may apply for the VAF, but it is designed for firearm purchasers who believe they are legally allowed to buy firearms, but they have been denied more than once or frequently experience delays in their transactions. Purchasers sometimes find themselves experiencing delays or denials in firearms purchases because of a past misdemeanor charge or because an ineligible person has a similar name.

When you apply for the VAF, FBI personnel will research your case and assign you a Unique Personal Identification Number (UPIN) if you have no firearms prohibitions. For future firearms transactions, you will provide your UPIN for your background check. You will still have to undergo a complete background check to buy a firearm, but the UPIN will help to confirm your identity.

The VAF process can take several months.

You may also apply for the VAF at the same time you submit a firearm-related challenge.

[LMan57]

You need to get a VAF (voluntary appeal file) at NICS and they will assign you a UPIN which you will write down in the UPIN field on every 4473 you do, which the FFL will transmit with your background check request, which will clear up any delays - usually instantly.

https://www.fbi.gov/services/cjis/ni...cs-appeals-vaf

Thanks, I will do that do I still have to wait for my Live Scan to clear?

[mrdd]

You need to get a VAF (voluntary appeal file) at NICS and they will assign you a UPIN which you will write down in the UPIN field on every 4473 you do, which the FFL will transmit with your background check request, which will clear up any delays - usually instantly.

https://www.fbi.gov/services/cjis/ni...cs-appeals-vaf

Thanks, I will do that do I still have to wait for my Live Scan to clear?

That probably does not apply in California, he was answering somebody in Arizona. In California, the CADOJ is the POC for the NICS checks. I don't recall whether the DROS form has a place for a UPIN.

[LMan57]

That probably does not apply in California, he was answering somebody in Arizona. In California, the CADOJ is the POC for the NICS checks. I don't recall whether the DROS form has a place for a UPIN.

Oh, thanks I did not notice that.

[JEM72]

So, who here has been delayed the the longest?… I bought 9 guns that were on consignment. 8 handguns and 1 long gun all on one DROS. Today is day 59. 32 years of buying, selling and trading, never a problem until now….I’m also a ccw holder and a Federal employee…wtf?…

[66nick]

So, who here has been delayed the the longest?… I bought 9 guns that were on consignment. 8 handguns and 1 long gun all on one DROS. Today is day 59. 32 years of buying, selling and trading, never a problem until now….I’m also a ccw holder and a Federal employee…wtf?…

From my understanding of the law, you're only *supposed* to be delayed for 20, 24-hour periods (days) plus the original 10, 24-hour periods (days) wait. After 30, 24-hour periods (days) you become undetermined and the FFL either follows CA Penal Code 29220 (f)(4) and releases, or they (as a business) choose to not release on undetermined.


https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...ctionNum=28220.
CA Penal Code 29220 (f)(4) states:

If the department is unable to ascertain the final disposition of the arrest or criminal charge, or the outcome of the mental health treatment or evaluation, or the purchaser’s eligibility to purchase a firearm, as described in paragraph (1), within 30 days of the dealer’s original submission of purchaser information to the department pursuant to this section, the department shall immediately notify the dealer and the dealer may then immediately transfer the firearm to the purchaser, upon the dealer’s recording on the register or record of electronic transfer the date that the firearm is transferred, the dealer signing the register or record of electronic transfer indicating delivery of the firearm to that purchaser, and the purchaser signing the register or record of electronic transfer acknowledging the receipt of the firearm on the date that the firearm is delivered to the purchaser.

[JEM72]

[Preston-CLB]

I am not a lawyer, so I have a bit of curiosity regarding the word may in this statement from the penal code:

...the dealer may then immediately transfer the firearm to the purchaser...

"May" implies that the FFL has the choice whether or not to release on 'undetermined', as opposed to "shall" (if that word was used instead of "may") which means the FFL would be breaking the law if they chose not to release on 'undetermined'.

For you legal eagles, am I correct in my assumption here?
-P

[The Gleam]

I am not a lawyer, so I have a bit of curiosity regarding the word may in this statement from the penal code:



"May" implies that the FFL has the choice whether or not to release on 'undetermined', as opposed to "shall" (if that word was used instead of "may") which means the FFL would be breaking the law if they chose not to release on 'undetermined'.

For you legal eagles, am I correct in my assumption here?
-P

Discussed at length numerous time in various threads and somewhere in this one too - now going in circles.

Consensus is that they must release on undetermined, especially if the NICs approval is received, which in most cases of delay/undetermined, it is.

--

[LMan57]

It needs to be changed to shall and they would have to release it on undetermined correct?

[66nick]

From my legal experience/background (not a lawyer, different type of background)

• May gives someone the option to do it. It means they can, if they want to, at their own discretion.
• Shall means they MUST perform that action.

In this case (again from my legal understanding) the FFL CAN release it, they have permission to do so. They are not required by law to do so. They may have their own insurance/company policies that prevent it. This is why/how some of the FFLs out there do not release on undetermined. They are within their right to do so, but I (and likely many others) are making the choice to not shop at those places.