List of FFLs who will release upon receipt of an "Undetermined" from a CA DROS.

[66nick]

Most recent update to the CA_Undetermined_Friendly_FFL sheet: 11-02-2022, 9:22 AM


Hi all,

For those of us following along in the CA DROS Delay thread, as well as anyone who wants to contribute to the creation of a comprehensive list of FFL/LGS that WILL release firearms when a DROS is delayed and subsequently comes back as "Undetermined" instead of refusing to release the firearm, I am starting this thread (and will be using it to update the linked CA_Undetermined_Friendly_FFL spreadsheet.

You can also help me out by providing the information directly here: CA Undetermined Friendly FFL Submission Form


Please continue to provide FFLs that release firearms on "Undetermined" status. Either in the thread here, or via the submission form above. Hopefully everyone can comment on this thread with as much info/as many FFLs as they know will release on "Undetermined" so we can make sure to know about these DROS friendly FFLs.

Thanks!


__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________

For a bit of easy reading/context: https://www.ffltransfersanjose.com/dros-delays/

For some heavier reading -
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...ctionNum=28220.
CA Penal Code 28220 (f)(4) states:

If the department is unable to ascertain the final disposition of the arrest or criminal charge, or the outcome of the mental health treatment or evaluation, or the purchaser’s eligibility to purchase a firearm, as described in paragraph (1), within 30 days of the dealer’s original submission of purchaser information to the department pursuant to this section, the department shall immediately notify the dealer and the dealer may then immediately transfer the firearm to the purchaser, upon the dealer’s recording on the register or record of electronic transfer the date that the firearm is transferred, the dealer signing the register or record of electronic transfer indicating delivery of the firearm to that purchaser, and the purchaser signing the register or record of electronic transfer acknowledging the receipt of the firearm on the date that the firearm is delivered to the purchaser.

[Creative300]

there are at least four I know of in Socal who will release, as of calling them this month. but one of those will make you do a livescan first, which will cost you more time and money.

keep in mind store policies on releasing may change at anytime so always ask just before you buy.

[pacrat]

Originally Posted by Creative300

there are at least four I know of in Socal who will release, as of calling them this month. but one of those will make you do a livescan first, which will cost you more time and money.

keep in mind store policies on releasing may change at anytime so always ask just before you buy.

>>>bolded<<< DROS is only good for 30 days. So that requirement would automatically require a SECOND DROS. A turd for sure.

>>>underlined<<< I concur, yet having a GOOD GUY list is a great starting point. I prefer the "NOT A TURD LIST".

Just cause I'm me.

[pacrat]

UGimports in Fremont, is solid. https://www.ugimports.com/blog/ Who can resist a Garden Gnome with an AR.


As is 2Azone in Upland. https://www.2azone.com/

[nickel plate]

Best Jewelry and loan in Visalia, happened to me twice. Call ahead to confirm that's still their practice.

[kenl]

Stockton Gun Exchange, Stockton
Foothill Firearms in Jackson

[benjamin101677]

Jim’s trading post in Fresno, Ca

[ar15barrels]

PD Gun Supply & Tool
2053 Glenoaks Blvd
San Fernando, CA 91340
Hours: 12noon to 6pm Tuesday Through Saturday
Phone: (818) 322-4585

[enorbit3]

Rifle gear

[66nick]

Thanks all! We have a starting point now! Spread the word and bring more good guy vendors!

Or as pacrat said, non-turds lol

[robledor]

Ammo bros in miramar and shoot so cal

[66nick]

Added them too, thanks!

[66nick]

Created a submission form so folks can submit FFLs. It will still be reviewed by me before adding onto the visible information (just to prevent anyone from posting something silly)

CA Undetermined Friendly FFL Submission Form

[smokycuh]

Keller arms in monrovia
FF firearms in montebello

By the way hope this thread stays open!
Last time mods shut mine down when i created similar thread


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Creative300]

Ade's Gun Shop

Rifle Supply HB

[66nick]

Sheet updated with the newest four. Thanks!

Originally Posted by smokycuh

Keller arms in monrovia
FF firearms in montebello

By the way hope this thread stays open!
Last time mods shut mine down when i created similar thread


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I like FF, I've bought a few things from them. Glad to learn they're on this good guy list.

I hope it stays open too, but share/bookmark the links for the sheet and the submission form. If the thread does get locked, we still have those and can still operate/add/etc.

[alrod1]

Lambert Pawn
14158 Lambert Rd, Whittier, CA 90605
and
Insight Shooting Range
17020 Alburtis Avenue
Artesia, CA 90701
Are Good 2 Go

[66nick]

Got them both, thanks!

[Kings4sap]

Originally Posted by enorbit3

Rifle gear

^^^^^The absolute best. My Go To!

[Sig79]

Camarillo gun store and 2A zone

[slixx1320]

Rifle Supply

[1bulletBarney]

Originally Posted by kenl

Stockton Gun Exchange, Stockton
Foothill Firearms in Jackson

They (Stockton Gun Exchange) processed a PPT for me about a year ago. Good folks there...

[66nick]

Originally Posted by Sig79

Camarillo gun store and 2A zone

Originally Posted by slixx1320

Rifle Supply

Both on there from previous notations, but thank you!

[dangyi]

KW Defense in Stockton
Solar Tactical in Livermore
Mike's Tactical in Tracy

[dirtyJ]

I wonder how the new law regarding suing "firearms industry professionals" for bs will affect this. Anyone have any ideas or hear of something from Chuck Michel yet?

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by dirtyJ

I wonder how the new law regarding suing "firearms industry professionals" for bs will affect this.

I wonder how that new law is going to fare against the federal Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act of 2005.

[66nick]

Originally Posted by dangyi

KW Defense in Stockton
Solar Tactical in Livermore
Mike's Tactical in Tracy

Added, and re-sorted the sheet alphabetically.

Hopefully soon I'll have to create another option to sort by county!

[pacrat]

Originally Posted by ar15barrels

I wonder how that new law is going to fare against the federal Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act of 2005.

According to, Article VI, Paragraph 2 of the U.S. Constitution is commonly referred to as the Supremacy Clause.

Not well at all. It is just more money wasting petulant post puberty children, publicly pouting and stamping their feet. To show their voting base that "THEY TRIED TO DO SOMETHING". But those radical right wing, racist NRA puppets of the gun industry wouldn't let them.

I notice none of them ever honestly mention the US Constitution, and its many provisions. Unless they pick out a single sentence. Intentionally paraphrase it out of context. Then claim the Republicans are trying to overturn it.

[Creative300]

Originally Posted by robledor

Ammo bros in miramar and shoot so cal

Do all their locations release or just the San Diego/Miramar store?

[edgerly779]

Call and ask if any ffl releases.

[Creative300]

Originally Posted by edgerly779

Call and ask if any ffl releases.

Called Ammo Bros in Cerritos twice to ask if they release on undetermined.

Got two totally different answers. The lady I talked to first said they don't. A couple weeks later called the same store a guy answered and said they do release. Both from the same store.
In case you're not aware Ammo Bros has several locations. Usually the chain stores don't release so I'm a bit surprised to see them on a list of FFLs that do.

But what has been people's recent real life experience with Ammo Bros?

[Creative300]

Finally picked up my carbine from Riflegear after 30 days delayed to undetermined. Just happy they released it!

[robledor]

I asked the employee at the miramar location and he said yes. As long as you don't look 5150

[joker440]

Just submitted form for Redding Guns LLC in Redding, CA.

[66nick]

Originally Posted by joker440

Just submitted form for Redding Guns LLC in Redding, CA.

Added them, thanks!

[pacrat]

Originally Posted by Creative300

Do all their locations release or just the San Diego/Miramar store?

Originally Posted by Creative300

Called Ammo Bros in Cerritos twice to ask if they release on undetermined.

Got two totally different answers. The lady I talked to first said they don't. A couple weeks later called the same store a guy answered and said they do release. Both from the same store.
In case you're not aware Ammo Bros has several locations. Usually the chain stores don't release so I'm a bit surprised to see them on a list of FFLs that do.

But what has been people's recent real life experience with Ammo Bros?

Sorry, not quite "recent" but did find this from 2016;

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...58472&u2=99739

bleedgreen89
11-14-2016 2:45 PMbleedgreen89
Hey there, how's it going? I had a question about how ammo bros handles undetermined background checks exceeding 30 days. Do you issue a refund, or do you just release the firearm? I had bad luck with Turners, and am still very interested in trying again elsewhere. I look forward to your response. Thanks.

SRedmon
Hi there,

Once a background check passes 30 days, the DOJ cancels it. After your 10 days wait, if you come back undetermined, we will release the firearm. If your status is delayed, you have 30 days from the time they change it to approved or undetermined.

Suggest you Email or PM this guy for current confirmation on "AMMO LIARS" storewide release policy., https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/member.php?u=99739

[Creative300]

I emailed Ammo Bros in Santa Ana a week ago here is their response:

..If we get an undetermined status we are able to potentially
release the firearm due to circumstances and we must have a letter
from the doj stating that its up to our discretion to release the firearm, but the doj has been taking a long time getting back to us so there could
be a high chance that we can't release the firearms.

Thank you,

Ammo Brothers Staff

From their response it appears as long as DOJ sends you the standard canned
delayed letter that says the FFL may release at their discretion you should be
good to go.

But in the second part of their email response they claim DOJ is taking
potentially longer than 30 days to send out the canned letter, if they send it
at all. Sounds pretty strange, never heard of that problem before until now.
How common is it to not receive any DOJ response at all?

I've been delayed twice with two different guns but always received the letter
well before 30 days.

Has anyone actually had their firearm released from Ammo Bros after 30
days?


Be careful if an FFL is saying they often don't received the delayed letter or
any other reply from the DOJ -- but no other FFL is having this problem it
could be Ammo Bros never actually submitted your DROS at all and just
pocketed your $40 DROS fee. Not saying that's the case here but anything is
possible.

[pacrat]

I emailed Ammo Bros in Santa Ana a week ago here is their response:

Quote:

..If we get an undetermined status we are able to potentially
release the firearm due to circumstances and we must have a letter
from the doj stating that its up to our discretion to release the firearm, but the doj has been taking a long time getting back to us so there could
be a high chance that we can't release the firearms.

Thank you,
Ammo Brothers LIARS Staff

I suggest you contact the AMMO LIARS representative here on CG that I gave the previous link for. https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/member.php?u=99739

He is spokesperson for AMMO LIARS on CG. And speaks for all their stores. If he confirms what the Santa Ana TURD said. THEN AMMO LIARS definitely does not deserve a listing on the "NOT A TURD LIST".

Because that sir is clearly a crock of crap double speak nonsense. So this TURD can read a letter from DOJ. That grants a NON EXISTANT DISCRETION. But he's to damn dumb to read Ca PC 28220 [4].

(4) If the department is unable to ascertain the final disposition of the arrest or criminal charge, or the outcome of the mental health treatment or evaluation, or the purchaser's eligibility to purchase a firearm, as described in paragraph (1), within 30 days of the dealer's original submission of purchaser information to the department pursuant to this section, the department shall immediately notify the dealer and the dealer may then immediately transfer the firearm to the purchaser,
upon the dealer's recording on the register or record of electronic transfer the date that the firearm is transferred, the dealer signing the register or record of electronic transfer indicating delivery of the firearm to that purchaser, and the purchaser signing the register or record of electronic transfer acknowledging the receipt of the firearm on the date that the firearm is delivered to him or her.

The letter from DOJ that the lazy TURD refers to includes the NICS BG check #. Does get sent by snail mail to them.

That catch is that. The original DOJ BG check is ONLY GOOD for 30 days. As is the NICS BG check. But since the NICS BG check is ran only AFTER DOJ contacts them to request it. It is usually good for about a week [give or take a few days] after the DROS goes "undetermined". Coupled with the slow sending of the snail mail to FFL. The NICS BG check #, is NO F'n GOOD. by the time the FFL gets it. PROBABLY BY DESIGN.

All the lazy TURD at "AMMO LIARS" has to do is wait until the DROS goes undetermined. Then using their EXCLUSIVE HOT LINE, call DOJ. Give them the DROS # and VERBALLY request the Fed NICS #.

Read this thread; https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...6#post27011816 Specifically post #'s 199 and 202 by "taperxz". He is a FFL who delivers on undetermined and explains it thoroughly from the FFL perspective..

[Ammo Brothers]

Originally Posted by pacrat

Quote:


I suggest you contact the AMMO LIARS representative here on CG that I gave the previous link for. https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/member.php?u=99739

He is spokesperson for AMMO LIARS on CG. And speaks for all their stores. If he confirms what the Santa Ana TURD said. THEN AMMO LIARS definitely does not deserve a listing on the "NOT A TURD LIST".

Because that sir is clearly a crock of crap double speak nonsense. So this TURD can read a letter from DOJ. That grants a NON EXISTANT DISCRETION. But he's to damn dumb to read Ca PC 28220 [4].



The letter from DOJ that the lazy TURD refers to includes the NICS BG check #. Does get sent by snail mail to them.

That catch is that. The original DOJ BG check is ONLY GOOD for 30 days. As is the NICS BG check. But since the NICS BG check is ran only AFTER DOJ contacts them to request it. It is usually good for about a week [give or take a few days] after the DROS goes "undetermined". Coupled with the slow sending of the snail mail to FFL. The NICS BG check #, is NO F'n GOOD. by the time the FFL gets it. PROBABLY BY DESIGN.

All the lazy TURD at "AMMO LIARS" has to do is wait until the DROS goes undetermined. Then using their EXCLUSIVE HOT LINE, call DOJ. Give them the DROS # and VERBALLY request the Fed NICS #.

Read this thread; https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...6#post27011816 Specifically post #'s 199 and 202 by "taperxz". He is a FFL who delivers on undetermined and explains it thoroughly from the FFL perspective..

We do release undetermined, provided we receive the letter from the DOJ in time with the NIC#.

[Ammo Brothers]

Originally Posted by pacrat

Quote:


I suggest you contact the AMMO LIARS representative here on CG that I gave the previous link for. https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/member.php?u=99739

He is spokesperson for AMMO LIARS on CG. And speaks for all their stores. If he confirms what the Santa Ana TURD said. THEN AMMO LIARS definitely does not deserve a listing on the "NOT A TURD LIST".

Because that sir is clearly a crock of crap double speak nonsense. So this TURD can read a letter from DOJ. That grants a NON EXISTANT DISCRETION. But he's to damn dumb to read Ca PC 28220 [4].



The letter from DOJ that the lazy TURD refers to includes the NICS BG check #. Does get sent by snail mail to them.

That catch is that. The original DOJ BG check is ONLY GOOD for 30 days. As is the NICS BG check. But since the NICS BG check is ran only AFTER DOJ contacts them to request it. It is usually good for about a week [give or take a few days] after the DROS goes "undetermined". Coupled with the slow sending of the snail mail to FFL. The NICS BG check #, is NO F'n GOOD. by the time the FFL gets it. PROBABLY BY DESIGN.

All the lazy TURD at "AMMO LIARS" has to do is wait until the DROS goes undetermined. Then using their EXCLUSIVE HOT LINE, call DOJ. Give them the DROS # and VERBALLY request the Fed NICS #.

Read this thread; https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...6#post27011816 Specifically post #'s 199 and 202 by "taperxz". He is a FFL who delivers on undetermined and explains it thoroughly from the FFL perspective..

This is 100% incorrect we just received a written write-up from the ATF(YES, THE ATF... WTH)for not having the physical letter from the DOJ during our last ATF audit.