Breaking Down The US Army’s Sub Compact Weapon Program

[Gryff]

Interesting, I rented a CZ Scorpion and thought it was a hot load of garbage.

Which is odd because I'm a CZ fanboy.

I was shocked by how much recoil impulse there was. I have the MPX, and I realized what jewel it was after firing the Scorpion.

[Quiet]

I was shocked by how much recoil impulse there was. I have the MPX, and I realized what jewel it was after firing the Scorpion.

Blowback (CZ Scorpion) vs gas-operated (SIG MPX).

[8886]

Everyone knows the best Scorpion is in .32

[mach]

Everyone knows the best Scorpion is in .32

[Steve1968LS2]

Redesigning the MP-7 for 9mm might not be worth their time for such a small contract.

I love my UMP.. maybe that's not small enough..

P90 was designed for this, but it's the wrong caliber.

Would seem that an MP5 variant would be perfect.. common parts and such

[walmart_ar15]

Why no love for the UZI machine pistol. 80's flash back, heavy, but compact.

[8886]

Why no love for the UZI machine pistol. 80's flash back, heavy, but compact.

Open bolt much?

[walmart_ar15]

Open bolt much?

Heard of UZI Pro?

[mach]

Heard of spray and pray? UZI would be a terrible choice. They simply have too much money to spend on a new pet project rather then use existing roller lock variants that already work great.

[walmart_ar15]

Heard of spray and pray? UZI would be a terrible choice. They simply have too much money to spend on a new pet project rather then use existing roller lock variants that already work great.

B&T MP9 ~ 1100 rpm
UZI Pro ~ 1050 rpm
PMX ~ 900 rpm
Scorpion ~ 1150 rpm
MP5K ~ 900 rpm
MPX ~ 850 rpm

Any compact sub gun is a bit of spray and pray. The smaller it gets, more praying involved. MP9 is the same size as UZI Pro.

Now if we are talking about the old Micro UZI w/o the weighted bolt, ~ 2200 rpm, that would be a whole different level of praying

[sigstroker]

Ironically, a good choice in 9mm might be the good old M11/9.



Under 500 rpm with tungsten bolt.



Too bad it would never be taken seriously.

[walmart_ar15]

Ironically, a good choice in 9mm might be the good old M11/9.

Under 500 rpm with tungsten bolt.

Too bad it would never be taken seriously.

Good old MAC. 500 rpm may be a bit too slow for a subgun. I think folks stated the sweet spot is ~ 800 - 900 rpm.

Still remember when Front Site was giving out free machine gun shoot for their sales marketing. 1200+ rpm is surprisingly controllable on a M11/9mm.

[mach]

B&T MP9 ~ 1100 rpm
UZI Pro ~ 1050 rpm
PMX ~ 900 rpm
Scorpion ~ 1150 rpm
MP5K ~ 900 rpm
MPX ~ 850 rpm

Any compact sub gun is a bit of spray and pray. The smaller it gets, more praying involved. MP9 is the same size as UZI Pro.

Now if we are talking about the old Micro UZI w/o the weighted bolt, ~ 2200 rpm, that would be a whole different level of praying

[SAD338]

All this talk about rpm when the real question will be, how cheaply can the Army get them?

[ChuckDizzle]

Sad, more like who will benefit from a contract and for what reasons will they benefit?

Small arms procurement in pistol calibers has always been mired in backroom deals. It's why we ended up with an Italian pistol while wanting bases in Italy. Or why we are getting a poorly made and designed German copy of an Austrian pistol at retail prices instead of bulk pricing.