"high cap mags" threads

[DocSkinner]

Can anyone tell me where to get a cheap SW915 for the HiCap magazines that I have? :-)

[OneSevenDeuce]

I think we all know that wording is pretty important when it comes to issues of legality. The wording, which Kestryll broke down in an earlier post (while not 100% proof) is certainly suspect. It's probably in the best interests of the mod/this board to deal with threads/posts like that.

I think it's a safe assumption that a vast majority of the people asking these types of questions have a good idea of how the law works.

Actually I don't think they know how the law works much at all. If they did they wouldn't have to ask these questions. Some advice and a friendly reminder to someone wanting to deal with rebuild kits would be much better than the chest beating that is going on here. Why? Because some people are the legal owners of rebuild kits. Some people might want to own rebuild kits but aren't sure if they legally can. However what is going on here is a leap to judgment. It's wrong philosophically, morally, and ethically.

[Shady]

leelaw,

I'm only saying this based off of what you have said in this topic. One of the responder made a statement that it is none of the OP business concerning high caps, and you responded that it was YOUR business. I don't want to get too wrapped around the axle on this, but if you and I had a misunderstanding about what you or I meant, then that's too bad. BUT, he quoted two people, one saying this.

"looking for some g17 mags, can anyone confirm that CDNN will disassemble mags for legal sale to CA, or do they fall under the "NO HI-CAPS TO CA" camp."

and the other, this...

"Even if it has the 17rnd mags can he take them apart and ship it to my FFL???"

and then said HOW OBVIOUS CAN YOU GET?

This is what I take issue with. Neither of these people are quoted as saying anything even remotely hinting at illegal activities. But still, he and it seemed like you, were too willing to jump on the bandwagon together and claim that these people, and others are doing something illegal. I can't even fathom that. It seems like a severe lack of judgment.

how do you know they arent going to build them into 10 rounders
mind your own business

[SDgarrick]

I made the posts about 'teh g17 mags' (!).
1. I had no intention of breaking the law, which I know well, as we all know well.
2. I asked about disassembly so that I might 'legally' acquire these mags, since, to legally own one it must be disassembled.
3. The "No Hicaps to CA" comment, rather than proof of my crime, was supposed to be hyperbolic, making reference to the common practice of out-of-state vendors refusing sale of legal items to CA.
4.SHEEESH!

Ironically, I avoided making the thread for about a week, because I thought some person would act foolish, and put me in a position in which I felt compelled to defend myself.

so, I've been accused of criminal behavior/intent 2x today.

you've made CA safer by your libel.
btw the glock mags were 6 bux each, too good a deal to pass on. damn, now I've fallen into your trap of defending my actions.

Edit: if this isn't already clear, from my earlier reference to SB12020 (c)(25)(A, My intent is/was to create 10 rounders, by blocking off a portion of the magazine aka feeding device, and permanently modifying it so as to not be able to accept more than 10 rounds.

[OneSevenDeuce]

OSD, you're losing an uphill battle. Seriously.

Kes knows personally, and it has earned me a lengthy ban in the past. Tread lightly.

Did you read the posts that Kes is referring to? It is a blatant act in which to acquire an illegal item and using CGN to assist in that act. I see it and so do a whole lot of other members.

In fact I did read them. That's why I am so insistent upon this subject. I think it is indefensible to make such accusations. If I do get banned then it will be for having a difference of opinion. What can I say about? Nothing. But I'm sorry, no possibility of a banning or whatever can make me accept that what is going on here is right. I'm not trying to argue, but I am trying to make a good statement on why what he and others are saying is morally bankrupt.

[elSquid]

In fact I did read them. That's why I am so insistent upon this subject. I think it is indefensible to make such accusations. If I do get banned then it will be for having a difference of opinion. What can I say about? Nothing. But I'm sorry, no possibility of a banning or whatever can make me accept that what is going on here is right. I'm not trying to argue, but I am trying to make a good statement on why what he and others are saying is morally bankrupt.

OTOH, when the mods explain that a certain standard of behavior is expected when posting here, it's not a bad idea to take that at face value. Sketchy posts result in censure. It's not always perfect, and sometimes toes get stepped on. C'est la vie.

BTW, I think I saw a windmill over in OT.

-- Michael

[OneSevenDeuce]

OTOH, when the mods explain that a certain standard of behavior is expected when posting here, it's not a bad idea to take that at face value. Sketchy posts result in censure. It's not always perfect, and sometimes toes get stepped on. C'est la vie.

BTW, I think I saw a windmill over in OT.

-- Michael

That's actually a very acceptable way to look at it. But that isn't what was done. Kes went straight into accusations of committing a felony. In fact, I doubt the people who made those posts were even contacted by him or any other moderator until this thread started. Instead of possibly clearing up a misunderstanding quite a few people went straight into accusations of guilt which, in my opinion, makes them look foolish.

[elSquid]

Kes went straight into accusations of committing a felony.

Calguns isn't a criminal courtroom; "beyond a reasonable doubt" is not the standard.

Poster was looking for highcap G17 mags, not rebuild kits.

10 rnd G17 mags are common and easily available. There isn't the same need to buy highcaps for conversion as there would be, for say a P30.

So warning flags go off.

The mods have to deal with all sorts of similar posts on a daily basis. Some are blatant, others less so. The mods can't afford to spend lots of time investigating each, so snap judgments have to be made.

The G17 poster could have structured his post differently, and there would have been no issue.



-- Michael

[OneSevenDeuce]

Calguns isn't a criminal courtroom; "beyond a reasonable doubt" is not the standard.

Poster was looking for highcap G17 mags, not rebuild kits.

10 rnd G17 mags are common and easily available. There isn't the same need to buy highcaps for conversion as there would be, for say a P30.

So warning flags go off.

The mods have to deal with all sorts of similar posts on a daily basis. Some are blatant, others less so. The mods can't afford to spend lots of time investigating each, so snap judgments have to be made.

The G17 poster could have structured his post differently, and there would have been no issue.



-- Michael

And I disagree. Oh well...

[DaveFJ80]

IBTL... but I will say this, as I've been reading the replies (and random people posting up BS just to add fuel to the fire that is not productive towards the topic).....

It's one thing to accuse somebody of something that's illegal. It's another to say "mind your own business" about it. And yet, it's another thing to say "what if...." like what if the guy really wants to make 10 rd mags out of the high cap mags. There's too much speculation and assumptions going on here. But at the same time, you need to use common sense. If you think somebody is making a post like what's in the OP and they want to make 10 rd mags out of them, then I think you need to pull your head out of your arse and see what's really going on here. It's another thing to speculate that there's truely 'illegal' activities going on and so forth.

Bottom line - everyone is going off of what certain posters have asked about high cap mags. Those posters hasn't produced any additional information after everyone else had posted up the law or their opinions on the subject (which should be a flag right there). Those same posters are a lot of times noobs to the site with a recent join date and low post count (another flag). I know what the law is about high cap mags, I own pre-ban mags and rebuild kits, and have sold rebuild kits. And I also know in this world you can't just give everybody the benefit of doubt on a touchy subject that's considered 'borderline illegal' or what not. Know the laws, follow the laws, respect the laws, and help those who need it when inquiring about the laws. And saying "it's none of your business" when somebody makes a post about what's legal or what's illegal, is just plain ignorance.

[CrazyJeep]

And saying "it's none of your business" when somebody makes a post about what's legal or what's illegal, is just plain ignorance.

Ignorance because I choose to not make a fool of myself by calling someone out on facts I don't know? Or to assume that people are breaking the law because they didn't dot all of their I's or cross all of their t's in being 100% open about what they are doing? That right there deserves a "none of your business." I think it's call self-filter and then research if it warrants such research on the subject matter at hand.

Ignorance is bliss, sir.

[MCPO]

Hello All, I grew up in Californina and around my 20 Naval Career I have been a CA resident. 2 years ago I took a job teaching High School NJROTC in Wyoming, so I moved there. In Wyoming, the gun laws are way less restrictive than in Californina. I do travel back to CA several times a year to visit family and friends.

Here is my delema in interperting the High Capacity Mag law/rules. The main handgun I own is an XDM-40, for which the 16 round mags are all that is commerially available. I bought and own the XDM 40 in Wyoming where I now reside. I am correct in reading the Law that does not prohibit having the high cap mags, but restricts manufacture, sale and importing. Further review shows that "importing" is brining into CA for commerce (Sale or Trade) . . . so therefore if I store and carry my XDM 40 leagally, then my high cap magazines are also legal for me to have and use at the range?

I have been searching for a pair of 10 round or less mags so I can have my firearm in CA with out the question, but am leaning on the conclusion that I am legal and with in my rights to bring them with me for short trips to California?


Thanks,

Max

[Librarian]

Here is my delema in interperting the High Capacity Mag law/rules. The main handgun I own is an XDM-40, for which the 16 round mags are all that is commerially available. I bought and own the XDM 40 in Wyoming where I now reside.

I am correct in reading the Law that does not prohibit having the high cap mags, but restricts manufacture, sale and importing. Further review shows that "importing" is brining into CA for commerce (Sale or Trade) . . . so therefore if I store and carry my XDM 40 leagally, then my high cap magazines are also legal for me to have and use at the range?

That would make sense - but this is California. There is no clear distinction between 'import' and 'import for sale' in the PC regarding large-capacity magazines.

I strongly recommend that you leave those out of state; practically, that means leaving the XDM .40 out of state, unless you have an interest in converting a couple 16-rounders to 10-rounders.

[vintagearms]

What I as the Owner understand is that YES IT IS HAPPENING.

I just had to send a PM to a guy in L.A. who was offering his S&W M&P with hi-cap mags for sale.
Think about that for a minute.


Yeah, that's right, the S&W M&P came out AFTER the ban was in place so there is no legal way short of playing 'oops, I found this on the ground' games or buying rebuild kits and making new hi-caps.

No, he does not say anywhere that he is an LEO or that the mags are only for sale to an LEO so let's not play that game.

Yes, it happens here, yes I have read and deleted posts from members talking about how to get hi-caps in CA or posting pictures of their Ruger SR9 with full capacity mags.

We're NOT talking about legal acquisition of magazines, we're talking about people trying to play clever little games and fast and loose with the law that is going to result in both CGN having legal issues as a venue that allows this and new laws banning rebuild kits.

Your house. Your rules. I for one and tired of seeing thread after thread about this and welcome deletion of threads related to rebuild kits.

[dachan]

If the mods are serious about the legal purchase of rebuild kits, they ought to implement a policy covering them similar to what was done with clones and counterfeits in the Marketplace. The law over rebuild kits is obviously being abused. There has been way more rebuild kits sold or imported into this state than ever used to rebuild legit mags, used to convert to 10rnd mags, or squirrelled away for the End of Days.

And to those who say to mind your own business, it is our business. Constant abuse of this loophole will result in the loss of the ability to buy rebuild kits for legitimate purposes. Next time you see some 21yr old, or someone who is obviously new to firearms claiming his uncle gave him mags when he was a zygote, or he found a box along the freeway, think about what impact these abuses could have on your ever reducing rights.