Do sellers need RealID for PPT?

[kemasa]

BTW, I asked about the ID requirements for the seller and was told it is the same as for the buyer. Not sure if it is the official position of the CA DOJ, but it is what I was told by a person there.

Update: I asked another person and was told that the seller doesn't need the same ID requirements, BUT if the buyer is denied, then they would need it to get it back and if they don't have it, under the laws regarding a CA PPT, the firearm would have to be turned over to the police.

[taperxz]

Regulations can be law when the law says that they can make regulations.

Go ahead, get a FFL and show everyone how it is done.

This is the part that consumers don't get. "but the PC says"

[1681]

BTW, I asked about the ID requirements for the seller and was told it is the same as for the buyer. Not sure if it is the official position of the CA DOJ, but it is what I was told by a person there.

Update: I asked another person and was told that the seller doesn't need the same ID requirements, BUT if the buyer is denied, then they would need it to get it back and if they don't have it, under the laws regarding a CA PPT, the firearm would have to be turned over to the police.

Here's what the actual CA Penal Code says about returning firearms to PPT sellers if buyers failed NICS:

(d) If the dealer cannot legally deliver the firearm to the purchaser or transferee or the person being loaned the firearm, the dealer shall forthwith, without waiting for the conclusion of the waiting period described in Sections 26815 and 27540, return the firearm to the transferor or seller or the person loaning the firearm.

and here's what CA DOJ says about the same thing:

The purchaser from a Private Party transaction was denied, how can I request the NICS Transaction Number (NTN) to return the firearm to the seller?

The NTN for a seller will only be provided when the purchaser from a Private Party transaction has a status of "Undetermined," "Rejected," or "Denied" associated with the background of that particular DROS transaction. The dealer must contact the Customer Support Center at (855) 365-3767 for assistance to request the NTN number by providing the associated transactions DROS number and verifying the purchasers first and last name. If the corresponding DROS transaction is cancelled, or past the 30 24-hour delivery/return period, the associated seller NTN will no longer be valid, and the firearm will need to be DROSed back to the seller as a Return to Owner DROS transaction.

Basically, there's no need to DROS the gun back to the seller if the gun is returned to the seller within the 30 24-hour delivery/return period.

and FFLs aren't law makers nor law enforcement officers.

[kemasa]

Here's what the actual CA Penal Code says about returning firearms to PPT sellers if buyers failed NICS:

(d) If the dealer cannot legally deliver the firearm to the purchaser or transferee or the person being loaned the firearm, the dealer shall forthwith, without waiting for the conclusion of the waiting period described in Sections 26815 and 27540, return the firearm to the transferor or seller or the person loaning the firearm.

and here's what CA DOJ says about the same thing:

The purchaser from a Private Party transaction was denied, how can I request the NICS Transaction Number (NTN) to return the firearm to the seller?

The NTN for a seller will only be provided when the purchaser from a Private Party transaction has a status of "Undetermined," "Rejected," or "Denied" associated with the background of that particular DROS transaction. The dealer must contact the Customer Support Center at (855) 365-3767 for assistance to request the NTN number by providing the associated transactions DROS number and verifying the purchasers first and last name. If the corresponding DROS transaction is cancelled, or past the 30 24-hour delivery/return period, the associated seller NTN will no longer be valid, and the firearm will need to be DROSed back to the seller as a Return to Owner DROS transaction.

Basically, there's no need to DROS the gun back to the seller if the gun is returned to the seller within the 30 24-hour delivery/return period.

and FFLs aren't law makers nor law enforcement officers.

Not the complete information since you left out the part if it can't be returned to the seller. Also, it doesn't include anything about the ID requirements.

Nice snide comment about FFLs, but it is bogus as FFLs have to follow the rules, even if the rules are made up.

[1681]

Not the complete information since you left out the part if it can't be returned to the seller. Also, it doesn't include anything about the ID requirements.

Nice snide comment about FFLs, but it is bogus as FFLs have to follow the rules, even if the rules are made up.

The seller's ID requirements to be same as buyer is only needed if buyer failed NICS, and the gun was not returned to seller during the 30 24-hours delivery/waiting period since a DROS is then required for the seller. If the seller failed NICS check, then the gun goes to local PD for disposal.

Your info came from different FFLs and their understanding of the law, who tend to made up more crap policies to cover their own asses and force others to "obey" it.

Based on what I've seen, most FFLs do not understand this process and will give out BS information, which we don't need more of.

[kemasa]

Oaktree gun club and Big 5 Valencia refused to do Ammo PPT. Essentially denying your 2nd amendment right.

The 2nd amendment limits what the government can do, it doesn't apply to businesses. It is the government who created the law which violates your rights, not businesses. You don't have a right to demand what a business does.

[1681]

Oaktree gun club and Big 5 Valencia refused to do Ammo PPT. Essentially denying your 2nd amendment right.

and you have the right to deny them your business.

[kemasa]

The seller's ID requirements to be same as buyer is only needed if buyer failed NICS, and the gun was not returned to seller during the 30 24-hours delivery/waiting period since a DROS is then required for the seller. If the seller failed NICS check, then the gun goes to local PD for disposal.



Your info came from different FFLs and their understanding of the law, who tend to made up more crap policies to cover their own asses and force others to "obey" it.



Based on what I've seen, most FFLs do not understand this process and will give out BS information, which we don't need more of.

The seller doesn't have to fail the background check for the gun to go to the police.

My info came from different FFLs? Really? Try dealing with all the rules and regulations and see what happens if you don't do the safe thing.

Don't give out bogus information yourself.

[1681]

This is the part that consumers don't get. "but the PC says"

It's ironic that the two most significant 2A cases for the last decade have been won by non-gun lawyers, who actually didn't want to represent "gun nuts".

and the NRA even opposed the Heller case.

[1681]

The seller doesn't have to fail the background check for the gun to go to the police.

My info came from different FFLs? Really? Try dealing with all the rules and regulations and see what happens if you don't do the safe thing.

Don't give out bogus information yourself.

it's interesting that you can NEVER give specific penal code about your info, other than saying it's the law, or being told by someone somewhere.

[kemasa]

it's interesting that you can NEVER give specific penal code about your info, other than saying it's the law, or being told by someone somewhere.

Quite the lie. Just because I don't bother to spoon feed you doesn't mean that I can't. You can read all the CA PC yourself since you have shown that you can copy selective portions.

[edgerly779]

Kemasa never argue with fools someone watching might not know the difference.(LOL) Leads to stress.

[edgerly779]

10mmunderwood is a newbie who will not last long. 10 posts and alienates members. Kemasa has helped a lot of people on here. Go back to twitter.

[edgerly779]

I agree leopards never change their spots.

[Kestryll]

your the one violating the rules, lying every post, and having a horrible attitude.

Given that you very existence with this account violates the rules 'brightthought' you're not really in a postion to be a whiny b****.

Especially since you were banned for posting vulgar insults.

By the way, this account is gone and your temp ban is now permanent.