Ammo Sales / Transfer on 1/1/2018

[????? ????]

I think you posted the DOJ's proposed text.
The OAL adopted rules differ just a bit:

https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/regs/adopted-text.pdf

You are right. I made a mistake and copy and pasted from the original draft instead of the final text.

[acespawnshop]

Got it.

So there is no law on the transfer fee for internet vendor sales, and the law for PPT is $5 if delivered immediately.

So we still haven't decided on what is a fair price for this. We are now back to square one. What is the consensus on how much to charge.

[ugimports]

We're likely going to do something where pickup within Z days is free or cheap.
Z to X days $Y storage fees
After X days it gets returned to vendor for $Y*(X-Z days)+shipping costs

Still thinking about X, Y, and Z.. and depending if people start shipping pallets we may revise those or go to space based fees.

Our situation is a little different though since we're by appt only. If my previous customers that I've done this for are any indication of what we'd see we can expect 1-2k ammo per shipment per person.

We might limit the amount of ammo transfers to 5 active transfers at a time or something also.

[kemasa]

I would be tempted to do it based on the weight. 10 lbs is much easier to deal with than 1000 lbs.

[Condorguns]

So we still haven't decided on what is a fair price for this. We are now back to square one. What is the consensus on how much to charge.

We are still trying to figure this out too. I know we want to do the $5 fee for same day pick up. I'm thinking the $5 will probably break us even in cost for staff to take the ammo in, deliver it, and process the tax.

Maybe after 24 hours to 1 week it would go up to $10-$15. Longer than a week $20.

It's difficult to come up with a plan when I have no idea what other shops are doing. I have no clue if we are coming in too high or low.

How long are you guys thinking of holding ammo before it's abandoned? If it is abandoned is it returned to the seller or forfeit to the shop?

[ugimports]

We are still trying to figure this out too. I know we want to do the $5 fee for same day pick up. I'm thinking the $5 will probably break us even in cost for staff to take the ammo in, deliver it, and process the tax.

Maybe after 24 hours to 1 week it would go up to $10-$15. Longer than a week $20.

It's difficult to come up with a plan when I have no idea what other shops are doing. I have no clue if we are coming in too high or low.

How long are you guys thinking of holding ammo before it's abandoned? If it is abandoned is it returned to the seller or forfeit to the shop?

I didn't even consider forfeiting to the shop. That might be better than returning it because at least you can make some money back from that.

I would just start with a fee structure that makes sense and then adjust it once you see how the market is around you. I need to figure out with my wife what she wants to do since she processes most of the daily deliveries. I don't want to do free if it's a PITA for her. However, I do know that for "immediate" / pickup fairly quickly, I want to keep it as near $0 as possible, then heavy penalize when it sits too long. I might modify our structure though and after 14-30 days we just keep the ammo to resell vs. return to sender. If someone doesn't come in within 14-30 days (not sure what we'll choose yet) then I would say they don't want the ammo. We are stressing they plan ahead and don't order it if they can't pick it up near immediately after the tracking shows it will arrive.

ETA: I also don't think I will add us to any auto-ship lists. Too many people assume that if you're on that one of those that there's nothing else they need to do for coordination. Last thing we need is a pallet coming in when we're full because 10 people found us on an auto-ship list site for ammo at the same time!

[wannabefree]

We are still trying to figure this out too. I know we want to do the $5 fee for same day pick up. I'm thinking the $5 will probably break us even in cost for staff to take the ammo in, deliver it, and process the tax.

Maybe after 24 hours to 1 week it would go up to $10-$15. Longer than a week $20.

It's difficult to come up with a plan when I have no idea what other shops are doing. I have no clue if we are coming in too high or low.

How long are you guys thinking of holding ammo before it's abandoned? If it is abandoned is it returned to the seller or forfeit to the shop?

I asked a local gun shop here and they told me they were thinking of charging $5.00 plus 10% of the receipt total. So a $200 order would cost $25.

[Addax]

We are in the same situation.
Trying to figure out a fair fee schedule.

Problem is size, and weight.
1000 rounds of most ammo is manageable, but a pallet of ammo not the same.

We are considering a tier type fee schedule based on round count or considering base fee like $5 plus % of total invoice amount.

[ugimports]

Part of our reason to keep the fees low is to encourage customers to NOT feel the need to buy a pallet of ammo at a time . If we can keep it low then there's no incentive to buy a bulk pallet. E.g., they can buy 2 boxes of 9mm and only pay sales tax if the pick it up within X days. With that logic they won't feel the need to save up and do a once a year pallet purchase (I hope).

That's our thought at least.

Also, we have some history of San Francisco and Oakland customers (who never could ship to their house) using us over the years. Most of the folks purchased 1-2k at a time. We charged $0 and didn't have to collect sales tax at the time.

I think the most one recent customer was about 5k, but that was a bulk buy to beat the deadline.

I don't know many customers, even if you troll our forums, that actually purchased a pallet of ammo at a time. It seems even the most frequent ammo purchasers were only purchasing 1-2k per purchase. They may have been doing that 2-3 times a month, but I've rarely (other than 22LR) seen folks say they just about 20k of .223 or .308 in a single order/delivery. I figure those folks will just get their FFL03/COE since they will easily make back that money if they are buying that large in bulk and will save themselves a trip to the LGS.

[rbetts]

We have websites that sell ammo, so our incentive is to get our customers to use the websites and not pay any fees. We are following 10Percents lead on ammo being shipped in. 20 Cash 30 Credit plus tax No limit on time held.

[acespawnshop]

I'm thinking the $5 will probably break us even in cost for staff to take the ammo in, deliver it, and process the tax.

Why would you work to break even? Its seems like a time management thing to me. If had one employee take 20 minutes on the thing he probably is making $5 every 20 minutes. Therefore if he spends more than 10 minutes on the stuff its a loss. I bet you lunch there is no way your employees will take less than 10 minutes to deal with this once you count in time to deal with the customer with pickups. Nobody comes in and leaves right away.

[acespawnshop]

I asked a local gun shop here and they told me they were thinking of charging $5.00 plus 10% of the receipt total. So a $200 order would cost $25.

That's not a bad idea. Lets expand on this a little. What I don't want is somebody who just needs 1 box of "odd caliber hard to find" to have to pay $25 for us to receive his $40 box of ammo. If we did something like orders under $100 are flat fee $10.00 that seems fair, you wont be making any money, but you probably wont get many of these. Orders $1000 and under are $25, these would be the guys who order 1000 rounds .223 1000 rounds 9mm and 1000 rounds of 7.62x39 that seems like a $1000 order to me. If you start going percentage based that can get super high quick. Example 10% on a $1500 order is $150 in fees. That seems a little too much.

What if we did something like this. Your ammo order is $10 for small orders under $100.00, then go $25 for orders up to $1000. If your order is over $1k then add on $5 for each case of ammo (size equivalent of the black plastic ammo totes LAX ammo sells at the gun shows, or the .50 cal ammo can size.) So if he orders $3000 worth of ammo its $25 then add up how many cases were sent to you and tack on $5.00 each case to lug them around your store. ***THIS IS NOT OUR STORE POLICY JUST SPEAKING FOR DISCUSSION***

Part of our reason to keep the fees low is to encourage customers to NOT feel the need to buy a pallet of ammo at a time .

We've already had phone calls from people asking if we had a warehouse and pallet jack to handle this. Seriously dude only wanted to pay $10 for us to receive his damn pallet of ammo. And there was no way he was paying sales tax on it according to him. He was going to find somebody else since we were not being cooperative with his wants.

[Santa Cruz Armory]

Our policy may change in the future, but we're going to start with a hybrid version of 10% Firearms fee schedule



2018
Ammunition Transfer Fees


Again, thanks to 10% Firearms for setting the standard for many of the CA dealers. (As is usually the case)

[ugimports]

That's not a bad idea. Lets expand on this a little. What I don't want is somebody who just needs 1 box of "odd caliber hard to find" to have to pay $25 for us to receive his $40 box of ammo. If we did something like orders under $100 are flat fee $10.00 that seems fair, you wont be making any money, but you probably wont get many of these. Orders $1000 and under are $25, these would be the guys who order 1000 rounds .223 1000 rounds 9mm and 1000 rounds of 7.62x39 that seems like a $1000 order to me. If you start going percentage based that can get super high quick. Example 10% on a $1500 order is $150 in fees. That seems a little too much.

What if we did something like this. Your ammo order is $10 for small orders under $100.00, then go $25 for orders up to $1000. If your order is over $1k then add on $5 for each case of ammo (size equivalent of the black plastic ammo totes LAX ammo sells at the gun shows, or the .50 cal ammo can size.) So if he orders $3000 worth of ammo its $25 then add up how many cases were sent to you and tack on $5.00 each case to lug them around your store. ***THIS IS NOT OUR STORE POLICY JUST SPEAKING FOR DISCUSSION***



We've already had phone calls from people asking if we had a warehouse and pallet jack to handle this. Seriously dude only wanted to pay $10 for us to receive his damn pallet of ammo. And there was no way he was paying sales tax on it according to him. He was going to find somebody else since we were not being cooperative with his wants.

Maybe I'll add something in our instructions that any order > 5k rounds requires pre-approval.

[taperxz]

Maybe I'll add something in our instructions that any order > 5k rounds requires pre-approval.