ADCO firearms Not CA or L/E friendly

[Ron-Solo]

Cry much?

Im not anti LEO, im anti ELITIST CA LEOs, who have horrible attitudes, no interpersonal skills, abuse their positions, and talk a big game but would wet themselves if they were put into my position

Other than that, I am actually very supportive of LE and respect the job they do. Its a hard job and worthy of respect, but not special priviledge.

If the shoe fits.

Like I said, just go away. Just because we can legally purchase Hi-Cap mags doesn't make us special, elitist or anything like that. If they said dentists could buy them, a lot of gun friendly densists would. That doesn't make them elitist.

Don't know what "Your Position" is, but as far as wetting myself, not yet, but I have been scared more than once. You don't earn a Medal of Valor, 2 Medals of Bravery, and a Meritorious Service Award without being scared. I've been shot at more times than I can count and by the grace of God and good training by my FTO have come out on top every time. (I hated my FTO when I was on training, and thank him every time I run into him for teaching me what I know)

I've been at it 30 years now and have seen my share of the worst society has got. Most people have no clue what we really do every day. They think TV is real.

I wish the California gun laws weren't so stupid, but unfortunately, we're stuck with them for now. My adult son can't get Hi-Caps either. When he borrows one of my guns, he takes the 10 rounders we bought just for him so he doen't run afoul of any problems. It sucks. He only gets to use the hi-caps when I'm with him.

In my opinion, many of CavTrooper's posts show a resentment toward law enforcement, which is why I say he sould go hang out in another forum.

[Matt C]

You better listen CavTrooper, he's got MEDALS!

[Ron-Solo]

LE or not, disparaging remarks of a non-military LEO who, by the way, are in complete and total compliance with California law, are not warranted. I do not believe I am special in any way, but the law allows me to possess something and I take advantage of that law...just as you would (or maybe even do). It simply seems to me (and maybe others) the facts of law have no bearing in some folks opinions.

But, that is ok. This is the USA and we can cave varying opinions and not get banished to some sweat box!!

Exactly!

[eta34]

Cry much?

Im not anti LEO, im anti ELITIST CA LEOs, who have horrible attitudes, no interpersonal skills, abuse their positions, and talk a big game but would wet themselves if they were put into my position

Other than that, I am actually very supportive of LE and respect the job they do. Its a hard job and worthy of respect, but not special priviledge.

If the shoe fits.

I agree with CavTrooper here. I get embarassed by some of our fellow officers who think they are God's gift to this earth. I don't respect them either. Because we share the same job should mean I should defend their every action?

By the way, the comparison of police medals to uniformed military service is laughable. It sounds like you have done a lot in your police career. Congratulations (an I mean that sincerely). However, you and I do nothing nearly as brave or honorable as serve in a foreign war.

Finally, I have disagreed with BWO on many issues. However, throwing the "anyone can get an MP costume" card out is silly. Please stop embarassing yourself.

[JagerTroop]

Why do LEO's need hi-cap mags???
West Hollywood shootout, Columbine, Virginia Tech, active shooter situations and for every parolee that already HAS 30 round mags.....

No, some Departments dont issue AR's, magazines, .223 ammo for patrol riflemen. Thanks Joe Sun, for your brilliant comment.

First I'll say that I'm not bashing LEO, but your examples are flawed.

1) NORTH Hollywood shootout - LEO weapons weren't doing crap. They had to call on the support of civilian arms(gunstore ARs... Ironic, isn't it?), and no amount of hi caps were going to solve this problem. In the end it was all about shot placement.
2) Columbine - Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold commited suicide.
3) Virginia Tech - Seung-Hui Cho commited suicide

My point is that hi cap mags did not save the day. If I'm wrong, then why did police let numerous people die (Co. and Va.)... waiting for the gunmen to kill themselves? Put those hi caps to use, dammit.

...Don't hate the cops, hate the magazine capacity restrictions...

Just because you (LEO) are legally allowed to buy the hi caps, doesn't mean that you're entitled to the sale. The seller is not obligated to sell to CA LEOs. So I say, Don't hate the seller, hate the magazine capacity restrictions that he (ADCO) is protesting."

As an American, I feel that no LEO(in any state) should be given special treatment. LE, it's not your fault (in fact, I know many of you are on my(our) side), but you were once like me, and now are entrusted to protect me. For that, you are compensated monitarily. The extra perks/fringe benefits should come to a halt.

[Nick5811]

For that, you are compensated monitarily. The extra perks/fringe benefits should come to a halt.

Hmm...I'm not sure what fringe benefits or extra perks you're talking about....could you elaborate?

Sure, Jack in the Box and Chili's will give you a 50% discount if you go there in uniform, but department policy specifically forbids you from accepting this corporate policy. Other than that, I'm at a loss.

[JagerTroop]

Hmm...I'm not sure what fringe benefits or extra perks you're talking about....could you elaborate?

Sure, Jack in the Box and Chili's will give you a 50% discount if you go there in uniform, but department policy specifically forbids you from accepting this corporate policy. Other than that, I'm at a loss.

I'm not talking about free coffee at 7/11. What is this whole thread about? Hi cap magazines. I accept that they are tools used while on the job, but hi caps for personal use are "perks".

[nobody33]

======

[Matt C]

Based on cops I know in my department I know very very few who have hi-cap mags for non duty weapons (I can't even think of one off hand). I know very few that even have guns that are not used for duty or training. I don't have any.

No worries, you are welcome to come to the range with me and shoot any of my guns, and I'll even let you use my high cap mags.

[Nick5811]

Based on cops I know in my department I know very very few who have hi-cap mags for non duty weapons (I can't even think of one off hand). I know very few that even have guns that are not used for duty or training. I don't have any.

On topic:

I wouldn't do business with ADCO based on what I've read. If he doesn't want to sell to LEO, cool. Less business for him. They'll get their supplies elsewhere (or in this case, take the 10 rd mags apart and "manufacture" a hi-cap magazine they are legally allowed to possess.)

Off topic but related:

All the cops I know that carry off duty or own personal firearms have "regular" magazines for those firearms, not the neutered 10 rounders. I think it's because of the whole "you're never off duty" and survival mentality of those who carry.

Bad guys remember who put them in the can, and they don't play by the rules. Why take a chance with regular mags because you aren't carrying your duty weapon off duty? That's exactly why congress passes LEOSA in 2004; to allow cops to protect themselves off duty from the people they encounter on duty, regardless of where they live or travel.

In any case, I'm not a fan of limiting the capacity of magazines to law abiding citizens; but I don't think LEO's should be guilt-tripped or forced to give up the ability to purchase standard capacity magazines that may be used to defend their lives off duty either.

(and, not to pick on anyone, but an MP is not a police officer. They may perform (some of) the duties of one (in some cases), but they are definitely not the same.)

[pummel]

hmm

I wonder if any of the "I applaud his decision not to sell to hi-caps to leo's" folks, were the same that whined up a storm over the larue lowers issue. Fact is he refused a legal sale for personal reasons(lame as they may be). I think the OP's intent, as he's states several times, is to put the word out regarding the seller's conduct, and I thank him for that. I don't think they'll get any more of my business.
As for all the sour grapes on here, sorry I'm exempt. It's not why I got into this line of work, but if it's there, then why should I pass on it? Specifically BWO, dude really, I know you were wronged but what your LEO related posts lead me to believe is that you are only in this specialty forum to stir the pot. I'd like to refer you to that violin smiley you posted earlier... If the shoe fits.
Cavtrooper, you too should ease up on your spite-tinged LEO related posts, at least in the LEO forum. And thanks for your service but leave that tough guy mil talk out of this, many of us have served and deployed overseas before serving our cities, without wetting my pants I might add

[TheBundo]

I know that he is cussing at cops and no one else. I saw pictures on his website of stuff he sold to troops. So yeah I do...

I don't hear people crying about the military on Pendelton or the movie studios for having all the toys like select fire guns, but there's a lot of crying about LEO's getting hi cap mags?

Wow, what a thread. I was going to respond earlier, but wanted to see if the other referenced thread was linked. I didn't need to get far to see where the "cop" was at (in the other thread), a pro-Obama, dis-arm everyone else guy. I know, maybe that's a leap from what he said, but I strongly suspect that's where he is at.

As to "I don't hear people crying about the military on Pendelton or the movie studios for having all the toys like select fire guns", I would say this: the military and the movie studios don't ever wrongfully hassle or beat citizens (and NEITHER do MOST cops - but the military and movie studios NEVER do). And they never bother people about stupid gun laws that are legal for THEM in their private life, as an LEO. Too many LEO's lose touch with normal people's reality, and only hang with other LEO's (talking LEO stuff), and their wives start hanging with LEO wives, and hence there comes a dis-connect with Joe Good Citizen.

Cops always tell us what they "need", like "hands on the wheel, turn on the dome light", etc. Let me tell you what the citizen needs, as I see it. We need cops with COURAGE against the politicians, the upper management that turn into liberal politicians (and not cowards who will do or say anything to protect their pension, because something like the Lautenburg Act can end your dreams immediately). Remember, these same politicians caused hundreds of thousands of you to be summarily fired because of the Lautenburg Act, sometimes with 30+ years since the "offense". Once the upper echelons that really run things decide to start a more rapid rotation of LEO's out of power, you will see how vulnerable you too are.

All I ask is that you see things from all sides, and realize that we are all human, with fatal frailties. Cops personal lives, as a class, are no more virtuous than Joe Public's, as a class. We are all against the thugs. Don't go against Joe Public's God-given right and instinst to protect himself, something you can't nearly always do for him (thanks for trying, though).

Consider how many murders there are a year in the US. While those aren't a LEO failure, because you have no crystal ball, they ARE a failure of the law and societal attitudes, when the law and societal attitudes lead, or force, people to be defenseless. True, many murders couldn't be prevented in any way, but many could have been if there was a moral gun-friendly super-majority of the public. You LEO's, who can CCW anywhere in America, probably don't realize what an incredible sense of fresh air and freedom it is for the rest of us to legally drive through Nevada, for instance, with a loaded gun in the car, fully legal.

Just imagine the harmony that would come between lawful CA gunowners and cops in CA if it were that way here. Look at all the ridiculous waste of time wasted here talking about how to get from point A to B with such and such gun (legal transport, etc.), by someone who is in all respects, a "fellow good guy".

The sick state of California literally grieves my soul

[TheBundo]

I think there is a point to be made that such laws only foster the attitude that many LEOs have where they think they are superior in some way to the average person on the street.

Is that superiority based on their super-low divorce rate?

[TheBundo]

Answers in bold below:

Blackwater Ops, again, what is your question for a LEO on this forum? Do you really think you can make that point here? What are you going to do if there is some kind of mass casualty attack? I'm going to work! And I'm bringing all my "off duty" high cap mags with me, with some water and socks. You sit tight, I'll go into the fray. Am I superior, no. I have a strange job.

Too bad you weren't in South Central LA during the Rodney King riots when Reginald Denny was getting his head bashed in while the cops ran away. I'm sure he could have used your help.

Further, I don't think that an officer in CA trying to buy some hi-cap mags is trying to feel like a special class of human being. Don't hate the cops, hate the magazine capacity restrictions.

What have YOU done to help overturn them? And what have you done to ENFORCE them?

It does not matter in the slightest if the magazines are for "duty" use or not. That is not part of the law. Department letterhead for a magazine purchase is not acceptable. In the end, the guy is just losing a sale....

At least he's DOING something, even at personal cost, in line with his conscience. Again, what are YOU doing about the magazine capacity restrictions?

[TheBundo]

Why do LEO's need hi-cap mags???
West Hollywood shootout, Columbine, Virginia Tech, active shooter situations and for every parolee that already HAS 30 round mags.....

No, some Departments dont issue AR's, magazines, .223 ammo for patrol riflemen. Thanks Joe Sun, for your brilliant comment.

What if the citizens whose houses the West Hollywood guys were passing by while shooting lived in a pro-gun environment, and had high-powered rifles and/or high cap mags. BTW, high-cap mags weren't what was needed there, WAS IT? It was either a high-powered enough rifle to pierce their armor, OR the luck shot that got through the crack in the armor, RIGHT?

And WHERE were the COPS at Virginia Tech? What was there positions in students having CCW's at VT?

Columbine? What did cops high-cap mags have to do with that at ALL?