80% lowers MERGED THREADS - please ask in here, not a new thread

[target_shot]

I would tell them to pound sand personally. You didn't put up an argument on why pics are needed? I would have asked for a supervisor to call me and cite PC as to where I needed to supply pictures. Don't make it easy for them. I'm sure they can look up your background very easily.

Just my opinion.

I can understand why. No, I did not argue with them.

They want pictures? Fine by me. I'm changing the hardware around anyways

[OniKoroshi]

Supplying info without required PC is just helping DOJ with "underground" regulation. Too bad CGN lawyers won't do pro bono for stuff like this. At least then if asked for pictures one could forward DOJ to contact them and hopefully stop the "provide pics" or else threat...

[Barbastard]

For 2017, the definition of AW is not changing. It remains as it was in the quoted section of the law.
If a rifle is featureless today, it is not required to be registered next year (and it can never be converted to a featured form).

How would the govt know if it's featureless today vs making it featureless next year prior to the end of the RAW deadline?

What I'm getting at is...if someone currently owns an AR with features AND a BB....by end of 2017 you'll either have to make it a RAW or convert it to a featureless rifle by the end of 2017. Correct?

[Junkie]

The law states that if you possessed it as an AW (presumably future AW) you must register it. ifilef interprets that to mean even if it's now featureless/fixed mag/etc, but for some reason claims that selling it means you don't have to register it (even though there's no exemption for that).

AFAIK they have no way of knowing when you made it an AW. Getting caught manufacturing an AW is very bad though.

[Barbastard]

The law states that if you possessed it as an AW (presumably future AW) you must register it. ifilef interprets that to mean even if it's now featureless/fixed mag/etc, but for some reason claims that selling it means you don't have to register it (even though there's no exemption for that).

AFAIK they have no way of knowing when you made it an AW. Getting caught manufacturing an AW is very bad though.

My point is that, AFAIK, by end of next year (2017) you either have to:

1. Register your "featured" semi automatic rifle as RAW
2. Convert your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to a featureless semi automatic weapon (and can then lose the BB)
3. Transfer or sell your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to someone out of state.
4. Do nothing....and see what happens.

Sound about right?

[Junkie]

That's my interpretation.

[Cokebottle]

My point is that, AFAIK, by end of next year (2017) you either have to:

1. Register your "featured" semi automatic rifle as RAW
2. Convert your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to a featureless semi automatic weapon (and can then lose the BB)
3. Transfer or sell your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to someone out of state.
4. Do nothing....and see what happens.

Sound about right?

There is still the grace period next year.

Though the new definition creates AW's out of currently bullet-buttoned featured builds on Jan 1, there will be no prosecution during 2017, therefore, you actually have until Jan 1 2018 to transfer the rifle to someone out of state (but I would NOT want to get caught with a featured build without a BB before it is registered).

I would not advise option 4.... 4-6-8 years and lifetime firearms prohibition.


Which brings me to a thought that I had a few days ago....

Someone recently posted the potential financial impact of either Prop 63 or the BB law and pointed out how costs to the state could potentially be significant due to the number of new felons at a cost of some 200k/year per prisoner.

It will never come to that.
Barring the commission of a REAL crime, being in possession of an AW is a non-violent offense.
The state will take you in, release you on bail or your OR, and at your trial, it will be 6 years probation and time served... and they will be smug in the knowledge that they have created yet another felon who will carry a lifetime firearms prohibition in ANY state of the union (and with a felony, you will have a difficult time moving to a different country... won't even be able to VISIT Canada!)

French Foreign Legion will be the only way you will ever have a gun again.

[sbo80]

It isn't that difficult. A rifle is either an AW or it isn't. DOJ does not and cannot know how your rifle isn't an AW, just that it isn't. If next year, the rifle you have that wasn't an AW today, would be under the new law, you can register it and keep it, or do those other things. If that doesn't describe your rifle, you can't register. When you register, you won't have to prove anything, you just fill it out truthfully and sign at the bottom. Every firearm form from the 4473 to new resident registration has a line that says "I declare under penalty of perjury...". If you didn't build the rifle until june 2017 but lie on the form and put a date in 2016, that's two crimes, perjury and manuf. an AW. ifilef's point of view claims that in 2018 you could be arrested for your featureless rifle and charged with AW violation because the assumption will be made that in some point in the rifle's past it must have been configured as an AW under the new law but before the new law existed, and therefore should have been registered. Also, currently registering rifles online as new residents specifically allows for "home built" as a selection, so here's to hoping they basically reuse the same form...

[1st Generation Gun Owner]

Doesn't it have to be semi-auto to RAW?

For the pistol you're correct, you have to initially build it as single shot so you aren't manufacturing an unsafe handgun. That doesn't mean it has to stay that way though. .

I think there was some debate about that. Some argued that conversion from single-shot to semi-auto could be considered manufacturing. Consensus appears to agree with you.

[target_shot]

Doesn't it have to be semi-auto to RAW?







I think there was some debate about that. Some argued that conversion from single-shot to semi-auto could be considered manufacturing. Consensus appears to agree with you.

It does have to be semi-auto. Once registered, I will convert it

[ifilef]

My point is that, AFAIK, by end of next year (2017) you either have to:

1. Register your "featured" semi automatic rifle as RAW-(if you possessed it with a BB on or before 12/31/2016);

2. Convert your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to a featureless semi automatic weapon (and can then lose the BB... but must register it in 2017 and prudent to register it before dropping the BB....

3. Transfer or sell your CURRENTLY (as in from now till 12/31/16) owned "featured" semi automatic rifle with BB to someone out of state anyone here qualified to purchase by 12/21/2016. Reason: only current possessor would have duty to register his purchase in 2016 of a SACF featured rifle with BB that he retains possession of into 2017..

4. Do nothing....and see what happens-(that's okay to abstain from until the very end of next year, when you will likely need to register it as AW)..

FIFY above.

Also, if you sell it featured by 12/21/2016, or featureless by 12/21/2017, you will not need to register as AW. With the former, last buyer in 2016 has duty to register as AW in 2017. With the latter neither you nor buyer need to register as AW if sale takes place by 12/21/2017.

Current possessor would need to register it if they purchased it featured with BB by end of this year and continue in possession through 2017, no matter the configuration. Can't put the genie back into the lamp if possessed featured with BB.

[Nurse_Rep]

Tagged.

[GM4spd]

For 2017, the definition of AW is not changing. It remains as it was in the quoted section of the law.
If a rifle is featureless today, it is not required to be registered next year (and it can never be converted to a featured form).

After all this time a lot of people have still not comprehended the definition
of an AW as used here in CA.

[Cokebottle]

After all this time a lot of people have still not comprehended the definition of an AW as used here in CA.

Can't blame them with new laws being passed every year, and the combination of intentional misinformation in the media, and the media's ignorance and incompetence creating the inability to get it right.
I've been involved in and interviewed for a number of news stories related to my profession. I no longer make ANY statement to the media, even if they are doing a friendly PR piece.
EVERY single situation, by the time it was edited and broadcast or printed, it came out grossly incorrect, to the point that no accurate information was shared with the public.
It's their job to share information, but it goes through their filter and the result is no different than if I were to attempt to do a news story on brain surgery.

I've talked to several people who have built up ARs or purchased in the last year, one from an 80%, and knowing the guy who has it, I'm 90% sure that he did not machine or assemble it himself.
None of them have any CLUE as to the changes next year.

It'll be the same as 1990 and 2000. There might be 10% compliance (registration or removal from the state) among those who actually know the law, 10% refusal to comply, and 80% will become unwitting felons.

One of my bosses some 15 years ago had a Bushmaster that should have been registered and was not. He had no clue that California had a ban, he only knew that the 1994 federal bad did not apply to a gun that he already owned. That gun now lives in a safe at his condo in AZ.

[ucb]

FIFY above.

Also, if you sell it featured by 12/21/2016, or featureless by 12/21/2017, you will not need to register as AW. With the former, last buyer in 2016 has duty to register as AW in 2017. With the latter neither you nor buyer need to register as AW if sale takes place by 12/21/2017.

Current possessor would need to register it if they purchased it featured with BB by end of this year and continue in possession through 2017, no matter the configuration. Can't put the genie back into the lamp if possessed featured with BB.

So you are implying if you had a BB equipped rifle and convert it to a featureless rifle before Jan 1 2017, it will still need to be registered?

Also not answered, if you have a BB rifle, register it, since it is now classified as an AW, is there any reason to retain the BB once it is registered?