Contrary to "SuperTool" allegations, I didn't "call DOJ" on any personl/vendor...

[Mitch]

It never ceases to amaze me, how many people on Calguns seem to believe that if we gunners would just be quiet, and behave ourselves, and never ask for anything new....that the anti-2nd folks in the CA State government would just magically stop writing and passing new bills.

Do some of you really believe that?

Not only does no one here believe that, no one has ever come close to suggesting it.

Which makes it something of a mystery why you would insist otherwise.

The magazine rebuild kits were gone once they became mainstream enough for the legislators to notice (not to mention that I'd put some good money on majority being used illegally.)

That's probably a pretty safe bet. I'd even wager that some DAs had perps with oversized magazines who bought them as parts kits and they went to certain politicians with their findings. This definitely seemed to be what was behind the San Fancisco civil suits.

Then there was the fact that just about every single time anyone showed up on Calguns asking whether there was a way to get high capacity magazines in the state half a dozen bright boys would chime in with the rebuild kits nonsense. If they weren't using the repair kits to build illegal high capacity magazines, why mention them in a thread about high capacity magazines at all?

[hornswaggled]

As is anyone in California naive and/or stupid enough to use the magnet product on his weapon without researching the legalities.

No one is responsible for what you do, but you.

That's fine for us hobbyists who sit pontificating on a gun forum and know the nuances of the AW flowchart. These magnet vendors are targeting the ignorant 21 year old still living at home working at a Which Which, who doesn't realize a gun vendor would openly sell something that will make him a felon when he throws it on his M&P Sport he bought at Turner's last week.

The mag vendors damn well know this. But they won't help out by just saying, "Oh yeah, it's probably illegal to use this in California?"

I'll tell you what, that may not be illegal, but it sure is a dick move in my opinion.

[chiselchst]

I agree 100%. Bill is a major asset to this community. Personally, I have nothing but total respect for him and his taking the time to share with us, the legal details of many laws, and always helps to clarify the vague, stupid laws we have...

Bill is passionate because of a felony conviction will seriously wreck your life. Not only would it cost your gun rights, but for many people, a felony conviction would damage all parts of the rest of their lives.

[robertkjjj]

Personally, I actually prefer the longer posts, because I tend to LEARN more from them.

Anyone can come on here and take a 10-word jab at a short essay they disagree with. How hard is that?

But, do we learn more from reading "War and Peace", or from the random critic who trashes the book by saying "Hey, it stunk." ?
~~~~~

Beats the hell out of 600 word worthless posts......

[Beatone]

I listen to what Bill says. Some don't. I've warned my friends to stay away from those magnet buttons. As we all know, the DOJ is always looking for thing they feel are wrong. Do you want to be a test case. I think not.

[chris]

when I think of super tool former Sen. Yee comes to mind.

[pitbull30]

While I appreciate Bill's passion, I say let it go. If people want to push the envelope of legality I say go for it. It is up to the individual to know what is and what is not legal and how much of their life they are willing to risk over a magnet.

I'd prefer if people like him post on the internet about the new laws.

That's the problem, they don't know. And if no one tells them otherwise, they will believe the BS from some vendor, use this crap out at the range, and go to prison.

Any magnet vendor who demos his product slapping it on a featureless rifle or separated lower and mentions nothing how it's illegal to use on the vast majority of BB'd rifles in California is

A

****ing

Scumbag

As is anyone in California naive and/or stupid enough to use the magnet product on his weapon without researching the legalities.

No one is responsible for what you do, but you.

That's fine for us hobbyists who sit pontificating on a gun forum and know the nuances of the AW flowchart. These magnet vendors are targeting the ignorant 21 year old still living at home working at a Which Which, who doesn't realize a gun vendor would openly sell something that will make him a felon when he throws it on his M&P Sport he bought at Turner's last week.

The mag vendors damn well know this. But they won't help out by just saying, "Oh yeah, it's probably illegal to use this in California?"

I'll tell you what, that may not be illegal, but it sure is a dick move in my opinion.

Last year when the gun laws were soaring I attended a gun show in Glendale California to try and find some decent priced ammo like the rest of the U.S.

While walking around browsing there were one of these "magnet" vendors. I tried to do a google search just now, but I can not locate the name of the one I will discuss.

The sales person was saying they were legal as long as after you use it on your gun you remove it and place it on the clip-on button provided that you pin to your shirt. It was similar to a button you buy at disneyland, but it had the vendor name. They kept doing a demo on how it worked and people crowded around.

They were selling on 2 floors of the show for 20 dollars. Toward the end of the show she was announcing to people that they were selling for 10 now instead of 20 because she wanted to sell out and go home.

I only knew better because of someone here advising against them.

My guess is there are a lot of people out there who will eventually get in trouble.

I don't have any respect for a vendor or LGS who would do that to someone.

[hornswaggled]

Last year when the gun laws were soaring I attended a gun show in Glendale California to try and find some decent priced ammo like the rest of the U.S.

While walking around browsing there were one of these "magnet" vendors. I tried to do a google search just now, but I can not locate the name of the one I will discuss.

The sales person was saying they were legal as long as after you use it on your gun you remove it and place it on the clip-on button provided that you pin to your shirt. It was similar to a button you buy at disneyland, but it had the vendor name. They kept doing a demo on how it worked and people crowded around.

They were selling on 2 floors of the show for 20 dollars. Toward the end of the show she was announcing to people that they were selling for 10 now instead of 20 because she wanted to sell out and go home.

I only knew better because of someone here advising against them.

My guess is there are a lot of people out there who will eventually get in trouble.

I don't have any respect for a vendor or LGS who would do that to someone.

Magnet vendors have consistently been at the Crossroads of the West Gun Show in Del Mar for the past few years. Their demo is almost always the same. A man or a woman putting the magnet on and pulling it off again using a featureless rifle or separated lower. They just keep putting it on and pulling it off, *Click click.. click click. Click click click..." and saying to anyone watching, "See? It's a magnet. See? It's strong, a rare earth magnet. See? Now you can push." Then they push the mag release... *Push push push push push push*

[robertkjjj]

So?
You just do what I do. Keep your gun CA-legal while in CA, but when you're in AZ or NV(hunting or target shooting..) you just pop on those cool magazine release accessories and you're good to go.

Best of both worlds: you get to live near the ocean in beautiful CA, and you get to hunt in AZ using your AR the way GOD meant the darn gun to be in the first place.

Sorry, except for the fact that some of the buyers are ignorant, I don't see a problem. It's American capitalism at it's finest.

~~~~~~~~~~~

Magnet vendors have consistently been at the Crossroads of the West Gun Show in Del Mar for the past few years. Their demo is almost always the same. A man or a woman putting the magnet on and pulling it off again using a featureless rifle or separated lower. They just keep putting it on and pulling it off, *Click click.. click click. Click click click..." and saying to anyone watching, "See? It's a magnet. See? It's strong, a rare earth magnet. See? Now you can push." Then they push the mag release... *Push push push push push push*

[jaymz]

I've not seen eye to eye with some of the stuff Bill has posted over the years. But I can say that he always advocates to err on the side of caution, and his advice is generally spot on (though I don't always agree with his reasoning). No need to walk the grey area and risk life as you know it. Don't use magnetic magazine release tools in CA.

[robertkjjj]

No, I don't want to be a "test case".

But, I also don't want to be some super timid little man, constantly begging to have my constitutional rights, and tip-toeing around trying not to offend antis all the time. I'm a man, not some weak little simpering mouse.

I'm trying to strike a balance between obeying the laws, and recognizing the difference between what might happen vs what is likely to happen.

Sure, I COULD be struck by lightning, and I COULD die in a plane crash, and I COULD be attacked by a pit bull.....but, like being imprisoned for having a "strange" bullet button, ALL are extremely unlikely.
~~~~

I listen to what Bill says. Some don't. I've warned my friends to stay away from those magnet buttons. As we all know, the DOJ is always looking for thing they feel are wrong. Do you want to be a test case. I think not.

[Librarian]

Sure, I COULD be struck by lightning, and I COULD die in a plane crash, and I COULD be attacked by a pit bull.....but, like being imprisoned for having a "strange" bullet button, ALL are extremely unlikely.
~~~~

That wouldn't be the charge.

Most likely it would be manufacture, transportation, and possession of an unregistered 'assault weapon.

30600 (a) Any person who, within this state, manufactures or causes to be
manufactured, distributes, transports, or imports into the state,
keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives or lends
any assault weapon or any .50 BMG rifle, except as provided by this
chapter, is guilty of a felony, and upon conviction shall be punished
by imprisonment in the state prison for four, six, or eight years.

and

30605 (a) Any person who, within this state, possesses any assault weapon,
except as provided in this chapter, shall be punished by imprisonment
in a county jail for a period not exceeding one year, or by
imprisonment in the state prison.

Consider the life-altering effect of an eight-year stay in state prison. Compare that rather unlikely result to the benefit received from the device.

[five.five-six]

No, I don't want to be a "test case".

But, I also don't want to be some super timid little man, constantly begging to have my constitutional rights, and tip-toeing around trying not to offend antis all the time. I'm a man, not some weak little simpering mouse.

Go ahead, do it...DO IT! I dare you, I double dog dare you! Whats the worst that could happen?

Don't be timid, Librarian is just trying to scare you because he, like the NRA and the rest of CGN just want to take your rights away, Man!

[five.five-six]

What you don't understand about test cases, cases like McDonald, Heller, Peruta and Harrott were all very carefully chosen contests in a legal chess game.

Your "Leeroy Jenkins!" plan will not end well.

[IVC]

Beats the hell out of 600 word worthless posts......

You can choose not to read such posts, or you can wait until the comic book version is out - a 0.6 of a picture is worth a 600 words.

Why get involved if you don't want to read or discuss the posts?