Renna v Bonta - US Dist Ct So Cal, 11/2020 (Roster: PI granted and stayed 3-31-23)

[rrr70]

It's absurd that we even argue that the roster has to do with safe/unsafe handguns. The fact that certain groups are exempted shows that it's complete nonsense. Or are they going to argue that the laws of mechanical engineering change in the hands of a LEO?

No, they are arguing that certain “protected class” are much more capable that us peasants. Anyone who shot with LEOs know that it?s a BS, as most of them can barely qualify and don’t practice regularly.

[ar15barrels]

It's absurd that we even argue that the roster has to do with safe/unsafe handguns. The fact that certain groups are exempted shows that it's complete nonsense. Or are they going to argue that the laws of mechanical engineering change in the hands of a LEO?

Grits.
Kitchen.

[PrayForAmerica]

I keep thinking through the mechanics of the concept/constitutionality of a mother-may-I list in a post Heller/Bruen USA.
CA isn't the only state to try this silliness...
Sig's website lists:

That's a ton of states that think they can do some variation of this same thing.

If the concept of a list itself isn't struck down, even if the microstamping, LCI, MDM, and 3 for 1 clause is struck down, elements and requirements to be allowed to be listed on the UHA roster will only ramp up.

For goodness sake, Microstamping is ALREADY back on the calendar potentially for 2028. Bet-my-life, the yearly $200 fee will only increase (see CRPA's latest suit against LA County for $1,000+ CCW costs) knocking more items off the roster, and the gamesmanship will continue.

TL : DR, I'm REALLLLLYYYY hopeful for a clean sweep win in Renna, and that FPC really fights like hell as Steven Crowder puts it. This doesn't get as much coverage as the so-called "AW", ban, and standard capacity mag ban, but this UHA at is core is a massive issue that for precedent sake, cannot stand.

I hope and pray the conservative courts/judges are not asleep at the wheel

[AlmostHeaven]

I keep thinking through the mechanics of the concept/constitutionality of a mother-may-I list in a post Heller/Bruen USA.
CA isn't the only state to try this silliness...
Sig's website lists:

That's a ton of states that think they can do some variation of this same thing.

If the concept of a list itself isn't struck down, even if the microstamping, LCI, MDM, and 3 for 1 clause is struck down, elements and requirements to be allowed to be listed on the UHA roster will only ramp up.

For goodness sake, Microstamping is ALREADY back on the calendar potentially for 2028. Bet-my-life, the yearly $200 fee will only increase (see CRPA's latest suit against LA County for $1,000+ CCW costs) knocking more items off the roster, and the gamesmanship will continue.

TL : DR, I'm REALLLLLYYYY hopeful for a clean sweep win in Renna, and that FPC really fights like hell as Steven Crowder puts it. This doesn't get as much coverage as the so-called "AW", ban, and standard capacity mag ban, but this UHA at is core is a massive issue that for precedent sake, cannot stand.

I hope and pray the conservative courts/judges are not asleep at the wheel

Some of the states on the list do not have rosters that require manual listing and manufacturer submission, in the style of California. Instead, they have simple feature requirements.

Nonetheless, I completely agree with your position.

[WithinReason]

I keep thinking through the mechanics of the concept/constitutionality of a mother-may-I list in a post Heller/Bruen USA.
CA isn't the only state to try this silliness...
Sig's website lists:

That's a ton of states that think they can do some variation of this same thing.

If the concept of a list itself isn't struck down, even if the microstamping, LCI, MDM, and 3 for 1 clause is struck down, elements and requirements to be allowed to be listed on the UHA roster will only ramp up.

For goodness sake, Microstamping is ALREADY back on the calendar potentially for 2028. Bet-my-life, the yearly $200 fee will only increase (see CRPA's latest suit against LA County for $1,000+ CCW costs) knocking more items off the roster, and the gamesmanship will continue.

TL : DR, I'm REALLLLLYYYY hopeful for a clean sweep win in Renna, and that FPC really fights like hell as Steven Crowder puts it. This doesn't get as much coverage as the so-called "AW", ban, and standard capacity mag ban, but this UHA at is core is a massive issue that for precedent sake, cannot stand.

I hope and pray the conservative courts/judges are not asleep at the wheel

Agreed. I am hopeful for my children and grandchildren.

[PrayForAmerica]

Some of the states on the list do not have rosters that require manual listing and manufacturer submission, in the style of California. Instead, they have simple feature requirements.

Nonetheless, I completely agree with your position.

Interesting, I was wondering what their specifics were.
I clicked through several of the states, and noticed all I saw were far more expansive than CA.

Agreed. I am hopeful for my children and grandchildren.

Truth right???

Decades to decide in court; 6 months, down to a couple-weeks to sign a new law on the books.
Rinse and repeat.

[AlmostHeaven]

Interesting, I was wondering what their specifics were.
I clicked through several of the states, and noticed all I saw were far more expansive than CA.

Every implementation varies. Select requirements include trigger weight minimums, manual safeties, loaded-chamber indicators, and so on. The primary difference from California stems from a lack of manufacturers needing to undergo approval processes. In many of the states on the list, complying with the provisions automatically allows a handgun to become available for retail sale.

[PrayForAmerica]

Just been thinking about this case again the last few days. I messaged @FourBoxesDiner on X a long question about it, hoping he might see it and comment on it.

So if we're still waiting for the appeal on the PI at the Circuit court level, and the case itself is still winding through the District court as I understand it...
That means the next steps are:
= The 9th will EVENTUALLY rule on the PI appeal? Can they slow-walk these for years? Is there some limit?
= The District-level court docket, we got so deep in the weeds I lost the big picture I'M SO SORRY. I see alot of back and forth on the PI, and super helpful information posted earlier in this thread regarding how all that works. I understand that now thanks to you all. But what is ACTUALLY the next step big-picture wise? Has the case actually been argued yet at the district level? Or is it just what I would imagine is the discovery phase (am I even saying that correctly?). I was unable to find dates or timetables for where the case is or what the next steps are.

Merry Christmas all.

[TruOil]

Just been thinking about this case again the last few days. I messaged @FourBoxesDiner on X a long question about it, hoping he might see it and comment on it.

So if we're still waiting for the appeal on the PI at the Circuit court level, and the case itself is still winding through the District court as I understand it...
That means the next steps are:
= The 9th will EVENTUALLY rule on the PI appeal? Can they slow-walk these for years? Is there some limit?


Merry Christmas all.

Yes, the Ninth could delay the ruling on the preliminary injunction so long that the case could go to trial and a final judgment entered. If that happens, the PI appeal would become moot. This is because the appeal does not stay proceedings in the rial court. The Ninth wold love for that to happen, because as long as the appeal remains pending, enforcement of the law is not stayed, which I suspect a majority of the Court prefers things to be.

Sooner or later (I did not look) there will be a case management order that will set deadlines for completion of discovery, time to file motions for summary judgment, expert witness disclosure dates, and of course the trial date. If the judgment favors plaintiffs, then there will likely be yet another appeal from the final judgment, and the Ninth will likely stay the trial court judgment until the appeal is final.

[AlmostHeaven]

At least microstamping will remain enjoined throughout the duration of the Ninth Circuit deliberate strategy of delay.

[PrayForAmerica]

Okay so we'd see the case management order pop on the court listener page?
I had been watching at
courtlistener.com/docket/18619597/renna/?filed_after=&filed_before=&entry_gte=&entry_lte=& order_by=desc

Is that the correct place to be monitoring things?

And thank goodness @AlmostHeaven

[Offwidth]

At least microstamping will remain enjoined throughout the duration of the Ninth Circuit deliberate strategy of delay.

Nothing positive about that, is that is what will allow them to actually do 3 to 1 removal of grandfathered handguns starting January 1. And reenable microstamping in 2028. When Thomas and Alito are retired.

[AlmostHeaven]

Nothing positive about that, is that is what will allow them to actually do 3 to 1 removal of grandfathered handguns starting January 1. And reenable microstamping in 2028. When Thomas and Alito are retired.

I suppose we shall find out in two weeks whether the State of California will enforce the removal provision during the appeals process.

[PrayForAmerica]

Reno May in one of his videos said "I can't tell you much, but they won't be doing the 3 for 1. But that's all I can tell you". So fingers crossed that stays the case.

[AlmostHeaven]

Reno May in one of his videos said "I can't tell you much, but they won't be doing the 3 for 1. But that's all I can tell you". So fingers crossed that stays the case.

Great news, if true. Merry Christmas!