Need help with 450 Bushmaster loads.

[chestpubes2ballfro]

siringo thank you i read yours too. i ordered lil gun powder right after i read your results and its on the way yesterday! i already have some h110 from my savage muzzle loader 10ml. i will be trying both. thanks guys once again. siringo has anybody recovered any of these barnes at this velocity from game? petal separation? either way they will penetrate and be deadly.

[jagermaster]

My load with that bullet -- I use Lil'gun, 34.5 Grains. Velocity is 2,142 fps (16" barrel). Groups not a tight as Jagermaster's, but 1 1/2 inches. See my post on page 54.

Chestpubes2ballfro

See post # 533

Today went without a hitch. My new crony worked great and so did my reloads.

16in barrel
Trim Length 1.65
Bullet Barns 275gr Barns
Powder H110
No wind 54deg overcast
Readings 10ft from mussel
All shots taken from 100yds
Loaded length 2.26

29gr 1654fps
31gr 1771fps
33gr error
35gr 1805fps
37gr 1942fps
38gr 2004fps

35gr H110 5 rounds 3.5in group
1870fps
1821fps
1835fps
1854fps
1854fps ?if this was a good reading

37gr h110 5 rounds 3/4in group
1921fps
1957fps
1950fps
1969fps
1957fps

I think sunday I will load some more 37gr to replicate the 3/4in group.
I will also load some 37.5gr, 38gr, 38.5gr, and 39gr.
When I get a cord to download some picks I will

Siringo
What do you think the pressure level is at that velocity?
I wanted to hit 2100fps but I thought it would be out of the 38,000psi level.
Im working in that direction but was unsure.

Slash
Thanks for the compliment. That is the best group ever for me.
Most of my guns are not precision tools, even my Browning abolt 7mm rem mag with premium factory ammo will not produce groups like that.

[chestpubes2ballfro]

cool thanks guys there was a ton of info going back 50 pages it was hard to find it all. thanks for your help i hate to ask questions that have been asked before but i had to. this is going to be a good summer!

[Siringo]

275'r

Jagermaster -- I figure pressure has to be within the limits posted by Hornady for Lil'Gun charges. I interpolated between the 250 gr (37.9) and the 300 gr (32.2). The average of these would give a max charge of 35.0 gr. So, 34.5 should be within the limits.

I am going to try some of your load and see what I get. Great groups by the way!!!!

[Siringo]

siringo thank you i read yours too. i ordered lil gun powder right after i read your results and its on the way yesterday! i already have some h110 from my savage muzzle loader 10ml. i will be trying both. thanks guys once again. siringo has anybody recovered any of these barnes at this velocity from game? petal separation? either way they will penetrate and be deadly.

Regarding using 110 in the savage -- what powder charges were you using? I have a little experiment in mind. Did you ever use 5744?

I have used Barnes bullets in 30 cals for years and have never recovered a bullet. Wound channels were greater than conventional bullets so I have to assume they did their job. The 275 gr Barnes is made for the 460 S&W and that is working at the same velocities as we are with the 450.

[chestpubes2ballfro]

no more than 42 grains of h110 and 44 grains of 5744. i cant experiment with it at the moment as its being shipped next week from virginia to me by my father. now i have only used these two loads with mmp .452 to .50 sabots and magnum bases i swap the 250grn sst with the 250grn xtp mag with either powder. h110 runs about 2300 i have never shot 5744 over the chrony. i got both of these recipies from other forums. they have worked well for me. i did try a 200grn cast over these charges but accuracy was all over the sabots i recovered looked melted and maybe as if they didnt catch the rifling. maybe have been an undersized cast bullet though. dont know only fired it 5 times. w209 primers btw. what did you have in mind when i get my gun?

[Siringo]

no more than 42 grains of h110 and 44 grains of 5744. i cant experiment with it at the moment as its being shipped next week from virginia to me by my father. now i have only used these two loads with mmp .452 to .50 sabots and magnum bases i swap the 250grn sst with the 250grn xtp mag with either powder. h110 runs about 2300 i have never shot 5744 over the chrony. i got both of these recipies from other forums. they have worked well for me. i did try a 200grn cast over these charges but accuracy was all over the sabots i recovered looked melted and maybe as if they didnt catch the rifling. maybe have been an undersized cast bullet though. dont know only fired it 5 times. w209 primers btw. what did you have in mind when i get my gun?

Nothing -- I was curious about the level of powder charges and what the sabots will handle.

Where did you get your cannelure tool? Could you use that tool to put a cannelure in the case at the location of the relief groove on the Barnes bullet?

[chestpubes2ballfro]

i got mine from e-bay used but as far as i know its from buffalo arms company made by chd i think. you put it in the vise and turn the handle to roll the cutter. i dont see why you couldnt use it to groove the case in the groove on the barnes. i have debated this before. i have seen it used in 45 acp for bullet depth seating. if you had to use it twice in the same place i think itll damage the brass pretty bad. not sure though. you mean use it like a crimper?> as for how much the sabots will take i dont know ive been told not too much over 2300fps in the savage and i dont know what my pressure is. i would say about what we are running maybe about 40 thou. cant be sure. thats why i use the bases too. i feel it helps with flame cutting and blow by of the sabot. i am gonna try loading 40 cal bullets with 40 to 45 cal sabots if i can find the sabots and fit it in the 450 case. though it probably wont work or fit in the die. who knows till i try you know what the smallest caliber they make 45cal sabots for/.?

[Siringo]

i got mine from e-bay used but as far as i know its from buffalo arms company made by chd i think. you put it in the vise and turn the handle to roll the cutter. i dont see why you couldnt use it to groove the case in the groove on the barnes. i have debated this before. i have seen it used in 45 acp for bullet depth seating. if you had to use it twice in the same place i think itll damage the brass pretty bad. not sure though. you mean use it like a crimper?> as for how much the sabots will take i dont know ive been told not too much over 2300fps in the savage and i dont know what my pressure is. i would say about what we are running maybe about 40 thou. cant be sure. thats why i use the bases too. i feel it helps with flame cutting and blow by of the sabot. i am gonna try loading 40 cal bullets with 40 to 45 cal sabots if i can find the sabots and fit it in the 450 case. though it probably wont work or fit in the die. who knows till i try you know what the smallest caliber they make 45cal sabots for/.?

Yesterday I had loaded up 6 cases with the Hornady 45 caliber sabots. These sabots held a .400 caliber 200 grains SST Bullet. I used 5744 powder, starting at 20.0 grs and ending at 25.0 grains. I shot them over a Chronograph and had velocities that started at 1,259 fps with the 20 gr. charge and 1611 fps with the 25 gr. charge. My goal was to get to 2500 fps with this bullet. With the powder charges used the action would not lock open.

Recovered sabots had a small 1/2 circle piece of the sabot base missing. This missing piece was about .10 inches. Each sabot had this piece missing at the same location based up visual appearance of the rifling impressions on the sabot. This is most likely the diameter of the gas hole in the barrel. I am assuming that when the base of the sabot passes over the gas hole, the pressure blows the skirt into the hole because it is unsupported. All other portions of the sabot look OK.

At this point I am not going to proceed any further with shooting sabots in a gas gun -- unless a sabot is designed specially for this -- as it does have potential.

[chestpubes2ballfro]

damn you stole my idea i will scratch that though. thanks for the heads up. sucks the velocity was so low. does the sabot eat that much powder space? yeah i was trying to find some accelerator sabots in 45 but i dont think they make them. i found 50 cal and 30 cal, think the 50 cal could be put in a sizer with the bulet in the sabot and sized? those sabots are the heat and will stand up to 3800 fps in an 06 with a 223 cal bullet.

[Siringo]

damn you stole my idea i will scratch that though. thanks for the heads up. sucks the velocity was so low. does the sabot eat that much powder space? yeah i was trying to find some accelerator sabots in 45 but i dont think they make them. i found 50 cal and 30 cal, think the 50 cal could be put in a sizer with the bulet in the sabot and sized? those sabots are the heat and will stand up to 3800 fps in an 06 with a 223 cal bullet.

Regarding the low charges -- I started low and was working up until I hit a charge that would hold the bolt open -- just didn't get that far. With the sabot -- the case holds about 32 grs.

[chestpubes2ballfro]

yeah i think ill scratch that idea with the sabots. wow i have read this entire thread now. you guys have been doing your homework! people like you guys are whats going to make or break this platform/cartridge. its so useful and has so much potential. i hope i can take a decent size brown up here next year with it and a bou this year. thanks for the info siringo! shame the sabot was getting chewed up. try in your next batch if you progress this any further this idea. i use a sub base in my savage. try using a small amout of superglue to glue a sub base to the sabot. it could work wonders. it will eat powder space a good bit. might not be worth it. i cant wait to get all my toys from virginia to help you guys out.

[MudBug]

Just incase you didn't notice, 450b brass and the lever revolution 250 grn bullets have started showing up in stores.

[Siringo]

Just incase you didn't notice, 450b brass and the lever revolution 250 grn bullets have started showing up in stores.

I just picked up two boxes (50 each) of 250 grainers from Midway. For General shooting the 240's are about 1/2 the price.

[MudBug]

I just picked up two boxes (50 each) of 250 grainers from Midway. For General shooting the 240's are about 1/2 the price.

I ordered 2 boxes (50 x's 2) of brass from CTD but they only shipped one since they had already sold out. So I guess I got the last box from them.