Another gun store that doesn't do PPTs *Updated Post 42*

[Zedrek]

If they refered you to USA tactical don't go there. I was charged $50 for a ppt at USA tactical which is illegal. I was refered by ace guns

That's exactly what they did and I remembered your thread about it.

[xxINKxx]

Ades in Orange tried sending me away several times on a PPT. Owner was too busy reading people magazine, and the employees hanging out. Not a customer in sight. Got super snipity saying they are far too busy with estate sale paper work then deal with PPTs. And how they don't wanna do it because there's no profit for them.

F em them. I was going to buy a M1A from them. But since they are too busy with other non gun related stuff at a gun shop I went else where.

Customer service goes along way FYI.

[Decoligny]

Glad this got resolved.

An FFL not knowing, or choosing to not follow the law concerning their business practices is like a restaurant not knowing or choosing to not follow the health code.

You see rats and cockroaches in a restaurant, you call the health department.

You see FFLs acting like rats and cockroaches, you call the DOJ.

[diverwcw]

Excellent!

So I just received a phone call from the DOJ and they said that they absolutely have to do PPTs that it is not an option to opt out. The agent asked for the phone number of the shop and said that she would call and remind them of their duty to conduct PPTs. She was very friendly and totally agreed that if we have to do a PPT then they have to also.

Excellent! I'm sure a call from DOJ is the last thing an FFL wants to hear.

[I Swan]

Ades in Orange tried sending me away several times on a PPT. Owner was too busy reading people magazine, and the employees hanging out. Not a customer in sight. Got super snipity saying they are far too busy with estate sale paper work then deal with PPTs. And how they don't wanna do it because there's no profit for them.

F em them. I was going to buy a M1A from them. But since they are too busy with other non gun related stuff at a gun shop I went else where.

Customer service goes along way FYI.

I bought piles of guns there and even some ship ins even thoug they charge more then many. Her dad gave me bs on a ppt I didn't go back for a year and a half and since then have only bought one sub $200 gun.

His attitute literally cost them thousands in business. I spend an insane amount of my disposable income on guns and gun stuff. I only do ppt a few times a year. I dont have kids nor am I married so I indulge myself.

[Sharp Shooter]

So I just received a phone call from the DOJ and they said that they absolutely have to do PPTs that it is not an option to opt out. The agent asked for the phone number of the shop and said that she would call and remind them of their duty to conduct PPTs. She was very friendly and totally agreed that if we have to do a PPT then they have to also.

Z, are you going to follow up to see if she is going to make the call? She could have just been blowing smoke to get you to go away. Also you or someone should follow up with the shop in a few days to see if they've changed their PPT policy.

[44fred]

I would follow up as well. I'm thinking a phone call won't do much, but that's me. If its a low priority and DOJ doesn't have the time to enforce, nothing will change.
Don't worry guys, those of you that think it's ok for the LGS to turn down PPT's, AB1609 will fix that for ya.

[jeremiah12]

Perfect.

Good job. Hopefully a call sets them straight and they can follow the law like all of us. And, you've probably opened up a place for people to do PPTs.

I am glad if this works. Like I said previously, to follow the letter of the law, the request has to be in writing, refer to the thread I referenced earlier. Now luck for us, the owner of Ace Guns probably does not know the law that well to be able to say sorry, you did not present the request lawfully as per the code so I can refuse it. Or, I felt there was a straw purchase happening so I refused to do it.

There are lots of roadblocks and feet dragging he can do to make it look like he is doing PPTs but still make it a PITA to the people doing them. So go ahead and waste your time in his shop or go a mile down the road and do business with the new guy who wants it and will do PPTs gladly. He also will beat the price of Ace Guns on everything.

[jeremiah12]

Since we're talking about gun laws, why don't you tell us which ones you don't follow?

Well, I ain't stupid. Lets just say I have extended family members that have lived colorful lives. Believe me, the old school ways are best, personal connections, FTF and only deal with the people you know. Nothing over the phone, in writing, or these days over the Internet.

So, you want to know how things can be done, lets go talk over a beer in Nevada. I will take you on a tour to show you how the criminal element does their smuggling operations. It is kind of interesting to watch from a distance. Average people who are tired of CA bs laws buy much of this stuff.

Now, of course everything I have I have documentation to show I am in legal possession of. I just live my life to limit my contact with the government.

I have also spend a good chunk of money to get solid advice from a CA firearms attorney on how to stay legal while minimizing the amount of information the state knows about the guns I own. There are perfectly legal ways to do this.

[TonyNorCal]

I'm not interested.

Well, I ain't stupid. Lets just say I have extended family members that have lived colorful lives. Believe me, the old school ways are best, personal connections, FTF and only deal with the people you know. Nothing over the phone, in writing, or these days over the Internet.

So, you want to know how things can be done, lets go talk over a beer in Nevada. I will take you on a tour to show you how the criminal element does their smuggling operations. It is kind of interesting to watch from a distance. Average people who are tired of CA bs laws buy much of this stuff.

Now, of course everything I have I have documentation to show I am in legal possession of. I just live my life to limit my contact with the government.

I have also spend a good chunk of money to get solid advice from a CA firearms attorney on how to stay legal while minimizing the amount of information the state knows about the guns I own. There are perfectly legal ways to do this.

[Zedrek]

Z, are you going to follow up to see if she is going to make the call? She could have just been blowing smoke to get you to go away. Also you or someone should follow up with the shop in a few days to see if they've changed their PPT policy.

Yeah, I was going to follow up in a little while and see. It didn't sound like she was blowing smoke. She seemed really personable and thanked me for letting them know.


I've bought a consignment gun from Ace Guns before and have nothing against them. I've only done a PPT once and that was me selling a gun. I met the buyer at Tracy Rifle and Pistol which was about halfway between the both of us. I ended up spending the $900 I made there along with another $400 to $500. They were fast and didn't bat an eye so I had no problem giving them my money. I don't know why Ace Guns would not want that?

[Gryff]

I've only done a PPT once and that was me selling a gun. I met the buyer at Tracy Rifle and Pistol which was about halfway between the both of us. I ended up spending the $900 I made there along with another $400 to $500. They were fast and didn't bat an eye so I had no problem giving them my money. I don't know why Ace Guns would not want that?

I also did a PPT on a pistol slae at TRAP last month. Turned around and gave them all the money I made plus another $2000+ to buy an unfired FN SCAR that they had on the Used rack.

Only a moron FFL treats a PPT like it's a burden rather than an opportunity.

[jeremiah12]

I'm not interested.

Well, you asked. I was just offering. Great grand-dad was a moonshine runner. I still 4-wheel the roads he used. Step-dad is a reformed Hells Angels. He was reformed when my mom married him. But he still still showed me the old roads and introduced me to friends of friends. I keep my nose clean, but I know how things work on the streets.

I also have been around long enough to see many of the older generation (older than me and I have been around long enough to remember when JFK was president) that still to this day sell their guns to each other FTF without using an FFL. Most have never been arrested for anything in their lives. Their attitude is I bought this gun so long ago and it has never been registered and it is nobody's business but my own if I decide to sell it to someone else. If you ask them if they are worried about being caught and going to jail they say for what, I am not a criminal, the state and feds only go after the real criminals. They could care less about me. Besides, who is going to tell them.

These are the same guys that CC without permits and have been doing it there entire lives. That is what they have done and they have never been bothered. Now, it could be that is a regional thing, having been born and raised in the Central Valley. I still spend time with the old farmers and that is there attitude. I also have contact with a lot of people in the Sierras and eastern CA and many of the long time locals there have that attitude also.

[Zedrek]

Well, you asked. I was just offering. Great grand-dad was a moonshine runner. I still 4-wheel the roads he used. Step-dad is a reformed Hells Angels. He was reformed when my mom married him. But he still still showed me the old roads and introduced me to friends of friends. I keep my nose clean, but I know how things work on the streets.

I also have been around long enough to see many of the older generation (older than me and I have been around long enough to remember when JFK was president) that still to this day sell their guns to each other FTF without using an FFL. Most have never been arrested for anything in their lives. Their attitude is I bought this gun so long ago and it has never been registered and it is nobody's business but my own if I decide to sell it to someone else. If you ask them if they are worried about being caught and going to jail they say for what, I am not a criminal, the state and feds only go after the real criminals. They could care less about me. Besides, who is going to tell them.

These are the same guys that CC without permits and have been doing it there entire lives. That is what they have done and they have never been bothered. Now, it could be that is a regional thing, having been born and raised in the Central Valley. I still spend time with the old farmers and that is there attitude. I also have contact with a lot of people in the Sierras and eastern CA and many of the long time locals there have that attitude also.

Wow, so much fail there. Wait until those dumb***'s get caught carrying their concealed firearm and get charged with a felony because it's not registered in their name. As you said in an earlier post "we ARE our own worst enemys".

[uhlan1]

Keyboard commandos. Hope he realizes no one is anonymous here and CalDOJ is all over this site.