AR15 / 5.56 for pigs?

[Tanner68]

Different players and the same story. There are a couple of these threads over in the hunting forum(223/pigs, 223/bears, 223/africa everything, etc.). There are several running jokes based on them.

[Cowboy T]

I'm seeing barbs being traded back 'n' forth, and egos getting in the way, on both sides of this issue. That's unfortunate, and at this point, "who started it" doesn't help much. It's still unfortunate. Let's keep it technical, folks.

I happen to know that a .223 will put down a pig. But the key is to use the right bullet and enough velocity, combined with proper shot placement. You "can" shoot a pig with an FMJ, yes, and eventually it may die if the little pill doesn't tumble. Of course, as tough as pigs can be, it may well heal right up over the next few weeks if that happens. On the other hand, if the FMJ does tumble, that can do a lot of damage internally and drop the animal right there. But it's got to tumble.

This is where the modern expanding bullets help out a great deal. If you were to use, say, a Barnes TSX, a Trophy Bonded Bear Claw, or similar, then that'll tend to give you good performance. Not only will they expand, but if they also tumble, it's lights-out for the oinker and pork chops on your dinner table.

My personal choice would typically be the Mosin or the .44M levergun, not so much because the .223 loaded properly will not drop the hog, but rather because I like casting bullets. At typical cast "boolit" velocities, I want something heavy, say, 200+ gr, and at BHN 12 or so. This also applies to rifles chambered for revolver cartridges like .357M, .44M, .45 LC, and such; the heavier you can feasibly get away with, the better. The slower you go, the less of a shock wave you put to the animal's innards, and so the bigger a hole you need to punch. That's why bullets were so big back in the black powder days (e. g. .45-70, .50-70, the Sharps cartridges, .45 Colt, and so on). And then the high-velocity Mauser cartridges came out and taught us all a lesson about ballistics. :-)

[cannon]

yup... as in way I bolded "Your requirement"...and why I offered others requirements and views on this issue.... you need to lighten up yourself. just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they are snotty and argumentative. This was a debate thread...which means each poster offers content adding to or contradicting the other posters....

My mistake. In reading the OP I thought it was a discussion where ideas and opinions would be exchanged and the participants could decide which would work best for them as opposed to a debate where sides were chosen and each side tried to convince the other of their correctness.

[Oneaudiopro]

Hmmm

Just for everyones info........
In this months issue of Outdoor Life there was an article that stated "Legions of deer hunters in Texas prefer the .223".

[dieselpower]

My mistake. In reading the OP I thought it was a discussion where ideas and opinions would be exchanged and the participants could decide which would work best for them as opposed to a debate where sides were chosen and each side tried to convince the other of their correctness.

Yup, you are 100% correct... now lets go line for line and see who is turning ant hills into mountains

Cannon- Pigs are pretty tough critters. Agreed. No one is arguing that

Cannon- I would not be comfortable hunting them with a 223/5.56. I replied-Many people have that opinion, those people also shouldn't bow hunt pig / deer...for an arrow doesn't have that penetration YOU REQUIRE either.

Cannon- I just don't feel this caliber has the penetration and wound channel for the job. See my last reply above This is critical...why? Because the .223 in fact has more than enough penetration.. YOU just don't "feel" it does.

The reason you are mad and on the defensive with me (as is another poster here) is I am challenging you to THINK. You are not used to or don't like people doing that. No one does.

So you are the one who needs to lighten up...as does another poster who thinks nothing of insulting a person he doesn't know and then cry's foul when that person defends himself.

I didn't insult you, I simply pointed out where your "feelings" and comfort level were not based on facts. Its like a computer telling you SYNTAX ERROR... I am sorry that upsets you.

There are THOUSANDS of Hunters who protest AGAINST Bow Season. They say an arrow doesn't meet their requirements for ethical killing.

There are THOUSANDS of Hunters who say Hunting with a scope and 30 cal rifle isn't true hunting... that's just gathering food and any 18 year old can do it just as good as a 50 year veteran.

There are THOUSANDS of Hunters who say the .223 is fine to take deer and pig. They are supported by modern science, physics and the fact they do it year after year without incident.

There are THOUSANDS of Hunters who support Bow season, scoped rifles, shotguns, Black Powder Hunting, Trapping and what ever it takes to put meat on your table.

People don't like me because I slap reality into threads. Instead of getting defensive and going after me tossing insults...how about you do what I did and CHALLENGE MY SCIENCE, AND MY LOGIC.

[pistolero805]

Why not use 6.8 with 110 tsx?

[Freedomisntfree]

I lol'd . Here is my answer, self serving as hell.

No, pigs are immune to extremely fast moving , devastatingly lethal .223.
So pick a different caliber and stop buying all the .223 up.

[fabguy]

50 Beowulf seems to be a more popular choice these days for hog. I bought one for that reason.
Any experienced and well educated hunter can hunt with just about any caliber. These guys know when to and when not to take a shot at an animal.

[Neptune]

I'm not reading all of the crap on this thread.

Having said that, an AR is fine as long as you're shooting a heavy cartridge. .458 SOCOM, .50 Beowulf, and other heavy cartridges would be ideal, but the standard .233/ 5.56 would be somewhat underpowered.

Pigs are tough and can take a lot of abuse before going down. It's only fair to the animal to put it down responsibly. It also saves you a lot of time tracking animals that you might end up losing otherwise.



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[bombadillo]

I'll stick to heavier stuff even though you CAN kill a pig with as small as a .22 caliber round. Lots WOULD work, but I prefer a bit more oomph behind it. Even an "Old" round like the .45-70 would do the job just fine out of a nice lever action. My go-to gun is a hot loaded 250gr hard cast .44mag though.

[dieselpower]

I'm not reading all of the crap on this thread.

Having said that, an AR is fine as long as you're shooting a heavy cartridge. .458 SOCOM, .50 Beowulf, and other heavy cartridges would be ideal, but the standard .233/ 5.56 would be somewhat underpowered.

Pigs are tough and can take a lot of abuse before going down. It's only fair to the animal to put it down responsibly. It also saves you a lot of time tracking animals that you might end up losing otherwise.



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I hear a 20lb bag of blackpowder or TNT as a IED works good too.... you just need a power source and a trip switch, then stand back and make some bacon at the same time....

[Divernhunter]

You convinced me. I will leave home my 338win mag and 25-06 I worked so hard working up loads for when I head to Africa. I have seen the light and been educated by a young dog so will just take a 223 as that is all I need. For Wildebeest(blue or black) or Kudu should I use 40gr or 55gr or maybe something heavier?? Just asking being the expert you are and since you have it all figured out?? I would take an AR15 but they are not legal. Any suggestions for a rifle that is not semi-auto. South Africa does not allow semi-auto rifles. But since I cannot take the only rifle that is usefull, according to an expert, maybe I should just not go?
Open for meaningful answers from a young dog since us old dogs know nothing and have been doing it wrong for so many years.

[mif_slim]

It's called common sense. If your dumb enough to take a 5.56 to hunt a 2k lbs animal then maybe you shouldn't be hunting....

[bombadillo]

Knowing MY shooting and MY rifle, whats the difference between a 2k lb animal and a 300-400lb piece of rawhide with some major teeth coming at you faster than you can run??? Thats what is being promoted here.

[dieselpower]

Knowing MY shooting and MY rifle, whats the difference between a 2k lb animal and a 300-400lb piece of rawhide with some major teeth coming at you faster than you can run??? Thats what is being promoted here.

dude... people have been hunting hog, deer elk and bear with freaking bows and arrows for years.

if you are trying to convince us that the .223 doesnt have ability that an freaking arrow has...you need a few science lessons.

Let me give you examples....
I FEEL people shouldnt drive over 65mph.
This is the same as your FEELING we shouldnt hunt deer and pig with a .223.

Now barring mechanical problems and driver ability..am I correct? NO, science and fact tells me my FEELING is unfounded and incorrect as to reality. The same as your FEELING about the .223. Science and reality do not support your claim that the round can't do the job when deployed correctly.

...or do you think because a drunk driver can't maintain proper control at 75mph we all need to be limited to 55mph?