Gun World Burbank - never going back (rant)

[RoadKing]

Is it really that hard to be friendly, professional and thoughtful regarding high end gun purchases?

Went to Gun World in Burbank so my wife could look at high end 1911's. Walked in, said HI, and answered the obligatory "what can i help you with?" question. Said we needed to look at some high end 1911's. Gun World carries Nighthawk, Wilson Combat, Les Bear, Ed Brown... and the wife wants a NICE 1911. Went into the back, where there were only a couple Ed Browns in that category. No problem, the wife hasn't held one of those before and it was a good chance to compare trigger pulls and slide action to the nighthawks, springfields, kimbers and les bears we looked at the day before.

Asked the employee to pull out the Ed Brown so my wife could look it over. At the point she got the gun, she noticed it was zip tied shut and could not be manipulated.

Me: She needs to rack the slide a few times and pull the trigger to see how it compares to the other 1911s.
Employee: You can't rack the slide and pull the trigger.
Me: I am not going to buy an expensive 1911 without checking the slide and pulling the trigger
Employee: That's an Ed Brown, you're not going to rack the slide and pull the trigger
Me: Then I am not going to buy anything from you.

We then left and I am still extremely annoyed with the BS there. I have been there a number of times to look at firearms over the last 10 years, very infrequently but that shouldn't matter, and there has always been an attitude. I was hoping it had changed since I had not been there in a number of years.

So yes, before everyone chimes in with it, I am making my displeasure known by using my wallet ( or in this case my wife's paycheck ) and spending my $2-3k somewhere else!

Do you buy cars without a test drive? Do you buy high end equipment without a demonstration? REALLY!!! And to add to that I have an issue with the whole zip tie the gun shut deal. How exactly do you know the gun is unloaded??? It made my wife very uncomfortable to handle the firearm because she could not verify that it was safe and unloaded.

I would also add that it really infuriates me that a company displays the Calguns banner and makes it look like it is affiliated / friendly to members and gun owners when all it really is is just a stunt to try and get more business from Calgunners.

Seeing as how there is a Calguns banner in the window, hopefully someone at Gun World will read this and maybe they will do something with their employees and it will help them out. Gun owners in this state have enough garbage to deal with already, we don't need a problem gun store to add to it.

End Rant...

RoadKing

[protoolsnerd]

Well deserved rant . I've only gone in there when it was absolutely necessary that i had to get an accessory . Their prices are 2-300 more then standard retail and their staff leaves a lot to be desired .

I'm not sure how they're still in business . I don't know anyone who's bought guns from them. Hell even the one employee that was nice and helpful ( prob no longer there ) admitted that the prices are outlandish . I second the motion to remove their banner. They're a joke

[dieselpower]

I'm not spending $3k for a firearm with a scratch on it... think about it.

while I understand your rant... I disagree with it. A Glock, A Sig... fine go ahead finger it all you want.

Try walking into the Ferrari dealership and ask for a test drive. See what happens. After the credit check, they will ask to see your Car Ins POLICY. They may even call to check your coverage limits....then maybe if you pass with flying colors you will get to take it for a spin...if not you will need to jump through more hoops.

In my gun shop you are not playing with my $3K firearms either....sorry man. It just makes sense. You want to hand over a non-refundable "playing" fee..ok. Either that or you will need to be a very regular customer who I trust and know.

[Cali-Shooter]

What's with all these bad FFL's in Burbank?

This one still rings a bell:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=433717

[AleksandreCz]

Roadking I can completly see your point But then aggain I can see the stores point its weird and messed up thing that the stores have to deal with Let you potentialy scratch or damage the gun or protect the gun for future sale ?

[RoadKing]

I'm not spending $3k for a firearm with a scratch on it... think about it.

while I understand your rant... I disagree with it. A Glock, A Sig... fine go ahead finger it all you want.

Try walking into the Ferrari dealership and ask for a test drive. See what happens. After the credit check, they will ask to see your Car Ins POLICY. They may even call to check your coverage limits....then maybe if you pass with flying colors you will get to take it for a spin...if not you will need to jump through more hoops.

In my gun shop you are not playing with my $3K firearms either....sorry man. It just makes sense. You want to hand over a non-refundable "playing" fee..ok. Either that or you will need to be a very regular customer who I trust and know.

Dieselpower, while you have a right to not want anyone to play with your guns, the customer has a right to actually see and handle what they are purchasing. Sorry, but racking a slide and pulling a trigger will not damage a 1911. Its not like we want to disassemble it and possibly put an "idiot scratch" on it while putting it back together.
Oh, and I have test driven quite a few very expensive cars at dealerships without any sort of "fee" or requirements to try them, and guess what, I now own one of them. See, if you want people to spend money on expensive items, they get to at least verify fit and function before dropping cash on them.
And we purchasers really appreciate when you assume we are all know nothings who are going to damage your wares. People like me make a point of frequenting and purchasing items from places that treat us right, especially when they do it the first time, without having to be bullied into it by the customer.

[savannah]

I am brand new to guns and have probably only been in 10 different gun stores. I have seen two guns dropped on the floor!

While I do understand wanting to know exactly what you are buying, I would be really worried about handing an expensive gun over and have it scratched or worse dropped. Honestly, I don't know what the answer is except perhaps have good conversation before you ask for a test drive. I couldn't believe watching two different guns hit the floor.

[rimfire78]

You probably should have gone with a softer approach, and asked if he had any snap caps your wife could use to rack the slide and pull the trigger.
That being said, I've only had bad experiences at Gun World over the years. And they cost 30% more than anyone else for everything so why shop there anyway?

[Jeepers]

We then left and I am still extremely annoyed with the BS there. I have been there a number of times to look at firearms over the last 10 years, very infrequently but that shouldn't matter, and there has always been an attitude. I was hoping it had changed since I had not been there in a number of years.

you say yourself no offence that you have gone to the store to do "tire kicking" and now you want to finger a spendy 1911 and dry fire it and wonder why they dont let you

[dieselpower]

Dieselpower, while you have a right to not want anyone to play with your guns, the customer has a right to actually see and handle what they are purchasing. Sorry, but racking a slide and pulling a trigger will not damage a 1911. Its not like we want to disassemble it and possibly put an "idiot scratch" on it while putting it back together.
Oh, and I have test driven quite a few very expensive cars at dealerships without any sort of "fee" or requirements to try them, and guess what, I now own one of them. See, if you want people to spend money on expensive items, they get to at least verify fit and function before dropping cash on them.
And we purchasers really appreciate when you assume we are all know nothings who are going to damage your wares. People like me make a point of frequenting and purchasing items from places that treat us right, especially when they do it the first time, without having to be bullied into it by the customer.

when I was going to college I worked at a Ferrari dealership... No, you don't test drive a $200,000 car without going through a vetting process...its NOT HAPPENING. Yeah I have test driven dozens of expensive cars myself...a $50,000 benz and a QUARTER MILLION DOLLAR SPORTS CAR ARE NOT THE SAME THING MY FRIEND...

I am sorry to inform you of this...but just because you got spending cash doesn't mean you get the 5 star treatment at all shops. I know this is a shot to the ego...but its not always about you. The shop has to look out for itself too and letting every tom dick and harry "play" with the top shelf items isnt a very good business plan.

I understand the salesman read you wrong. But its his job to protect the merchandise from "accidents". If you would have showed him you were actually going to buy the firearm he would have allowed you to play with it first. Other then that you were just a guy who wanted to goof off with a very expensive firearm.

Let me put it this way...
I want to drive this Ferrari 458 Spider.
You are not driving that Ferrari without a down payment.
But I need to know that its a fast car?
Its a Ferrari..its fast.
Well then I am not buying that car without playing with it first...

and I bet the salesman waved goodbye as you walked out of the gun store...laughing his butt off at the customer who thought a $3k custom hand made 1911 was going to be crap...

I am sure there are plenty of store that will let you play with expensive firearms..its not that big a deal...but to blast one store for NOT allowing any guy off the street to play is a little foolhardy don't you think...little high on your ego don't you think?

If and when it happens again...do what serious buyers do...slap the CC, DL and HSC on the counter first and say, I am going to buy one of these...

Once a salesman sees you are really serious, he will loosen his belt a little and allow you some slack....

[RoadKing]

Its kind of funny, but there are two completely different items being discussed here.

First, there is the ability to manipulate a firearm, regardless of cost, before you put down money for it.

Second, people are talking about people damaging someone elses property by doing something clumsy or stupid.

Fine, if that is your actual worry, have them demonstrate on cheaper firearm to show they know how to manipulate it, then let them try it on the expensive one. In a retail shop in the real world, the answer "That's a _____, you can't try it" doesn't cut it. If the shop doesn't want the sale, fine, but that is not going to get people to buy from you.

If you walk into a china shop and knock over a display of fine china, guess what, you are responsible for the damage. If you go into a gun store and damage an item that is for sale, you are responsible for that damage.

Properly manipulating a firearm to test function (as much as you can without actually firing it) does not cause damage to the gun.

Roadking

[dieselpower]

Its kind of funny, but there are two completely different items being discussed here.

First, there is the ability to manipulate a firearm, regardless of cost, before you put down money for it.

Second, people are talking about people damaging someone elses property by doing something clumsy or stupid.

Fine, if that is your actual worry, have them demonstrate on cheaper firearm to show they know how to manipulate it, then let them try it on the expensive one. In a retail shop in the real world, the answer "That's a _____, you can't try it" doesn't cut it. If the shop doesn't want the sale, fine, but that is not going to get people to buy from you.

If you walk into a china shop and knock over a display of fine china, guess what, you are responsible for the damage. If you go into a gun store and damage an item that is for sale, you are responsible for that damage.

Properly manipulating a firearm to test function (as much as you can without actually firing it) does not cause damage to the gun.

Roadking

No you are NOT financially responsible for damages to a firearm a salesman allowed you to play with...No, if you accidentally knock over a display, you are NOT responsible for the damages...until a court says so...and that isn't happening without negligence...that's what insurance is for.

Once again, I am sorry they hurt your feelings by not allowing your wife to play with a $3k firearm....but I am not going to support you on this one. You gave them no true indication of intent to buy and from what you have stated they don't really know you. I can bet the owners instruction to the staff is this...NO ONE REMOVES THOSE ZIP-TIES WITHOUT MY EXPRESS PERMISSION AND DON'T ASK IF THE BUYER DOESN'T APPEAR GENUINE.

Based on what you have said, I am on the clerks side. If you would have asked for the owner...a manager..or extended some offer expressing that you were 100% going to buy it if the slide and trigger were in OPERATIONAL, I would be on your side. "Liking" the trigger of a $3K firearm isn't a condition of buying it...that like saying if the Ferrari doesn't handle as well as I like...

[RoadKing]

No you are NOT financially responsible for damages to a firearm a salesman allowed you to play with...No, if you accidentally knock over a display, you are NOT responsible for the damages...until a court says so...and that isn't happening without negligence...that's what insurance is for.

Once again, I am sorry they hurt your feelings by not allowing your wife to play with a $3k firearm....but I am not going to support you on this one. You gave them no true indication of intent to buy and from what you have stated they don't really know you. I can bet the owners instruction to the staff is this...NO ONE REMOVES THOSE ZIP-TIES WITHOUT MY EXPRESS PERMISSION AND DON'T ASK IF THE BUYER DOESN'T APPEAR GENUINE.

Based on what you have said, I am on the clerks side. If you would have asked for the owner...a manager..or extended some offer expressing that you were 100% going to buy it if the slide and trigger were in OPERATIONAL, I would be on your side. "Liking" the trigger of a $3K firearm isn't a condition of buying it...that like saying if the Ferrari doesn't handle as well as I like...

I wrote a whole big long resopnse to your last post, and then accidentally erased it... so I am just going to respond to this one.

I would disagree. Maybe you are not LEGALLY/FINANCIALLY responsible and maybe YOU would walk away after destroying property belonging to someone else, but that is not what should happen and is not what I am accustomed to doing.

I am a customer, it is not my job to sell the product to myself, it is the salespersons job to sell the product. If the sale is conditional upon testing the trigger and the operation of the slide, then the salesperson should go ask if they were truly required to. The manager can always come tell me no if that is the final answer. The salesperson didn't make any attempt to make a sale and I don't need to deal with the guy who doesn't want or care to make a sale to the point of being rude.

And yes, "liking" the trigger and slide of a $3k firearm IS a condition of buying it.

And lets put this into perspective a little, the day before at Martin B. Retting, despite being slammed with customers, the salesman took out every 1911 my wife wanted to try, set them up with snap caps, and let her rack the slide and dry fire them all one after the other to feel the difference between them.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

I wrote a whole big long resopnse to your last post, and then accidentally erased it...

Butter fingers!!!

[drkphibr]

Dieselpower, while you have a right to not want anyone to play with your guns, the customer has a right to actually see and handle what they are purchasing. Sorry, but racking a slide and pulling a trigger will not damage a 1911. Its not like we want to disassemble it and possibly put an "idiot scratch" on it while putting it back together.
Oh, and I have test driven quite a few very expensive cars at dealerships without any sort of "fee" or requirements to try them, and guess what, I now own one of them. See, if you want people to spend money on expensive items, they get to at least verify fit and function before dropping cash on them.
And we purchasers really appreciate when you assume we are all know nothings who are going to damage your wares. People like me make a point of frequenting and purchasing items from places that treat us right, especially when they do it the first time, without having to be bullied into it by the customer.

+1 ^

If I'm going to lay down $2-$3,000 on a gun and you won't let me rack the slide and pull the trigger (ummm, exactly what it was designed and built to do - what do you think they did at the shop while building it?) then you've just lost my business. Fine by you and fine by me as there will be a shop that will understand it's a TOOL (albeit an expensive one) that was made to be used. I'm not asking to take it apart or bounce it off the counter, so don't treat me like a child who doesn't know what he's doing. Money talks and I have no issues spending it with a shop that knows how to treat paying customers.