"No Sales To CA?"

[Kynoch]

How come so many on-line arms sellers (particularly the small ones via places like Gunbroker and Gunsamerica) refuse to ship any firearms (seemingly of any type) to California?

Am I missing something? Is a 460 Wby. bolt now a banned firearm? I can see where some firearms may get a bit sticky in terms of legality but a bolt action or a single shot rifle under .50 ?

Are there other laws the sellers are trying to avoid or are they just acting hurt? Thanks.

[stew71]

I think many of them just want to avoid any and all hassles dealing with our idiotic gun laws. I'm sure some are making a political statement of sorts.

It sucks. I've missed out on some sweet Ruger #1's because the dealer doesn't want to deal with California at all.

And we all know how dangerous those nasty ol' #1's can be.

[RedDawn]

It's been discussed several times.

Basically there are some reasons why they're not selling to Californians.

1. The seller has an axe to grind. He/she feels we're not doing enough to stop our state legislatures from coming up with anti-American gun laws, so they are punishing us by not selling to Californians.

2. The seller does not know enough about California gunlaws, and would rather be safe than sorry and not have to deal with it altogether.

3. There is a little bit of extra work the seller must do to sell to California. They must first get an approval number before shipment into california, so some don't think it's worth the extra effort to earn our business.

[MrSlippyFist]

Lazy backwoods dealers that think we're all treehugging hippies.

[Josh3239]

I am sure most of these places are small shops, kitchen counter FFLs, pawnbrokers, etc who have no interest in joining the CFLC program. If you can convince an FFL to join, I am sure they'd ship what you wanted. The private sellers just don't know our laws and don't want to risk an arrest. In my experience, about 50% of the private sellers will agree to ship to you if you email them and teach them the laws and explain that it is legal and your dealer will accept it, etc.

[toby]

All these reasons and triplicate paper work, not worth their time. can you blame them I guess they do well enough without us? I have turned to Davidsons guns, or here for my purchaces.

[Josh3239]

The paperwork stuff is BS. If they have a printer and 30 seconds to write some basic info about what they are shipping then they have enough time for the "extra paper work".

[Fate]

The paperwork stuff is BS.

I agree 100%.

If they have a printer and 30 seconds to write some basic info about what they are shipping then they have enough time for the "extra paper work".

Oh...you meant it that way. The paperwork IS B.S. and not something anyone should have to put up with. I stand with Free America.

[tacticalcity]

It's been discussed several times.

Basically there are some reasons why they're not selling to Californians.

1. The seller has an axe to grind. He/she feels we're not doing enough to stop our state legislatures from coming up with anti-American gun laws, so they are punishing us by not selling to Californians.

2. The seller does not know enough about California gunlaws, and would rather be safe than sorry and not have to deal with it altogether.

3. There is a little bit of extra work the seller must do to sell to California. They must first get an approval number before shipment into california, so some don't think it's worth the extra effort to earn our business.

All three are true, and aside from the fact that it effects me negatively, all 3 are valid. We are not doing enough to get our politicians in line, our laws are so confusing that the only reason I bothered to learn them is I live here, and it is a ton of work to constantly keep up with all the changes and all the contradictory and confusing laws and procedures we have.

So as frustrated, and even angry as I get with sellers who take that approach, I can't exactly blame them. Dealing with us means increased risk, paperwork and effort for them. If anyone is to blame, we are. I know no one wants to hear that, but it is true. We simply have not done enough to change our laws, change the public perception and elect pro-gun politicians. We are making headway however, largely thanks to Calguns.net.

The gun industry is not the only one effected by our left wing politics. Lots of business run from California as fast as they can. With our over regulation and extremely high taxes this is not a friendly place to be if you are a business, regardless of what you sell.

My father owns a vineyard. If you think we have it bad, you should see the crap he as to deal with from local officials, state officials, and the Feds. Many with their own agenda, such as moral beliefs against the consumption of alcohol, or financial interests with large corporations in the industry they are supposed to be regulating, that causes them to intentionally make life difficult for him (much the way Iggy and others at the DOJ did during the early days of OLLs). Makes it almost not worth doing for him. Family tradition, and a sense of purpose keep him carrying on. That and the fact that he loves doing it. Trust me, its not the money. That is a very costly business to be in, unless you're one of the big boys.

So if it helps any, rest assured the gun industry is not the only one royally getting the shaft here in California.

[brando]

The irony being the people they are punishing by refusing to sell to CA gun owners are really the only people actually fighting the laws and as a consequence they are rewarding the anti-gun folks.

Remember when any criticism of the Administration was answered with "why do you hate America?" When I'm faced with someone refusing to sell to me because I'm in CA, I just respond "why do you love liberals?"

[faterikcartman]

Deleted: Researched and answered my own question.

[God Bless The Mauser]

I really like when I see "WE SHIP TO CA" on some of those places.

[1811]

EASY..SCREW THOSE BASTARDS! Plenty other places to spend your coin!

[tacticalcity]

What does a private, non-dealer, out of state seller have to do in order to ship an approved on-roster handgun to an FFL in California? Does anyone have a link to an explanation or flowchart?

What happens and who is in trouble if they don't do the things required above?

That is a very good question. There are a few experts on here, usually I refer people to Bill Wise, who might be able to answer it.

Last week there was a post about somebody receiving a Taurus Judge a customer had sent their without their knowledge, considered a Short Barrelled Shotgun and thus illegal (not going to explain why it is here but it is, find the many posts discussing why on your own). The initial report said DOJ not only confiscated the item but took a bunch of paperwork with them regarding other sales completely unrelated to that one. Might not turn into anything, then again it might. So it definately creates a headache for the receiving FFL even if he had no prior knowledge of it. From what I understand, that FFL called the DOJ for advice on what to do with it, opening a can of worms for himself.

[MrPlink]

These vendors aren't trying to punish us, I assure you. As a businessman you don't have time to make such descriminations. Its fear and ignorance, pure and simple.

Openly excluding customers is marketing in reverse, and as idiotic as many FFLs can be, I really doubt its the case for the majority of them.