...

[sandiego67]

[Cokebottle]

That will be news to the CDFA:
https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/plant/pe/Ext...n/borders.html

Ask them to show you the authorization in the law.

They can't.

They can SAY anything they want, just as the DOJ says that the 03/COE 1-every-30 exemption only applies to C&R handguns, but it is not in the law.

You have the 4th amendment right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure. You have the 5th amendment right to remain silent. We also have 526 US 489 allowing freedom of movement between states, so being told that you can't enter and must turn around is also illegal.

No LEO has legal authority to search or question you without either your consent, or probable cause.
Search for probable cause requires the officer to be able to articulate justification for the search that would be sufficient for a judge to issue a search warrant. Suspect items in plain sight would justify probable cause.

Driving a passenger vehicle through a checkpoint without speaking to the officer does not provide any justification for a stop or search.

[jeremiah12]

Ask them to show you the authorization in the law.

They can't.

They can SAY anything they want, just as the DOJ says that the 03/COE 1-every-30 exemption only applies to C&R handguns, but it is not in the law.

You have the 4th amendment right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure. You have the 5th amendment right to remain silent. We also have 526 US 489 allowing freedom of movement between states, so being told that you can't enter and must turn around is also illegal.

No LEO has legal authority to search or question you without either your consent, or probable cause.
Search for probable cause requires the officer to be able to articulate justification for the search that would be sufficient for a judge to issue a search warrant. Suspect items in plain sight would justify probable cause.

Driving a passenger vehicle through a checkpoint without speaking to the officer does not provide any justification for a stop or search.

Here is an article that shows at least one CA judge says you are wrong.

https://www.theunion.com/news/local-news/car-inspection-refusal-at-truckee-bug-station-leads-to-convictions/

The video shows Bradley Feinman asking authorities at the Truckee agricultural station if they have a warrant to search his vehicle. Officials say they don't want to search his vehicle. They only want to inspect it.

"Don't answer questions," Feinman says as he pulls into what authorities call the "bug station" on Interstate 80 near the Nevada-California state line.

Feinman refuses to allow an inspection of his vehicle, asking if officials have sworn an oath to defend the Constitution. He tells them they can't inspect his vehicle without a warrant, the video shows.

What eventually happened?

It seems there is a difference between inspect and search. Inspect is to look for things that are not allowed into the state for various reasons. If found you are given a choice, turn around and return to the state you came from or hand the items over to be destroyed. No harm no foul.

A search on the other hand means that anything found can be used as evidence against you in a court of law. A criminal penalty is attached.

You do have the right to freely travel across state lines but the state can still impose conditions on that. CA imposes the condition of submitting to an inspection. They do not impose the condition of submitting to a search because that would be unconstitutional.

It would not be too much of a stretch for a progressive, forward thinking CA politician to score points with voters to come up with a bill that ammo is a danger to CA agriculture and is subject to confiscation at the Ag. Station. I would hope if that happened, a lawsuit would be immediately filed.

I do believe that the overwhelming majority pass through with nothing more than a wave because these stations are mostly undermanned and traffic is too heavy. Much of it is geared to education. This was the field of my first vocation. Really, the Ag. inspection stations are their very best, 10% effective in stopping the spread of invasive species that threaten our agriculture. Really, we are loosing the battle. It turns out the greatest threat arrives thousands of times daily at our airports.

So, if you drive through without stopping, you probably will not get pulled over because there are not enough CHP officers around to enforce the law. It takes a lot of time and effort for a felony that when it gets to court will likely get dropped to a misdemeanor. Ultimately, it gives the Department of Ag bad publicity and they do not want that so they let a few jerks go through. It is when the number gets above a certain point, they will team with the CHP for an enforcement activity.

My dad is a retired CalTrans engineer. The redesign of the Ag. stations to move them to be close to the CHP truck weigh station is intentional. Originally, they were purposely separated on busy highways to reduce congestion. Now they want them very close so the CHP can be close to help the Ag. inspectors with enforcement. This is why Dr. Wintemute worked out his sting operations on I-80 to include a license plate reader that he purchased and gave to the CHP at the truck weigh station and had his crew send pictures of Californians buying CA prohibited items in NV along with pictures of their plates to that same truck weigh station.

He knows full well he is not getting all or even half. If the CHP intercepts 10 to 20% he considers it successful.

This is why I say, it is better to drive around than to drive through. The majority of the time you will be waved through without stopping or let through after saying no to the question of do you have fruits or vegetables. If you are the 1 for whatever reason chosen to be inspected, do you really want to go through the hassle? I have been through it 4 times. Some else posted having been through it 2 times. It is a pain in the behind when nothing is found. If something is found, it appears that they will just confiscate it, though you should be able to just turn around and go back. This is stupid because there is nothing stoping you from entering the state a different way and avoiding a Ag. station.

No matter, I do not want to spend money on attorney fees. We can argue all day that submitting to the inspection is unconstitutional but obviously some are being arrested and convicted for refusing to be inspected. Who wants to volunteer to spend the thousands of dollars it will take to get arrested for not submitting to an inspection and then appealing it up the line to get a determination of its constitutionality?

Personally, I will take the cheaper way out and still thumb my nose at the state by legally driving around the stations.

I did the same thing several years ago when I rented a truck and car carrier to tow my truck to Oregon. I used the Net to locate all the weigh stations along the way and then mapped out a route to avoid them all. Most I missed by exiting for gas at a strategic point. Others I bypassed by taking a scenic route or little travelled county roads. I had an enjoyable trip and got to see things most people miss. I did not have to endure wait time at weigh stations which were useless because the rental truck was empty, I just needed it for the power to tow my truck.

[Eureka1911]

Ask them to show you the authorization in the law.

They can't.

You clearly do not understand how agencies are empowered by the legislature, on both state and federal levels, to enact regulations based on the mission of that agency.


The CDFA was created by the state legislature in 1919 and charged with creating regulations to protect and promote the agricultural resources of the state. This is SOP on both the state and federal levels. I deal with several stare and federal agencies in my work that have created regulatory structures that have held up to various court challenges over many decades.

This is how government works. To say there is no law that allows CDFA to do inspections of private vehicles is a complete misunderstanding of the situation.

[SVT-40]

That question is the opening of an interrogation. He's encouraging you to confess to a crime. You have the right to make no reply or say something charming and noncommittal.

Actually thats not an "interrogation". Legally in order for there to be an "interrogation" one has to be "in custody".

A roadside detention does not rise to the level of custody. Therefore there is no "interrogation", and the Officer has no obligation to make any Miranda advisement. He can ask you any questions he wants to. There are no limits to the questions he can ask.

You are still not obligated to say anything. You are however legally obligated to provide your license, registration and insurance.

If ordered you are legally obligated to exit your vehicle, along with any passengers. The Officer does not have to tell you why he is ordering you out of the vehicle.

Refusal to exit can lead to being arrested. Once the cuffs go on, you are "in custody" and Miranda would apply.

Any questions after the cuffs go on would be an "interrogation".

[CaliforniaLiberal]

OK, so it's not an "interrogation."

But he is still inviting you to confess to a crime. In a casual and friendly way.

Which is an interrogation technique.

Used interrogatively.

[RestrictedColt]

I would not consent to a vehicle search/inspection at any check point.

One of the things they do at these agricultural checkpoints is inspect watercraft for Quagga muscles; two stories on that.
#1 I'm driving my friend's Suburban with my Jet Ski inside and towing two Seadoos on a trailer. They inspect the Seadoos which still have some water in them, a total no-no, but they say "next time make sure they're dry. As I start to drive off another inspector notices the Jet Ski inside and freaks the heck out yelling for me to stop, I just kept driving, nothing happened.
#2. My brother is bringing his boat from Az for a Catalina trip and the inspector finds remnants of old dried out mussels, perfectly ok, but he doesn't have a clue what actually matters so they tell him they have to pressure wash them off before it can pass. None of the team of professionals can get the washer started so after much back & forth they tell him that when he gets to the launch ramp at the ocean he has to call some authority to have them inspect the boat before he launches it. (for those who don't know, these mussels can't survive salt water). My brother playing the good guy calls the authority to get the "mandatory" pre-launch inspection and they have a laugh over the phone. "Please launch it in case those mussels are still alive" is what the guy told him.

I drive through the stop on I10 between Az and Ca several times a year and have never been stopped except when towing watercraft. If I were stopped with no PC for an inspection I'd ask if I'm being detained and the moment I heard "no" I'd be rolling. Same with the Border Patrol checkpoints inside the states. When asked "am I being detained" they always say "no, but".... I don't wait for the but. The moment they say no I drop the hammer. Never been pulled over including the time I lit the tires up on my way out. Funniest thing is that any time I was driving with my very obviously Mexican looking co-worker I was never stopped.

[packnrat]

in all my years of driving past or throgh any of the ag inspections.
only once was i "asked" to show my papers. even though i told her i was empty.
so i gave her the two inch thick pile of signed delvery papers.
she got mad handed me my papers and screamed get out of here.
this was a freezer truck, so nothing fresh could have been in it.

[Blade Gunner]

Seems like ferret owners have the same problem. This is their solution

http://www.ferretsanonymous.com/checkpoints/AgStations.pdf

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sfe187]

AWESOME Blade!!

[GW]

Its the adventure that make it worthwhile.

[sfe187]

Its the adventure that make it worthwhile.

which adventure, the adventure pulling up to the AG, "Am i being detained", takes off and keep looking at rear mirror for CHP all in an adrenaline rush LOL or the adventure of going non-paved roads and hope you don't get a flat and your spare has no air LOL. both are cool tho lol

[wpod]

Waved through Truckee last Monday.
Coming back through Needles this Monday.
I anticipate the same.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

[ROMEOHOTEL]

which adventure, the adventure pulling up to the AG, "Am i being detained", takes off and keep looking at rear mirror for CHP all in an adrenaline rush LOL or the adventure of going non-paved roads and hope you don't get a flat and your spare has no air LOL. both are cool tho lol

Your comment reminds me of a story. I'm pulling my boat back to CA from Lake Powell. I have several 5 gallon jugs of cheap AZ gas to fill my truck. Several miles into CA I pull over on the one lane back road to refill my truck. Unknown to me my muffler had gotten a hole in it and was shooting hot gas directly at the truck's plastic fuel tank.

So I'm pouring gasoline into the filler neck and I start hearing noise like taking a whiz onto the pavement. I look under the truck and see the problem. Further inspection reveals a series of holes melted out of the side of the tank. I poured an entire jug before I heard the gas raining on asphalt. So it keep on raining gas until all 5 gallons empties out. Crap, now what?

The road is deserted. Not a single car passed either way in the couple of hours I was there. There was just me and the CHP sitting no more than 20 yards away the entire time pulled over in the opposite direction.

I figure regardless of this new asinine law, the copper is gonna have to actually want to get out of his cruiser into the wall of summer heat.

[ronrichards64]

Just drive in thru Death Valley ,spend the night at furnace creek . Go Peggy Sues for Breakfast .