Found a pistol, what is the next step?

[Lex Talionis]

As long as it's not a banned firearm and either the OP or the friend are not prohibited persons, I believe all they need to do is go to a FFL and do a PPT and then if all clears it's done.

I don't believe the state cares as much how a gun is acquired as it is with being certain that it is registered to people who aren't prohibited.

[pacrat]

A friend of mine bought a bunch of stuff that was cleaned out of a deceased person's house.

In one of the boxes, he found a pistol...

What is the correct/legal actions that he should take at this point if he wants to keep the pistol and/or register it?

Asking for a friend...

We hashed nearly the same question out earlier this year in this thread: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1320578

Not surprisingly, not everyone agreed on how to proceed.

But you need to remember that a firearm holds special legal properties with regard to it's transfer. A realtor may be able to transfer real property, and ordinary personal property within a home to you, they cannot legally transfer a firearm to you.

In this instance, there would be elements of [PC 27545] that RickD427 pointed out in the other thread. Which were not relevant to the circumstances in the other thread. Because of the SALE of the property.

Assuming all relevant Civil Laws were followed by the person who sold the property to your friend, prior to the sale of the property. The proper and legal thing to do would be to contact the seller of the property. Whether it was an estate sale, or a Civil Abandonment Sale. And have them PPT the firearm to the purchaser. Just as the auctioneer did with "Autopro", in the other thread.

In the underlined above in Rick's quote. He is partially correct. A realtor or any other legal agent in lawful possession, handling the SALE of property can transfer the firearm to your friend. But he has to do so in compliance with PC27545 by doing it through a FFL.

There is absolutely no legal reason that your friend hypothetically turn the "pistol" over to LE.

Which would open a totally unnecessary can of worms in the form of Ca-LEGR. Payment of ransom to the state. And doing so would almost assure that he would never see it again. Unless he was willing to file a law suit to get it back from them.

[Gryff]

Rohm from grandpa?

Can't be. He didn't sound pissed.

[holt7153]

Hmmm tagged to find out this info also.

I think we found the friend

[drumngun]

what's that you say? you just lost a pistol in a boating accident? oh gosh that is terrible. are you OK?

[Lex Talionis]

In this instance, there would be elements of [PC 27545] that RickD427 pointed out in the other thread. Which were not relevant to the circumstances in the other thread. Because of the SALE of the property.

Assuming all relevant Civil Laws were followed by the person who sold the property to your friend, prior to the sale of the property. The proper and legal thing to do would be to contact the seller of the property. Whether it was an estate sale, or a Civil Abandonment Sale. And have them PPT the firearm to the purchaser. Just as the auctioneer did with "Autopro", in the other thread.

In the underlined above in Rick's quote. He is partially correct. A realtor or any other legal agent in lawful possession, handling the SALE of property can transfer the firearm to your friend. But he has to do so in compliance with PC27545 by doing it through a FFL.

There is absolutely no legal reason that your friend hypothetically turn the "pistol" over to LE.

Which would open a totally unnecessary can of worms in the form of Ca-LEGR. Payment of ransom to the state. And doing so would almost assure that he would never see it again. Unless he was willing to file a law suit to get it back from them.

Hi Pacrat,

I have a question since you sound like you've done the research on a situation like this. But in the OP's original post he emphasized the 'found' aspect within the lot of other property that was legally acquired by his friend. So what happen then if the original owner/trustee administrator of the estate either can't be found, or is possibly not interested in dealing with the firearm transfer? Would not the friend who legally acquired the property be sufficient as the one on the PPT? Or would there be another process, because I can't imagine the firearm (legal property) would end up in limbo?

Thanks in advance,

Lex

[Den60]

Nuke it from orbit. It is the only way to make sure.

[Mr. Beretta]

I hope the family enjoys that Colt Python.

FYI....that's what a HKS PYA speedloader fits.

[pacrat]

Hi Pacrat,

I have a question since you sound like you've done the research on a situation like this. But in the OP's original post he emphasized the 'found' aspect within the lot of other property that was legally acquired by his friend.
So what happen then if the original owner/trustee administrator of the estate either can't be found, or is possibly not interested in dealing with the firearm transfer? Would not the friend who legally acquired the property be sufficient as the one on the PPT? Or would there be another process, because I can't imagine the firearm (legal property) would end up in limbo?

Thanks in advance,

Lex

I can only put forth my own personal opinion. IANAGL, by any stretch of the imagination.

Look at the bolded sentence in your post. Not quite factually accurate as to the circumstances as related in OP.

A friend of mine bought a bunch of stuff that was cleaned out of a deceased person's house.

In one of the boxes, he found a pistol...

He found the pistol in a box. But he bought the box containing the pistol, with the understanding that all the contents of the box were now his.

I sincerely doubt that the seller of the box would want to become a criminal, for the simple act of selling him the box. And it is illegal to sell firearms between individuals without the intervention of an FFL. So unless they could not be reached by any reasonable means. I don't see that as an issue.

As to them being unreachable. I don't really know. Common sense says a VOLREG should suffice because the "friend" purchased the box containing the pistol in good faith and without criminal intent. But common sense and Ca laws used in the same sentence is an oxymoronical statement. And obviously we know that most Ca Laws pertaining to firearms, are actually designed to turn Law Abiding Citizens into criminals just for owning firearms.

[MarikinaMan]

If you think you want or need to, declare ownership. If there is a claim against, youll lose ur 19 bucks. If it old and bought before registration, its now yours to own or sell.

https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/volreg.pdf

[Lex Talionis]

I can only put forth my own personal opinion. IANAGL, by any stretch of the imagination.

Look at the bolded sentence in your post. Not quite factually accurate as to the circumstances as related in OP.


He found the pistol in a box. But he bought the box containing the pistol, with the understanding that all the contents of the box were now his.

I sincerely doubt that the seller of the box would want to become a criminal, for the simple act of selling him the box. And it is illegal to sell firearms between individuals without the intervention of an FFL. So unless they could not be reached by any reasonable means. I don't see that as an issue.

As to them being unreachable. I don't really know. Common sense says a VOLREG should suffice because the "friend" purchased the box containing the pistol in good faith and without criminal intent. But common sense and Ca laws used in the same sentence is an oxymoronical statement. And obviously we know that most Ca Laws pertaining to firearms, are actually designed to turn Law Abiding Citizens into criminals just for owning firearms.

Good points and I was looking at it from the angle of a sale without criminal intent because the original owner didn't know the gun was in all of the property basically being cleared out. I wonder if this ever came up on 'Storage Wars' because I'm sure it happens frequently.

Best thing to do is try to contact the original estate trustee. But back to what I had suggested a few posts back; if the friend and the guy who wants the gun go to a FFL and do a PPT and the transfer doesn't get rejected I would think all would be good. I would have to think that the state would look at it from the perspective that a firearm that maybe had become off the radar and therefore subject to anyone having it including a criminal, had now by a process assured that it was now being transferred from one non criminal to another and was now on the record with the state. A win for the state and for the spirit of the law as well as the new owner.

[RickD427]

As long as it's not a banned firearm and either the OP or the friend are not prohibited persons, I believe all they need to do is go to a FFL and do a PPT and then if all clears it's done.

I don't believe the state cares as much how a gun is acquired as it is with being certain that it is registered to people who aren't prohibited.

In the underlined above in Rick's quote. He is partially correct. A realtor or any other legal agent in lawful possession, handling the SALE of property can transfer the firearm to your friend. But he has to do so in compliance with PC27545 by doing it through a FFL.

There is absolutely no legal reason that your friend hypothetically turn the "pistol" over to LE.

Gents,

The requirement here is to create a legal transfer of the firearm to the buyer.

If the seller can be located, a PPT would create a perfectly legal transfer and would be the easiest to accomplish. I didn't discuss that possibility earlier in the thread because the context of the discussion suggested that the seller was unknown.

The realtor could also facilitate the legal transfer of the firearm though an FFL, but then it would actually be the FFL and not the realtor doing the transfer. I'm not an FFL and I'm not an expert in FFL practices. It would be good to hear from an FFL member of the forum if it possible to transfer a firearm with the seller being unknown.

I believe that efforts to do a voluntary registration are not correct. That would create a registration record in the AFS, but would not legally create a transfer.

The found property process, contained in the Civil Code, and discussed in the earlier thread, does provide for a lawful transfer, and where the seller of the firearm is unknown.

[MarikinaMan]

Gents,

The requirement here is to create a legal transfer of the firearm to the buyer.

If the seller can be located, a PPT would create a perfectly legal transfer and would be the easiest to accomplish. I didn't discuss that possibility earlier in the thread because the context of the discussion suggested that the seller was unknown.

The realtor could also facilitate the legal transfer of the firearm though an FFL, but then it would actually be the FFL and not the realtor doing the transfer. I'm not an FFL and I'm not an expert in FFL practices. It would be good to hear from an FFL member of the forum if it possible to transfer a firearm with the seller being unknown.

I believe that efforts to do a voluntary registration are not correct. That would create a registration record in the AFS, but would not legally create a transfer.

The found property process, contained in the Civil Code, and discussed in the earlier thread, does provide for a lawful transfer, and where the seller of the firearm is unknown.

Ive personally spoken to the DOJ on this. If he can attest that the gun is in his possession, that he is not knowingly breaking any laws, he can voluntary register it. If anything comes up, theyll take it up with him. A transfer is not necesary if he checks "other", and describes how he came into possession, as long as it not a transfer covered by existing law.

The act of voluntarily registering is taken as an act of good faith. Theyll work with you to fix the matter, if its fixable.

To declare ownership, he must have a valid safety certificate.

In this situation, the right thing to do is inquire with the sellers, if they are the rightful owners.

[Tonyson]

That's one fine paperweight.

[baggss]

what.... pistol

I was just thinking that. Gun? What gun?