Never mind

[Tobybu]

I wouldn't worry unless LEO buys multiple same brand and same model gun and sells it numerous times. It's hard to explain selling 5x 4th Gen G19 to DOJ or so...

[solipsism]

I wouldn't worry unless LEO buys multiple same brand and same model gun and sells it numerous times. It's hard to explain selling 5x 4th Gen G19 to DOJ or so...

Gotta find the perfect 19.

[John Browning]

You are allowed five transactions a year. Each time you do a PPT counts as one. You can PPT multiple handguns in a single PPT. Essentially every time you meet at the LGS that's a transaction no matter if you sell one or five. It is a dumb law that means if you are a collector you almost have to sell five each year to keep your collection at a reasonable size as you get duplicates, interests change, etc.

[DRM6000]

Sounds like a situation similar to Sacdep and Snellings.

[smak28]

You can buy as many as you want via PPT, but you are supposed to be limited to 5 PPT SELL transactions per ear. Why sell only? It's because they want to make sure that you are not selling as a business without an operating license as Uncle Sam wants tax money from businesses.

[sidelock]

I think it's mostly do to straw sales and not stolen guns the doj is really looking at the straw sales of off roster guns figuring out were it originated from

Yes, this is what I was referring to.

Make sure your off roster pistols were not obtained via "Questionable" sources.

[neomedic]

What happens to the pistol that was sold? Is the buyer going to lose out on funds and the pistol?
Can't imagine anything (prosecution) happening to buyer since buyer is unaware of the situation.

[Scratch705]

There're FFLs selling off roster pistols via PPTs using third party names that can't prove how he got it in California originally.

And there're buyers obtained off roster pistols via straw purchases.

Its felony offense, not worth anything close to make a quick $500 (or less). Your bail bond agent will cost you $5,000 in fees for a $50,000 bail along, lawyers $30,000 then you lost your firearm rights if convicted.

I put this thread here because I want fellow sellers to easily see it. Not everyone is regularly checking FFL discussions.

as a buyer how am i to verify that the off-roster gun was obtained through legal means?

should i call local PD to run the serial before purchase?

[smith and wesson]

Probably a good time to remind everybody you are limited to 5 handgun PPT transactions in a year as well.

I did not know that. Is there a limit on rifles as well?

[sidelock]

Probably a good time to remind everybody you are limited to 5 handgun PPT transactions in a year as well.

Yes, that's a good reminder.

This number was not written in book, but it's what generally used to determent if they want to harass you to apply for FFL.

[The Gleam]

Probably a good time to remind everybody you are limited to 5 handgun PPT transactions in a year as well - As a seller.

I know scobun knows this as do many here, but just to qualify that: As a seller.

[Cokebottle]

I did not know that. Is there a limit on rifles as well?

"Irregular and Infrequent"

[ifilef]

There're FFLs selling off roster pistols via PPTs using third party names that can't prove how he got it in California originally.

And there're buyers obtained off roster pistols via straw purchases.

Its felony offense, not worth anything close to make a quick $500 (or less). Your bail bond agent will cost you $5,000 in fees for a $50,000 bail along, lawyers $30,000 then you lost your firearm rights if convicted.

I put this thread here because I want fellow sellers to easily see it. Not everyone is regularly checking FFL discussions.

I don't understand the portion in bold, above.

Seller in a PPT doesn't have to prove ownership or even be the owner or how he obtained firearm, AFAIK.

[VL221]

Tagged

[Cokebottle]

What I mean is (assuming, as I really don't want to point fingers) some FFLs were falsely using third party names to sell off roster pistols, since (as you said) seller doesn't have to prove ownership, and seller doesn't have to finger print on PPT/DROS. (Since several cases like this is still in court, so until proven guilty, I can only say "assuming")

I can see that being attempted, but at the same time, how did the FFL cook the books to get it out of their inventory and into the alleged hands of this 3rd party?

It doesn't seem that there would be a "clean-ish" way to do this and not get nailed on a routine audit.