Avoid using uber and lyft if you can

[NYT]

ill take uber to the range on thursday and see what happens.

[therealnickb]

Where did you get your JD?

Pretty simple concepts. No JD required.

Still wondering if any of the offenses mentioned here get a contract interrupted or just not renewed?

[tonyxcom]

Still wondering if any of the offenses mentioned here get a contract interrupted or just not renewed?

I still don't get why you seem hung up on that detail. When you are an "independent contractor" you can be released or replaced at ANY time for ANY reason. You aren't working under a contract where you are legally bound in any way that isn't completely mutual.

[therealnickb]

I still don't get why you seem hung up on that detail. When you are an "independent contractor" you can be released or replaced at ANY time for ANY reason. You aren't working under a contract where you are legally bound in any way that isn't completely mutual.

A contract is usually for a specific task completed for a specific price. It's over when the work is done. If I'm doing my work, I don't think you can legally just end it for any reason at any time. That concept is called "at will" employment.

I know lots of business have tried to play the IC game over the years to avoid taxes and work comp. Lots have failed and been fined or even jailed.

The other issue is the lack of negotiating ability by the small guy. If you are desperate for work, you'll agree to a lot. But that doesn't mean it's automatically legal or binding.

[tonyxcom]

A contract is usually for a specific task completed for a specific price. It's over when the work is done. If I'm doing my work, I don't think you can legally just end it for any reason at any time. That concept is called "at will" employment.

Are you even in the tech industry or are you in some kind of trade like cement or roofing - as that seems to be where we might have a disconnect.

Contractors at Apple could be assigned or hired temporarily for specific projects in need of a temporary increase in bodies, but they are most certainly paid by the hour as a contractor and can be released at any time for any reason.

Obviously this is different than a contractor hired to replace the railing on the staircase to the break room in the Art Department; getting the job after providing a quote for your time and materials.

[71MUSTY]

Help, I searched CA law, all over my permit and this whole website and absolutely no where does it say it is illegal for my to carry while using UBER.

So, if the driver asks me to leave his car, I will.

Nuff said on that.

I also agree they will loose in court because their contract imposes too much control and makes drivers employees.

[baggss]

This is California after all. As a conservative thinker, if I were to boycott every business that held a belief different from mine I would lead a very boring life and eventually starve to death

So your universe ends at the California state line? What about places like Vegas or states where CC is SHALL ISSUE across the board? Maybe you never travel outside of this state and take you gun(s) with you but many of us do.

Frankly, IIRC, their policy doesn't carry the force of law in CA so booting someone who can legally carry might be an interesting law suit to watch. Seems to me like lots of other businesses tend to shy away from pushing this issue on their customers.

The Uber employee ban is a whole different matter. Their business, their rules. I can't carry at work and I'm pretty sure Apple doesn't allow it's employees to either, but as a customer of theirs I can carry in one of their stores as long as it is legal for me to do so in my state of residence or the state which I am in at the time.

[therealnickb]

Are you even in the tech industry or are you in some kind of trade like cement or roofing - as that seems to be where we might have a disconnect.

Contractors at Apple could be assigned or hired temporarily for specific projects in need of a temporary increase in bodies, but they are most certainly paid by the hour as a contractor and can be released at any time for any reason.

Obviously this is different than a contractor hired to replace the railing on the staircase to the break room in the Art Department; getting the job after providing a quote for your time and materials.

I worked with many business over the years. Insurance was my service. Work Comp was a big portion. I've had many discussions with employers and done a lot of research on this topic. It was important to know who my clients owed Work Comp to and who they didn't.

But yes, we are talking about different things. Apple is big enough to likely get away with or try to get away with what ever they can. Regardless, everything you've typed looks like a contracted employee and nothing like an Independent Contractor to me. Unless there is some exception for tech companies, anyone that can be let go for any reason isn't an IC. Paid hourly is highly irregular for an IC as well.

So, back to uber. Uber wants to call it's drivers IC. The state disagrees. I think uber's recent no-gun policy will work against their appeal. The more control they exercise or are able to exercise, the more likely drivers are employees.

[tonyxcom]

What is the difference between a contracted employee and an independent contractor?

[therealnickb]

What is the difference between a contracted employee and an independent contractor?

Who has the right to control is the key IMO. For that reason alone it's a lot easier to create an employee than it is an IC.

That said, I know words can be mis-used. IC seems to be mis-used intentionally and unintentionally.

[therealnickb]

Here's a good source for an over view if anyone cares.

http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-Businesses-&-Self-Employed/Independent-Contractor-Self-Employed-or-Employee

[tonyxcom]

Is there even a difference per the labor code? I think the terms are synonymous. You are either an employee or independent contractor.

"Contractor" when used in these discussions is just an abbreviated term for "independent contractor".

Unless you can show me a definition from the labor code that shows otherwise.

[tonyxcom]

Here's a good source for an over view if anyone cares.

http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-...ed-or-Employee

Perfect. There are only two classes.

1. Employee
2. Independant Contractor

[therealnickb]

Is there even a difference per the labor code? I think the terms are synonymous. You are either an employee or independent contractor.

"Contractor" when used in these discussions is just an abbreviated term for "independent contractor".

Unless you can show me a definition from the labor code that shows otherwise.

This is where the legal beagles come in. You most certainly can be a contract employee. Without a contract, at least in CA, you are usually considered "at will".

This is why I asked if Apple could "terminate" or just "non-renew" your contract for any violation of their policies. If you walk in dressed like a grand wizard, can they simply ask you to go change, or can they tear up your contract on the spot?

The former is an IC, the latter is a contract employee. IMO.