Using a high capacity mag in gun range

[Screagle]

Freedom mags can save wear and tear on a maglocked AR

[smittty]

[divingin]

I've noticed many poly type magazines such as MagPul and 2nd Amen, etc carry a stamp that resembles the face of a clock with hands which, were I not in OR at the time, might have peaked my interest for further investigation. They appeared to me a month & year DOM stamp on the mag body.

Known as a date code. May also be a numeric or alphanumeric code indicating month and year (i.e. "2420" indicating the 24th week of 2020, for example.)

Anyone with >10 rd mags should be aware of this. Can't claim that it was a Freedom Week mag if it was manufactured after that.


FWIW, the policy at San Leandro Range is that the range is just that: someplace for people to shoot. As long as firearms meet the range's criteria (i.e. the range safety/operational rules regarding caliber and limitations) they are good to go. RO's are not cops, and are not expected to know or enforce, state or federal laws regarding firearm/accessory legality. They do get a fairly brisk business from off-duty law enforcement, though, as well as providing local agencies space and time for on-duty qualification/practice, so customers should take that into account if legality may be an issue.

[OCEquestrian]

For anyone reading this thread and wondering, California's magazine freedom week was 3/29/2019 and 4/5/19 (KNOW THOSE DATES IN YOUR SLEEP and make sure you do not break the law by posession any magazine that is dated after March/2019)

The span from March 29 to April 5 is being called “Freedom Week” because it was a time period when California gun owners were allowed to buy previously prohibited magazines.

A federal judge's ruling March 29 in an NRA-supported challenge to California’s magazine banlifted the floodgates for people who had been unable to make such purchases in 20 years.

Suddenly Californians no longer had restrictions over the manufacture, importation, sale, transfer, receipt, and possession of magazines capable of holding more than 10 rounds.

And this pent up demand sent sales skyrocketing for a period of time now being called “Freedom Week.”

[P5Ret]

Freedom mags can save wear and tear on a maglocked AR

You put a mag that holds more than 10 rounds in a mag locked AR, you're asking to be charged with a felony. Not something many are comfortable with.

[OCEquestrian]

You put a mag that holds more than 10 rounds in a mag locked AR, you're asking to be charged with a felony. Not something many are comfortable with.

^^^^ THIS!

[lastinline]

Have we heard of any cases involving magazines that were scrubbed of any nomenclature, date codes, mfg data, etc?

[AregularGuy]

It is, but it's best if you know the details of how it works.

First, there is the legality issue. If you own them, they must have been acquired prior to the ban (grandfathered), or during the "freedom week" (small period of time recently, when an injunction against the ban was in place). If you acquired them differently, they are illegal to possess. While nobody can *establish* anything about your magazines, anything you say can and will be used against you.

Second, they are covered by "nuisance statutes" so they can be confiscated even if you're not charged with any illegal activity. I'm not sure what the limit of this is and whether it has ever been used, but you must know that a police officer can take them away and you won't see them again.

Finally, the law enforcement officers in general don't know too much about the fine details of the law and they mostly follow their departments' procedure, so if their department says "confiscate," that's what they'll do. The judge will sort it out later and it might be that you lose them even if you did nothing wrong.

With all that said, I would say that most of us use the high capacity magazines just like any other magazine.

I was under the impression that they all high cap mags are technically illegal to possess currently but enforcement has been withheld due to the injunction. i seem to remeber someone here making that distinction. In the real world doesn't change much but the final verdict will determine legality of possession. I could be mistaken.

Regarding "establish" - I've noticed many poly type magazines such as MagPul and 2nd Amen, etc carry a stamp that resembles the face of a clock with hands which, were I not in OR at the time, might have peaked my interest for further investigation. They appeared to me a month & year DOM stamp on the mag body.

I may be mistaken but if not, that's something one ought to be aware of. Unlike changed followers or floorplates incorporated after a certain day, which could have been switched out to an older magazine, I'm not sure of how one may assert innocence with a mag body date stamped after March 2020. Perhaps there's a way, I just can't think of one now.

For anyone reading this thread and wondering, California's magazine freedom week was 3/29/2019 and 4/5/19 (KNOW THOSE DATES IN YOUR SLEEP and make sure you do not break the law by posession any magazine that is dated after March/2019)
...

Unless it has changed, I recall there was an Attorney general letter(?) that stated it was legal to repair your high capacity magazines with parts from another magazine, up to and including all parts of the high capacity magazine, springs, follower, body, baseplate. As long as you only end up with one high cap mag in the end it is legal to replace everything. So there would be nothing "telling" about possessing a mag with a manufacture date on it.

Note - this 2005 letter has been overtaken by subsequent law - it is no longer of any value in 2022.

Librarian

ETA: Here is the letter from AG Bill Lockyer in Nov 2005:

DOJ-large-cap-magazines-2005-11-10.pdf

https://www.hoffmang.com/firearms/DOJ-large-cap-magazines-2005-11-10.pdf

...
Q6. Is there any limitation to the number of parts you can replace in a legally obtained hi-cap magazine If the magazine body is replaced with one clearly manufactured after 2000. . . is there any burden of proof upon a Calfornia resident that they did in fact replace a worn/obsolete part and did not illegally purchase/import a new hi-cap magazine.
A7: . However, it would be prudent in such a case to keep records documenting the purchase of the part necessary for the repair in order to demonstrate that the large capacity magazine was repaired, not replaced.

Q8. Can you use parts designed for a 1O-round magazine to repair a legally obtained hi-cap magazine?
A8: If parts designed for a 10-round magazine are interchangeable with parts of a legally obtained large capacity magazine, there is no legal barrier to using them.

Q9: Can you have enough spare parts to assemble a new hi-cap magazine provided they are unassembled and intended for use as replacement parts?
A9: Whether the scenario you describe constitutes possession of magazine parts with the intent to manufacture or with the intent to repair a large capacity magazine depends upon the legal opinion of the prosecutor in the jurisdiction where the acts occur. You could be charged with a felony (Penal Code 12280(a)(2)), if a prosecutor believed that you were manufacturing a large capacity magazine.

So if this letter is still valid then you could theoretically change the mag body and floor plate and still be legal, even if there is a date code from outside of pre-ban or freedom week.

[OCEquestrian]

So if this letter is still valid then you could theoretically change the mag body and floor plate and still be legal, even if there is a date code from outside of pre-ban or freedom week.

Not a defense argument I would ever want to be in a position to HAVE make when the situation is so easy to avoid.

[One in the pipe]

Personally, I only take my 10 rounders to the range. I leave my standard magazines at home for now.

Of course, I haven't been to the range for awhile since I'm hording my ammo and just dry firing.

[AregularGuy]

Not a defense argument I would ever want to be in a position to HAVE make when the situation is so easy to avoid.

Agreed. Just making the point that it *might* be technically legal.

[lastinline]

Personally, I only take my 10 rounders to the range. I leave my standard magazines at home for now.

That is the safest bet for now.
I tend to do the same, as to avoid theft of property by the Stasi.

[dummykid]

in California, we have low-capacity mags.

[Neil McCauley]

Nobodycares /thread

[AregularGuy]

Other issues with using "dated" mags to verify when they were acquired:

1. I'm not sure when any date codes started, but remember there may be many, many 1000's of legally acquired magazine "parts kits" that suddenly became legal high cap mags, and also pinned/blocked mags that were returned to original OEM condition during freedom week. These may have dates outside of those in 2019.

2. There were also magazines that were back-ordered, Brownell's kept your order indefinitely until filled. Some people received their orders months after freedom week. These may have dates beyond "freedom week" 2019.

Between the above scenarios and the AG letter previously posted I think it would really be a non-issue to have a date on your magazine. And if you are skittish, as others mentioned, plastic has nothing on a Dremel or sandpaper.