My First .45

[Waffleobill]

Not questioning the facts you stated in any way whatsoever. Your delivery was just plain rude.

[Carcassonne]

... The guns that ended up on my short list are the SIG 227(awesome weapon), FNX 45(well priced), Beretta PX4, all in .45 ... So, as a lot of you probably know, all 3 of those guns are illegal in the state! ...

P.S. - They are not illegal. They are just not on the roster.

I could swear that the PX4 in 45ACP use to be on the roster a few years ago. It doesn't make sense why they would let it drop off.

I think the Beretta 8050 is similar to the PX4


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[Carcassonne]

... and that 9mm must be a poodle shooter by comparison.

I love shooting poodles.



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[Deimos887]

Not questioning the facts you stated in any way whatsoever. Your delivery was just plain rude.

Which I addressed in my following post, replying to indytrucks followup.
No rudeness intended, after reading it having already posted it I can see how it would be taken that way, and I apologize. but given the context that I was literally snuffing his "high" of being a new gun owner with his "all-powerful" new P220.. "hate to burst your bubble, but.."

just attempting to educate, not subjugate.

As for what I was referencing (preaching to the choir for most here), I didn't have it bookmarked, took a little while to dig up:

http://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Self_Defense_Ammo_FAQ/

and

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=307653

I generally try to be as helpful as I can on this forum, paying it forward for all the years worth of help the elder membership here (indirectly) gave me.
I tend to shy away from all the petty squabbles and heated trivial debates that go on, I'm here to learn and contribute knowledge, and at times socialize, not bicker and victimize over trivial BS.
I've been registered here a year and half now, never had a run in with any of the mods, aim to keep it that way

[CaliforniaSon]

I would personally recommend either a Springfield XD which will keep you well within your budget and allow for extra ammo/goodies or a Para Ordnance 1911. You could even look at a Taurus 1911 as well.

I know a lot of the 1911 purists will bash on them both, but when it comes down to it, they function will and are inexpensive.

[Shaolin Crane]

...1. Clothing and even a bad guys finger can stop a hammer fired gun in its tracks. It's extremely rare, but in a struggle and attacker could put his hand on the gun and use his finger or the web of his hand to stop the gun from firing...

3. Find and take a Defensive Handgun Course or Tactical Pistol course right away. No matter how much or how little experience you have these courses will help make you a better shooter. They are a ton of fun. They go way beyond the boring NRA stuff...and they are much more exciting than your typical day at the range. There is no better way to master the fundamentals and learn how to truly use a handgun, than in a group setting with a couple instructors correcting your mistakes as you go. The competition and training section off the main index page here on Calguns will have courses in your area. A good local one here in Sacramento is www.gofast1.com. If you are located elsewhere I am sure there is one near you. Can't stress the importance of this enough. You will make a huge leap in ability by doing this. Not only in your marksmanship and fundamentals, but your safety and confidence level as well. All of that is critical. Normally takes a year or longer to get. Take the right course and you'll get in a day or two.

I agree with this x1000. The basic gun defense techniques we teach all begin with control over the rear of the gun using the pinky as a safety measure to possibly stop the hammer when going for control of the weapon.

With that said I still recommend a 1911 for the first gun, my dad intrafamial transferred mine to me when I was 18. Excellent to tinker with, learn control with since the gun is much heavier than aluminum or polymer guns. Yes the safety is difficult, but its great for teaching the mandatory application of the safety will make it second nature for that gun, and any other. Like others have said, it never stops at one anyway...

Beyond that, training, training, training, i'd be more concerned of a trained shooter with a pellet gun than an amature with any caliber of handgun.

RIA offers a good choice for 1911 at a great cost. I'd also look into a P6, I love both of mine and would absolutely recommend them too.

[Deimos887]

P.S. - They are not illegal. They are just not on the roster.

I could swear that the PX4 in 45ACP use to be on the roster a few years ago. It doesn't make sense why they would let it drop off.

I think the Beretta 8050 is similar to the PX4


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I think Storm .45 was introduced a few years after the 9/40 models... it's funny you mention as I had an old copy of American Handgunner featuring the Px4 .45 laying around somewhere a couple days ago, I just went looking for it to see what the date was on the issue... can't find it.
I'm pretty sure the year was either 2008 or 2009 though.

Which wouldn't of qualified for the roster at that time, as it has neither a magazine disconnect or chamber load indicator.

[DnS121111]

I started off with a .25 then moved up to a .380 then a couple 9mm and a few 45s then shot a couple of 40s now I own the 10mm and shoot both 10 and 40 out of my G29sf if you do decide to start big go with the G20sf and buy the 40 barrel or a 21 slide that is if you want to jump right in and put thoes big boy pants on if not then get a G17 or a G22.

[DnS121111]

Even better just buy a S&W .357 Magnum

[Nrai2020]

I don't even shoot 45 but i want a 220 now...

[JLM Ranger]

Springfield XD 45

[Deimos887]

I don't even shoot 45 but i want a 220 now...

P220's are awesome, I don't even really care for DA/SA handguns.

For some strange reason I love SIGs though, particularly P220's and P225's

[Tothemax]

Great Advice !!

Is it a safe assumption that your list of requirements comes largely from things people you know have told you about guys and things you've read?

The reason I ask is your dislike of striker fired guns. Because they have some huge advantages over hammer guns.

1. Clothing and even a bad guys finger can stop a hammer fired gun in its tracks. It's extremely rare, but in a struggle and attacker could put his hand on the gun and use his finger or the web of his hand to stop the gun from firing.

2. Most hammer fired guns are DA/SA. 1911s, Hi-Powers, and a few others being notable exceptions. Double Action / Single Action guns have two distinct trigger pulls. What this means in practical terms is that is going to take two to three times as much practice and training to be worth a damn with them unless you are shooting slow fire. You'll under pull the first Heavy DA pull then rush it, causing you to miss, then having just done that you'll under pull the lighter SA followup pull and miss again. Getting yourself to stop doing that will take lots and lots of trigger time. It's just human nature.

The striker fired guns like the Glock, M&P, XD, etc. have the same trigger pull each and every time. So once you figure out how to pull that trigger without pulling yourself off target, you're set. The follow up shot requires the same amount of pressure. So the muscle memory develops in a fraction of the time.

Like I said, the 1911 and Hi-Powers also only have one pull, but they also have thumb safeties. Which are going to take lots of practice to master. Until you do you'll find yourself forgetting to flip them off and back on again. Which is must. Their light triggers demand that you always holster them with the safety on lest you put a hole in your leg.

SO WHAT DO I RECOMMEND.

1. Get a Glock. Easy to master. Simple to use. Will free you up to work on your shooting fundamentals rather than stressing out over a complicated trigger, thumbsafety or decocker which can trip you up when you're new. My second choice is a 1911. Not necessarily for a new shooter. Just in general. Since you are hot on a 45acp, it might work for you.

2. Get a 9mm. 45acp is just too much recoil for new shooter. Again, you want to focus on mastering the fundamentals and less recoil helps with that. It is less distracting. The goal right now is to master the art of shooting a handgun. Not to have the biggest badest handgun on the planet. The exception to this rule is if you get a 1911. The heavy frame of the 1911 helps with recoil absorption, and it a 1911 begs to be chambered in 45. But I still think you would be better served with a Glock for the first gun. Save the 1911 for your second gun once you have a nice solid foundation under your belt.

3. Find and take a Defensive Handgun Course or Tactical Pistol course right away. No matter how much or how little experience you have these courses will help make you a better shooter. They are a ton of fun. They go way beyond the boring NRA stuff...and they are much more exciting than your typical day at the range. There is no better way to master the fundamentals and learn how to truly use a handgun, than in a group setting with a couple instructors correcting your mistakes as you go. The competition and training section off the main index page here on Calguns will have courses in your area. A good local one here in Sacramento is www.gofast1.com. If you are located elsewhere I am sure there is one near you. Can't stress the importance of this enough. You will make a huge leap in ability by doing this. Not only in your marksmanship and fundamentals, but your safety and confidence level as well. All of that is critical. Normally takes a year or longer to get. Take the right course and you'll get in a day or two.

[Tothemax]

More good advice !

You sure are. Do you shoot handguns a lot with buddies? I would suggest shooting what your friends have and then decide. If you look at the "for sale" ads I would guess 50% of the 45 ACP pistols that are for sale is by people who did not like it.

Get a Glock 17 or a Beretta 92FS and go from there. You have plenty time to buy 100 or 200 handguns in the future. It will be like the flavor of the month thing if you get hooked on shooting. It is fun and the next step will be reloading your own ammunition.

[Jericho9]

Hi point .45