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It was doing better for a little there too but back to the new normal I suppose
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NRA Endowment Life Member
USMC 2001-2012
Never make yourself too available or useful...... Semper Fidelis
John Dickerson: What keeps you awake at night?
James Mattis: Nothing, I keep other people awake at night.
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Where did I say it was okay? I didn't. In fact, I said most of us are similarly frustrated and share similar experiences. What I also pointed out was, as Paul Harvey used to say, "the rest of the story."
We ALL experience times when the site cannot be connected with. As I've stated, numerous times, it's not available 24/7/365 at anyone's convenience. Still, there are any number of us who post EVERY DAY, by accessing the site when we can and not necessarily exactly when we want to. It's not about attempting things at 'varying times of day.' It's about being persistent and paying attention in that, at least for me, the times when it is available, though not entirely, are somewhat 'predictable.' (Again, that's during a given period and not consistently over time as the 'availability' seems to rotate.)
While I grant that those who don't consistently and persistently attempt to access the site might not be aware or fully aware and, as I've stated, there does SEEM to be a tie in with the technology one is using in terms of attempting to access the site (though that's an assumption on my part based on some of the things indicated in posts), there is simply no denying the site is accessible to many on a daily basis. Period. In fact, your post indicates it is actually accessible to YOU today. Thus, it comes across as more "I want it at my convenience" than a willingness to deal with it "as it is" at the moment. That's something any number of members have stipulated; i.e., it's not JUST me.
I've never bought anything from or on this site. If that's all this site represents to an user, bear in mind that even over on the other site threads are running where some still claim they find better deals here, on this site. So, someone else is conducting business here, even with the problems. As has been stipulated by numerous posters, one has to stop relying on what WAS and start working with what IS, for now. Can't use PM's? Use other contact information? Don't want to? That's your choice.
Stop blaming the 'upgrade' as if it was Kestryll's choice. It's already been covered, in several threads, that it was NOT his choice to update the software. That action was forced on him by the host going out of business and the new host demanding use of more updated software. Remember, the major reason for the problems was that Kestryll hung in with the old iteration to appease those who 'demanded' iTrader, which only worked on THAT SPECIFIC iteration of the site's software. He warned the membership, multiple times, over the years that any 'upgrade/update' to the software would create exactly the types of issues we've been experiencing. He even warned for some period prior to the change to SAVE your iTrader ratings as that function was going to be lost. Thus, it should not be a 'surprise' that things went south.
Again, we have some 'evidence' or 'statements' that Kestryll is, in fact, working on it. We know, from posts, what has accounted for the delays. If my paraphrasing and reiterating those posts is 'pontification' and attempting to sound as if I'm 'in the know,' then I have to wonder what the perspective is of those who are claiming such and thumbs up/thumbs downing posts on that basis. Bear in mind, as I've noted before, Kestryll is in a no-win situation on that count. If he doesn't post updates stating progress, he'll face condemning posts. He he does post progress, but the fix isn't complete, he'll face condemnation. Just like those of us (not simply me) who attempt to address questions being 'shot at' by those who want individualized attention or a declaration that the 'fix' is in or desire someone else be 'sold out' to (with several layers of meaning to that phrase), there is no absolute answer that will make 'everyone' happy.
There is a 7-page thread where Kestryll posted what was going on in his Life, something we had already known from posts made by friends of his. He also indicated what his plans were. Further, members, including myself, warned not to expect immediate results in terms of a 'fix' in that it was going to take time to sort his life out (what most deem as Priority #1) and to work out who to give access to. Remember, not only is there information none of us would like certain parties to have, but there is proprietary information only available behind-the-curtain that certain parties have been trying to gain access to. Likewise, Kestryll has already acknowledged that he can't fix it himself, thereby necessitating his finding at least one and, likely, two or more individuals given what he perceives as needing to be done.
Don't want to wait? Don't want to be patient? Want to continue to complain, whine, demand, etc.? Want to continue sounding like the kid sitting in the back seat asking "Are we there yet?" There are plenty of other sites, including gun sites or gun-related sites and even Constitutional rights sites, where you can participate while those who are willing to put in the time and effort in an attempt to keep this site viable while the 'fix it work' is, ostensibly, being done continue posting EVERY DAY. (Bearing in mind that I don't have any 'special access' and I assume no one else does either.) Remember, I'm not the one who has problems with other sites existing or members participating on other sites. Where I have a problem are the machinations being gone through in terms of 'marketing' other sites (without paying), recruiting for other sites, extolling other sites as superior, denigrating this site, etc. Is that pontification where I'm 'pompously' and 'dogmatically' expressing things or is it simply relaying what is and expressing consternation with those demanding their way or declaring this site is 'done' or 'not working' if they don't get their way and/or the attention they think they deserve?Last edited by TrappedinCalifornia; 11-21-2025, 10:18 PM.Comment
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I have nothing left to say. You have said it all.
After a couple of years trying to get on this site and being 'lucky" enough to attain entry on and off for the entire time, is very frustrating (obviously). But I guess that you can't see that.
While I enjoyed my time here, I no longer do.
I'm not whining, I'm simply stating facts. Or do you condone a more than 2-year bomb of this site?
Thank you for your time in writing such an informative reply.
I will likely not visit here often from now on.Comment
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There are 3 Amin/Moderators all with 20+ years on this site that have commented in the Contributor Lounge that they have not heard anything from anyone. Just like us. I would have thought these particular 3 would have heard something, but alas not. I truly “hope” (not demand) the site somehow gets back to its glory.
Originally posted by Citadelgrad87sigpicOriginally posted by HoooperComment
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You know, you keep accusing me of things that I specifically indicated most of us don't condone, don't wish for, don't want, but tolerate given the circumstances and our 'faith' that it will be fixed.
To my way of thinking and that of others, it indicates the problem is mostly with you and your attitude. Is it 'wrong?' Only in the sense of the accusatory tone you have stuck with. Not to mention the fact that, as I indicated, it's not about being 'lucky' in obtaining access. You've proven that, whether you realize it or not, over the last couple of days by your very posting.
Again, this isn't our fault. It's not considered Kestryll's fault by those who have kept up. The fault is due to a combination of factors many consider beyond the control of a single individual and those 'factors' include parties who have tried or who have 'taken advantage' of the situation.
We don't necessarily want to see the vast majority 'go' somewhere else; though there are exceptions. However, there are very, very few who actually blame anyone for finding alternatives, for now. In fact, quite a few prominent names on this site have done so and the vast majority of them 'check in' to see if things have improved. Since the change, things have, in fact, improved. It is likely and also apparent, depending on the individual poster, that part of the problem is that many haven't 'kept up;' either because they haven't been able to or because they haven't tried to. There are some who simply want something 'different' than what the site has traditionally been. The crux of the matter is that things haven't been completely 'fixed.' Perhaps that's the key.
For most who remain, we see the 'progress' and accept the fact that what remains is beyond Kestryll's ken. We understand and even agree with what he hopes to achieve and realize, as he's posted, that it's going to take others to accomplish what is desired. We also understand that those individuals are going to have to be carefully selected for, as I indicated, not 'everyone' needs access to the information contained behind the curtain. We know, as more or less established fact, that DOJ has kept track of activity on this site and there have been accusations of 'DOJ spies' having been placed within the membership. We also know there are those which are actively attempting to undermine the site and/or take advantage of its problems. Thus, just that 'selection' process as regards who those individuals are going to be who'll fix it involves time and that's not even accounting for finding individuals who are familiar enough with the software packages to do it.
What is irritating and what has engendered my reaction to you are the accusations and presumptions that we 'can't see' that it's frustrating and that we 'condone' the state of the site. We see it. We don't 'condone' it. However, we don't whine about it or grind on the obvious. We DEAL with it as best we can in the interest of, as I indicated, keeping the site viable until the fix is completed. We hope it won't be long, but most of us have seen the alternatives and, to one degree or another, don't wish to make them are 'home site.' Thus, this site has become something more than simply a place to trade, post, lurk, et al. Well, at least to us. Those are the FACTS as we see them.Comment
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As I just indicated, we don't grind on the obvious and, if you've actually kept up, there are reasons why Kestryll hasn't communicated.
First is the fact that, as Kestryll phrased it, he "disengaged with life" for a time due to a personal tragedy. Up until that point, he had, in fact, been responsible for some improvements post-change. Ultimately, given his circumstances, his 'checking out' isn't all that unusual a reaction.
Second, we've been informed by two, prominent moderators (who I won't name here) that the moderator board has been negatively impacted by the problems, meaning their ability to do their job is limited, at best. Further, some of what we know about the 'history' of what was forced on Kestryll by way of the site changes and his personal life have come from posts, not necessarily just on this site.
Three, Kestryll has come to realize that the fix is beyond his technical abilities and he is going to have to find a couple of individuals, at least, who can help take the fix further.
Thus, given just those three things and ignoring other factors (for the moment) what, exactly, do you feel Kestryll has or needs to communicate to them which he hasn't already communicated to the membership at large? As I informed you, being a 'contributor' doesn't necessarily convey upon the contributor 'special status' above the rest of us. It gets you certain, privileged perks. But, as I told you, contributions come in many forms, not simply monetary. Therefore, it would appear, Kestryll is keeping ALL informed and not simply a select cadre of 'special' members.
Now, bear in mind I can't necessarily detail what those perks are as I don't DONATE money, which is voluntary. Instead, I donate traffic, contributions to threads, clicks to advertisers, personal recommendations for the site, etc. All of those are also 'contributions' as they cause revenue generation for the site. If you scroll down the front page, you note a section of the site entitled... CGN/CGSSA CONTRIBUTOR'S' FORUMS. They are open to be accessed by the membership at large. Likewise, if you go to the top of the page, in small font, there is a section entitled... Become a Contributor. What I see as the 'perks' are listed and include unlimited PMs (where we know and have seen ample posts indicating the problems have negatively impacted PMs), custom user color, and access to the Contributor's Lounge. Nowhere do I see it listed that a 'contributor' is entitled to 'special communication' from Kestryll or 'insider' knowledge no other member is allowed.
Similarly, we don't expect, wish, 'hope,' or demand that Kestryll keep us informed of his 'every' move in terms of fixing the site. Some improvements are readily apparent. Some are not apparent, but it is clear 'something' was done. We simply don't know and don't necessarily need to know what, exactly, he needs someone else to do; though he has informed us, in a general sense, what those things involve. Neither do we 'hope,' demand, or cry for 'updates' which, as you phrased it, say... 'F you, I'm working on it.'
It's clear from Corbin Dallas' thread that Kestryll is, in some measure, getting his Life back on track, allowing him to give new 'priority' (at whatever level) to the site. Don't understand the reference? I've given links in this thread and the thread titles in the sub-forums at the top of the site should steer you toward the information. Just remember, most of the members still active here consider "Family First" to be the priority Kestryll should assign as his #1 in relation to getting his Life back on track. It's good to see that the site is 'up there' in terms of his priorities and we expect that we'll see more improvements coming. When? We don't know. But, we DO NOT keep grinding on "I haven't heard" or posting about problems which are already well known and endured by everyone.Last edited by TrappedinCalifornia; 11-22-2025, 10:38 PM.Comment
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Wow. Over reaction IMHO. "whine"? "grind"?
It seems like you are taking a lot of things personally, and also taking things farther than what was originally posted by RevoMan.
You say "We don't necessarily want to see the vast majority 'go' somewhere else" - who is the "we"? Is there a certain group that is "we" ?
Revo's been here since 2007,and my membership is dated from 2008, even though I was here before that. I've donated a lot of time in the past in various means of supporting the 2A, and contributed funds here from the early days. I'd considered setting up as a vendor, but it wouldn't have been, or be currently, a good investment.
I think Revo has a right to say what he said, and more or less attacking him isn't productive, or in the best interest of this site. Just my opinion, of course.
I think all in this thread would like the site to be functional. Commenting that one is happy about it isn't unreasonable IMO.
No one in this thread has attacked Kes. It's been a fair bit of time since any communication, and a little of that would likely go a long way, at least for me. I think it likely would help others as well, but I can't honestly speak for others' desires.
I have more than a small familiarity with how life can take twists and turns, so somewhat empathetic with Kes' situation.
There are some people that it's just not worth engaging.
It's a muzzle BRAKE, not a muzzle break. Or is your muzzle tired?Comment
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I'm not taking them 'personally.' What I'm reacting to is the near-constant stream of complaints, demands, suggestions, etc., particularly as many of them come from members who haven't been keeping up. Just like you asking "who is we?'" Gimme a break. There are all kinds of posts, in various locations on the site. Spend a little time and take a look.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, my own participation on this site predates, by years, my actual join date. Longevity as a member doesn't convey 'special privileges' in terms of inaccurate statements or similar. As a matter of fact, it was complaints about just such posts, by a number of members, which prompted my actually joining. But, I've covered that, several times. Neither does longevity provide a 'trump card' to be used simply because someone else with a later join date posts something you disagree with, for whatever reason.
I never said a member doesn't have a 'right' to post a frustration or observation. We've ALL done that now and again, including during this debacle. What I've indicated, or tried to, is that many here don't see a continual 'grinding' on the problems as productive or useful. Likewise, 'attacks' come in many forms and some of them are, for wont of a better term, 'passive-aggressive' and/or based on a blindered viewpoint. There are others who have, in fact, 'attacked' Kestryll, yet continue to post here. The attacks have been on this site and others. They are clear, denigrating, and, some here have even 'suggested' their membership be revoked as a result. There's also been doxing of Kestryll to one degree or another. Getting the picture?
You see, even your post leaves one scratching their head in terms of intent. For instance... "I think all in this thread would like the site to be functional. Commenting that one is happy about it isn't unreasonable IMO." Happy about what? Happy that someone is posting? Happy that someone wants the site to be functional? Happy that there are problems? Happy that...??? In a nutshell... Huh?
Remember, if you go back and look, it's been clearly stated, a couple of times, that the minimal communication desired is "F you, I'm working on it." Gimme a break. We have Kestryll's directly posted thread with what has gone on in his Life, what his plans were/are, and what he sees it requiring. We have Corbin Dallas' thread indicating that Kestryll is actually or, at least, potentially 'working on it.' What more is needed given that there doesn't seem to be anything more substantive to report?
I stated it before (see above), my overall and original intent was to provide a 'balance' to the post; i.e., provide a more 'complete' background than is being presented. My emphasis has become somewhat more 'stern' as the same posters continue to 'grind' on the same things they were just apprised about and which, by their own admission and allusion, they haven't been keeping up with in terms of 'news,' by their own fault or not being able to access the site regularly due to their schedules.
You see, I'm not 'attacking' anyone so much as, just as I indicated, pointing to the 'rest of the story.' Their message and yours appears to be... We want attention from the owner in the form of updates!!! My message is that those 'updates' have come from the owner and others; i.e., the information desired is actually out there if one takes the time to keep up or catch up. Add in the fact that Kestryll has other priorities beyond this site in terms of getting his Life back on track and the fact that there are those actively working against the best interests of this site and the membership, not to mention a misperception of membership 'rights' (some inadvertent, some deliberate), and while you, personally, and some others may feel as though they are being 'attacked,' myself and others feel it 'necessary' in terms of keeping readers (which goes beyond the membership) apprised of what has been and is happening; both in terms of activities, but attitudes among the entire membership and not simply the 'loudest.'
Again, the idea that posting (not to mention doing so repeatedly) that this site is 'not a good investment,' that there's been 'no communication,' that the owner is 'missing' (his last activity is listed as 11/20), that being a 'monetary' contributor, that this site can't be signed into, that... a whole lot of things... is simply inaccurate. I have no doubt that some perceive it that way. However, bear in mind, that there is NO DOUBT that it is also a narrative which some have attempted to convey for various reasons, many of which are NOT in the best interest of the site or the membership.
Most of us have a 'small bit of familiarity' (some, more than their share of familiarity) 'with how Life can take twists and turns.' That's why we have cut Kestryll some slack and don't repeatedly post a need for his attention. I don't know how many times I have to post this, but NO ONE is 'happy' with the issues this site is experiencing. NO ONE who is legitimately here is 'happy' with the problems Kestryll has been going through in his personal life. Many of us have empathy as we've been through similar. But, that's what I'm getting at. There are ways to 'act like it' and ways which, perceptually, not only place you in the 'adversarial' camp (rightly or wrongly), but which give indications of a lack of empathy and/or understanding.
Feel that my efforts to 'balance' that with information are 'attack?' That might indicate where the attitudinal problem is and, just be aware, I don't see it as with me. Want to 'complain?' You have that right. What I'm indicating is that the tolerance for such complaints has been whittled down among the active members considerably given that much of what is being demanded is actually out there. Want more 'regular' updates? So do most of us. However, what the majority wish for is updates with substance; i.e., something beyond "F you, I'm working on it." Short of that, we work with what we get and attempt to keep the site viable for the membership at large, for the vendors, for the non-member readers, and in the hope that the vast amount of useful information on this site can be maintained/accessible.
Isn't that in the best interest of the site?Last edited by TrappedinCalifornia; 11-23-2025, 12:03 AM.Comment
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You are certainly in the category of "wear them down with experience"
As for "providing balance" - ROFLMAO
If your desire is to help the site? Get help.There are some people that it's just not worth engaging.
It's a muzzle BRAKE, not a muzzle break. Or is your muzzle tired?Comment
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Nice argument.
I'm not trying to 'wear' anyone down. I'm simply responding. Don't like the response? Don't keep posting the same inaccuracies.
You can laugh about 'balance' all you wish. Just be aware that we recognize there are some who truly don't know and aren't aware. Likewise, we recognize there are some attempting to spin a narrative which is not only inaccurate, but not in the interest of this site and is, instead, in their own interests.
Insofar as help, Kestryll has already indicated he's looking into it.
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Inaccuracies?????????????
Nice argument.
I'm not trying to 'wear' anyone down. I'm simply responding. Don't like the response? Don't keep posting the same inaccuracies.
You can laugh about 'balance' all you wish. Just be aware that we recognize there are some who truly don't know and aren't aware. Likewise, we recognize there are some attempting to spin a narrative which is not only inaccurate, but not in the interest of this site and is, instead, in their own interests.
Insofar as help, Kestryll has already indicated he's looking into it.
You just make sheet up, and go as long winded as possible.
Just wow.
I wish I could have quoted your prior post for posterity, but it wouldn't, likely too long.
In all the years I've been here, I've never seen anyone post such a batch of nonsense that does nothing to actually improve the site.
ETA: BTW, I'm sure Ikeo loves your work.There are some people that it's just not worth engaging.
It's a muzzle BRAKE, not a muzzle break. Or is your muzzle tired?Comment
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People are free to go back and look at the exchanges.
You can't access the site. The site isn't working. Yet, here you and others are... posting (on this and other threads)... which requires not only access, but being signed in.
Doesn't that mean that not being able to access the site and claims that the site isn't working are inaccurate? Remember, as I've indicated, numerous times, it's not currently available 24/7/365, but there are any number of members posting EVERY DAY.
Long winded? I didn't think my last post was all that long. It kinda suggests what I said previously about an attitudinal issue which isn't mine. (The length of my posts, as has been gone into ad nauseum, vary considerably and not 'everyone' finds them 'long winded' per se.)
Nonsense? That's YOUR opinion and we've seen where you stand. How about we allow other readers make up their own mind rather than continuing to push a single, negative viewpoint calling for a 'balancing' viewpoint? Don't want to do that? What did I just say about an attitudinal issue that isn't mine?
Insofar as improving site performance, I don't get to work behind the curtain and neither do the vast majority here. We can't perform the needed 'fixes.' All we can do is keep a 'positive' attitude, not continually grouse about the problems, and keep the traffic flowing. Want to do the opposite? Your choice. Just expect that someone will differ.Last edited by TrappedinCalifornia; 11-23-2025, 12:48 AM.Comment
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Forgive me, everyone, but it is time for this thread to be closed.
Everything has been said many times over, and the continuing arguments are not conducive to good order, nor will they result in a magical fix to CG.
-P? "If you want nice fresh oats, you have to pay a fair price. If you are satisfied with oats that have already been through the horse, well, that comes a little cheaper."
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Any updates? Anyone?Originally posted by Citadelgrad87sigpicOriginally posted by HoooperComment
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Thermidorian Reaction . . Prepare for it.We know they are lying, they know they are lying, they know we know they are lying, we know they know we know they are lying, but they are still lying. ~ SolzhenitsynComment
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