delete

[tenpercentfirearms]

Interesting. It seems as though because they process it as a PPT, it should be completed as a PPT. Just because it happens to be in their store doesn't mean that they've taken ownership of the gun, its on their log books and thats it. Just like saying something is at my house even though it may not be my item.

You still aren't getting it. If the FFL is involved in the transaction, then it is as if the FFL is selling it and it is a retail sale. Sales tax must be collected.

So if you bring in a gun for consignment, then the FFL is doing work. They are displaying your firearm for you and selling it for you. They take the money and then pay you after taking their cut later.

Yes, they are running it as a PPT, but because they did work, for tax purposes it is not a PPT.

Any FFL not collecting sales tax on such a transaction will get dinged in a BOE audit. I wouldn't wish a BOE audit on anyone, not even Walmart.

[bombadillo]

That just seems like a terrible way to do it. Just because the FFL had ANYTHING to do with the transaction they're having to collect tax. Be it as it is, I just feel that is wrong. Just for the sake of displaying a gun they're having to tax an item where a PPT is something different altogether. Its not that I'm not getting it, I understand it in full and get where you're coming from but if an FFL takes a gun to do work on it, they take it into their inventory same as a PPT at one point. They don't charge tax on the full amount the gun is worth because they do work on it. That's what is happening here. They're throwing it in a case and doing a PPT on it later. Its no different than doing work except its sitting in a glass case. I understand, don't get me wrong but I feel the BOE is WAY overstepping their boundaries on what is taxable and what isn't.

[tenpercentfirearms]

That just seems like a terrible way to do it. Just because the FFL had ANYTHING to do with the transaction they're having to collect tax. Be it as it is, I just feel that is wrong. Just for the sake of displaying a gun they're having to tax an item where a PPT is something different altogether. Its not that I'm not getting it, I understand it in full and get where you're coming from but if an FFL takes a gun to do work on it, they take it into their inventory same as a PPT at one point. They don't charge tax on the full amount the gun is worth because they do work on it. That's what is happening here. They're throwing it in a case and doing a PPT on it later. Its no different than doing work except its sitting in a glass case. I understand, don't get me wrong but I feel the BOE is WAY overstepping their boundaries on what is taxable and what isn't.

There is a difference. Labor is not taxable, so working on a firearm is simply labor. Retail sale of tangible personal property is taxable, so selling a gun is taxable.

[bombadillo]

So selling a gun on someone elses behalf is taxable then.

[tenpercentfirearms]

So selling a gun on someone elses behalf is taxable then.

If you are a retailer in the state.

[BannedinBritain]

Labor is not taxable

Unless that labor is on a firearm, from a retailer, in the ten day wait period or before the transfer paperwork is completed.

Example: Customer buys rifle online and has it shipped to you. When initiating transfer paperwork, customer hands you a scope and asks if you could mount it before he picks it up. That labor is taxable.

California sucks.

[tenpercentfirearms]

Unless that labor is on a firearm, from a retailer, in the ten day wait period or before the transfer paperwork is completed.

Example: Customer buys rifle online and has it shipped to you. When initiating transfer paperwork, customer hands you a scope and asks if you could mount it before he picks it up. That labor is taxable.

California sucks.

Reference?

[BannedinBritain]

Reference?

I'll see if I can find it...it has to do with the final retail value of the firearm you're transferring...which is also why the transfer fee on a firearm from an out of state retailer is taxable.

[halifax]

From a BOE "Tax Facts sheet "When is Labor Taxable"

Modifying an item or system as part of a sale is also considered fabrication

Fabrication is taxable.

I will try to find the link.

ETA: This isn't the exact paper I'm looking at but it's close:

http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub108.pdf

[tenpercentfirearms]

From a BOE "Tax Facts sheet "When is Labor Taxable"



Fabrication is taxable.

I will try to find the link.

ETA: This isn't the exact paper I'm looking at but it's close:

http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub108.pdf

It makes sense, I just wanted some further proof. Thank you.

[rbetts]

BOE was here yesterday. The guy was actually transfering a gun from Buds Gun Shop. He didn't tell me he was from the BOE until after the transaction was over with and I asked him for the online receipt. He didn't have it, so we visited Buds website together to determine Fair Market Value. It was then as he was paying his tax that he told me he liked my tax collection notice on the counter and that he worked in the Sales & Use Tax Department at the BOE. I was SHOCKED to say the least and asked if it was an official visit. He said no, but that he was glad that I was playing by the rules (even though he, on a personal level, felt that the Amazon deal and the nexus taxation that we are doing is far from over for them at the BOE). Looks like there's a big fight ahead on that front.

Anyway, THIS IS THE REAL DEAL FOLKS! WANT TO STAY IN BUSINESS? COLLECT the TAX. My Transfer Business has actually picked up now that I have a clear explanation of the process, issue and my personal feelings against the Dealers having to do the states dirty work.

Bet he was here on purpose.

And finally, to all the customers that have been lucky enough not to pay tax in the past at ANY dealer. Your days are really really numbered. Wished it wasn't so, because it's a royal PITA to do the extra paperwork. Don't like it. Vote with your BRAIN and use your mouth to tell others to VOTE with theirs too!

My 2 cents!

[caoboy]

I recently got taxed on a non PPT transfer. FFL told me he had to start collecting taxes, I said ok, no biggie. He saves me money on not ripping me off for the transfer, I'm not going to complain about a dollar and change.

FFL's have to play stupid games, we have to play along with them.