Just A Question?

[Helmut Shmacher Space Chimp]

Do you fellows think there is a place for the use of special equipment in law enforcement ? And when I refer to this term I mean military/military spec equipment. No judgement on my part..Just for my own education. Thanks for your input..

[micro911]

I have used many military surplus items acquired through the department during my career, including boots, bags, GORETEX clothings, etc. They are great.

[SoCalDep]

Yes.

[Country_Jim]

You'll have to excuse me if I don't believe this question isn't to bait LE. You tell me if we need "military spec equipment", or better yet do you need "military spec equipment"? If not turn in your AR, semiauto pistols and rifles.

[hey_scooter]

What do you mean my special equipment?

[mixicus]

In LE, we have to accomplish certain tasks in the safest possible manner. By safest that includes the safety of victims, the community, officers and suspects. If the military or any other field/profession has already developed a piece of equipment or technique to allow us to do that, we should use it.

I hope that you are not making a media mistake by confusing gear that looks military with actual military gear. I'm sure my firearms can be found in an armory for some unit on some US military base somewhere but they are not standard military issue (i.e. semi-auto AR pattern rifles, 870 shotguns, Glock pistols). The armored vehicle that will show up to help me rescue an injured person is civilian in make though it may LOOK military. My gas mask and body armor are also LE not military in manufacture. If I wear a black Nomex balaclava that looks .mil; it’s not to look cool, it’s to save my skin in case of flash in certain environments. I do not fault any department for using free gear from the military to address a need (i.e. a free military MRAP instead of a $300K civilian Bearcat). A few extra military surplus NVG’s would come in handy for nighttime searches/perimeters/surveillances.

Interestingly enough, the thing/technique that I have used the most often that is most directly military in nature is Tactical Combat Causality Care procedures and tourniquets (though not acquired from the military).

[WyattandDoc]

I'll answer your question with a few questions.

You and your family are caught up in an Active Shooter situation. First Responders show up and start to engage the suspect. Their plan is to lay down suppression fire and evacuate you behind one of their vehicles.

Do you want their suppression fire to come from sidearms or Military Suplus
M-4's?

Do you want them outfitted in Military Surplus Ballistic Vests and Helmets in case they catch a round and can continue to bring you and your family to safety?

Do you want them to bring you and your family behind a Crown Victoria or a Military Surplus vehicle designed to stop bullets?

I'm anxious to hear your answers.

[KD714]

I'll answer your question with a few questions.

You and your family are caught up in an Active Shooter situation. First Responders show up and start to engage the suspect. Their plan is to lay down suppression fire and evacuate you behind one of their vehicles.

Do you want their suppression fire to come from sidearms or Military Suplus
M-4's?

Do you want them outfitted in Military Surplus Ballistic Vests and Helmets in case they catch a round and can continue to bring you and your family to safety?

Do you want them to bring you and your family behind a Crown Victoria or a Military Surplus vehicle designed to stop bullets?

I'm anxious to hear your answers.

Awesome response WyattandDoc!

I am stealing it to use for myself.

Some hipster asked me a similar question all nonchalantly last week and I wish I could have responded with that. I pretty much cornered her with her own argument but this would have been much easier and allowed us to drink our coffee in peace.

[Helmut Shmacher Space Chimp]

I'll answer your question with a few questions.

You and your family are caught up in an Active Shooter situation. First Responders show up and start to engage the suspect. Their plan is to lay down suppression fire and evacuate you behind one of their vehicles.

Do you want their suppression fire to come from sidearms or Military Suplus
M-4's?

Do you want them outfitted in Military Surplus Ballistic Vests and Helmets in case they catch a round and can continue to bring you and your family to safety?

Do you want them to bring you and your family behind a Crown Victoria or a Military Surplus vehicle designed to stop bullets?

I'm anxious to hear your answers.

I think my answer would be a big yes on this..I do favor the use of such equipment. To clarify I am not against the use of such...I think with the changing face of crime you have to change also. But the liberals want to suppress the 2A and the police are in the middle. Unfortunately as always

[rcslotcar]

I some times wear mil spec pants and boots. I even own an ar 15 it has several mil spec parts. I own an old jeep that was mil spec. Police are not the only ones with mil spec items.

[Nacho_Eater]

I'm former Army. Don't make the mistake in assuming that "military gear" means that it's good. The Army issues a lot of junk. When I was in Iraq, I saw more than a few soldiers/units using COTS gear from places like REI. This COTS gear was usually clothing, boots, etc.

[IrishJoe3]

I'm former Army. Don't make the mistake in assuming that "military gear" means that it's good. The Army issues a lot of junk. When I was in Iraq, I saw more than a few soldiers/units using COTS gear from places like REI. This COTS gear was usually clothing, boots, etc.

Seriously this.

I have to shake my head. Bashing liberals who use the phrase 'Military Style' is CalGuns favorite past time.

Unless that 'Military Style' refers to anything remotely Law Enforcement related. In that case, that 'Military Style' gear somehow transforms officers into robotic killers just itching to invade their own community and mow down their own neighbors.

[IrishJoe3]

I some times wear mil spec pants and boots. I even own an ar 15 it has several mil spec parts. I own an old jeep that was mil spec. Police are not the only ones with mil spec items.

Army/Navy stores have been quite popular since WWII and before. They are a great place to get sturdy gear pretty cheaply. A fact not lost on law enforcement either.

[Helmut Shmacher Space Chimp]

I think the fact is that the Feds issue a lot of gear and sometime it goes to some departments who may not have the training to use it. I really don't have any info if the Feds see to training the respective PDs that get the gear to make sure they use it right. I apologize for any lack of info on this part of the thread.

[IrishJoe3]

I think the fact is that the Feds issue a lot of gear and sometime it goes to some departments who may not have the training to use it. I really don't have any info if the Feds see to training the respective PDs that get the gear to make sure they use it right. I apologize for any lack of info on this part of the thread.

Okay. What gear is being issued without adequate training? What gear do you see as being even a POTENTIAL problem in this regard?

Most of the squak seems to be about 'scary looking' (does this sound to familiar to the pro AR15 gun owners?). How much training do you need to put on body armor and a helmet?