Do we still 'Belong' here?

[CSACANNONEER]

I think many of us (myself included) tend not to voice our positive opinions of LEOs enough but, when a LEO does something illegal or immoral we express our opinions. I have been in or around LE all my life and I can't stand the LEOs who have superiority complexes and/or the "us vs. them" mentality. I probably get thhat from my father who retired after 31 years as a Federal LEO and also spent several years as a local reserve when I was a baby. Anyway, I'm sorry if anyone ever reads any of my anti-bad cop posts and misreads them in such a way as to think that I'm anti LE. I'm not. I am anti-unconstitutional laws and anti-bad cop though.

I can take the cop haters. However, I WILL NOT tolerate military bashers.

America. Love it or leave it.

My other sigline:


Justin

Both you and the OP are way too close minded. I don't care what uniform one is wearing. If they are a disgrace to the uniform, they deserve a lot more than just getting bashed on an internet forum.

[slowjonn]

Lavgrunt,

Really? I thought your skin was a little thicker than that. Get over it and either move on or ignore the haters.

With that said, I appreciate what LE's contribute to Calguns and to society. I think you will find that the haters are like hard core left wingers...the minority but often the most vocal.

To all the officers, especially the ones here at calguns...I salute you and thanks for what you do.

Lav...If I run into you at SAR this year, the drinks are on me!

[CSACANNONEER]

If I run into you at SAR this year, the drinks are on me!

Worst hangover I ever had was at SAR in '86. I even missed two seminars that morning.

[Suvorov]

The LEOs that are active shooters (no - no not that kind of 'active shooter') have to remain and stay vocal. You need to remind the vast majority here that the LEO is a "good guy" and that many, if not most, cherish shooting and the Second Amendment as much as anyone here. There will always be those who will hate the "man", you guys know that. And the crap you deal with here is no worse that what you deal with at work. Still, I understand that you come here to relax and not have some internet commando calling you a baby killer. I know how your guys feel.

Just know that the vast majority of guys here respect first responders such as yourselves. Kalifornia is a funny place and no where have I lived have a seen such a wall between the Cops and the average citizen, but at the risk of sounding like I wear my foil cap a little to tight - that is all part of the plan.

We can not afford to be dependent on the DOJ, especially one run by Kamilla Harris, to keep the rank and file aware of firearms related issues like OLLs and the like. You guys that are hear are also the guys who can educate your department on the ever changing legal landscape of Kalifornia gun laws.

That said, there are other forums out there such as m4carbine.net that welcome LEOs and have a level of maturity that is light years beyond that here on Calguns. My presence here had waned over the last year or two for that reason. But Calguns serves a vital function and it is imperative that the pro RKBA LEOs are being heard.

Please for the sake of much more than this forum, stay and keep your presence strong and heard.

[Rhythm of Life]

If we all got together and acted like CalGunners and stopped seperating LEO users from the average joe to the service members it would be a more cohesive unit. But as long as people identify with different groups and not the CGN it will always be different.

Just like here in America. I consider myself American, but I ask people on the streets, they tell me African, Mexican, Philipino, whatever. The fact is they identify with a sub group and that is why there are racial and cultural tensions in America. We are a chopped salad, not a melting pot.

[jdberger]

You have to remember that as CA gun owners, we're already self-selected as being somewhat defiant of authority. Add to that the libertarian slant to our politics, the willingness to push boundaries (bullet buttons, AK build parties, AR pistols), our willingness to challenge authority, etc. and you're gonna get some inevitable "cop bashing".

Calgunners simply don't appreciate being told what they can and cannot do. We, as a community, don't really appreciate having to ask permission.

But along with the "cop bashing" we get the gay bashing threads, criticisms of liberals, immigrants, lawyers, Conservatives, Muslims, Mormons, Israel, Arabs, and a whole host of other groups.

With any criticism of a group, or the practices of a group, there are going to be people that make their point in an impolitic manner. Feelings are going to get hurt. It's unfortunate, but if we truly want to keep a robust debate going, both sides need to give a little. Critics need to strive to be more polite, and the criticized need to try to not take things as personal (I understand that the latter is difficult).

The LEOs on this forum are an irreplaceable valuable resource. They offer a different perspective on things. I, for one, would hate to lose them.

[ankyle62]

I just gotta learn to stay out of Off topic. And 2A. And General gun discussions.

While Im not an LEO yet, I agree. The views of some people here are way out there and not worth arguing with(like that recent thread in off topic you were posting in). I rather not get involved with most areas of this site.

Im here mostly for the For Sale section and other random topics I may see.

[OneSevenDeuce]

The problem, I believe, is not so much do cops belong on CalGuns. I think it has to do with the tone of some of the posts by known LEOs. When a known LEO makes a post saying that people should stop complaining about the high cap mag laws, or makes a post bragging about how he can carry concealed when the rest of us cannot, it can sometimes provoke a harsh response. I'm not saying that LEOs always provoke the negative responses they get, because they don't. However what I am saying is that some of the less mature among your ranks sometimes flaunt their exempt status in ways that the older and more experienced would perhaps not.

Is this a reason for people to make harsh judgments on LEOs and post hateful things about them? No, certainly not. However it should not be surprising that some of the reaction to these people is negative, and somewhat tarnishes the image of other LEOs on Calguns. These issues are also quite sensitive, especially to some military members on this site. Some of us have been on multiple combat tours, faced a determined enemy, and handled firearms in situations that would make most men cower. We are "sheepdogs" too, but we can't be afforded the same rights as LEOs because we are not the enforcing arm of civilian law.

Be that as it may. Whether you are military, civilian LEO, or just a civilian trying to make it through this world, these issues matter. Everyone among us should be afforded these rights, and it is a very sore spot when LEOs put smileys, or faces with tongues sticking out of them, when they are talking about rights they posses but the average citizen does not in open forums populated by people (Americans) who are naturally wary of authority.

Just my .02.

[ojisan]

Please for the sake of much more than this forum, stay and keep your presence strong and heard.

[chickenfried]

the folks that get it the worst on calguns. UPS, Fedex, and USPS workers.

I don't take it personally when people criticize the actions of other telephone company employees


that said, I hope you guys stay here at calguns

[negolien]

100% agree

Hey guys/gals,

I feel your pain and the issue is totally understandable. When I came to this forum I though wow Gun rights, Guns this should be an awesome fourm...shortly after I started browsing the forums I realize humm kinda alot of anti-government anti-cop posts on here. People fail to understand how much cops put it out there for us imo. Easier to complain and cry about overzealous cops than actually get out there and do something yourself. Alot of these bashers do nothing but search the web looking for some article about a rouge cop so they can post it here. Sop what who care get over it. One in 1,000,000,000 big deal any segment of society is gonna have a percentage of tards look at calguns O.o rofl :<)...

I think mods should start thinking about limiting these posts to if something actually happens to you. I' am tired of these I read somewhere on some anti-cop website that joe Detective did this to someone else. I don't see alot of positive activity coming out of those cops suck posts.

[Hopalong]

The premise of my question is very simple:

As LE officers, do we belong on 'CalGuns' ??

We are 'CalGunners' cuz well, we like to shoot and talk about our hobby and interests in the shooting sports with others !! It's that simple......For the most part, we wish ALL law abiding citizens had CCW rights, we support UOC, we wish the 'roster' would go away and we realize how worthless the AW and mag ban laws are......We are on the side of the 'CalGuns' community.........Natural allies.......

Yet, despite our support of the rights of all shooters, there is a small, but very vocal and viscious 'CalGuns' minority who hate cops. Doesn't matter what the subject matter is, how the question is posed or how you reply; the sharks will come out as soon as they smell blood in the water..........We all know how the 'cycle' evolves........And devolves.......

So why do we continue to put up with it? Why are we still on 'CalGuns' ? Personally, I think it's cuz we love a good fight !!! Its in our blood to stand our ground and not be run off !! We stick together and back each others play........Its what we do.........It's not about 'US v. THEM'...........Its about loyalty, honor and being there for your partners........

..........PERIOD !!!

Can we just get back to talking about SIGs and H&Ks ?????

Of course you belong here.
I'm always interested in the LE perspective. I watch cops.
It's a tough, sometimes thankless job, I couldn't do it. I understand the camaraderie.
The VAST MAJORITY of citizens are pro LE. You can't focus on the minority. Your skin will get thicker as you mature.
I've noticed your posts mention, fighting , and backing someone's play. Kind of a cowboy lexicon. As you get older, you'll probably tone that down some.
You remind me of my apprentice, he's 25, and we shoe and train horses, a true cowboy lifestyle. He's often spoiling for a fight(with the horses), to prove how tough he is. I'm always telling him, "let's do it this way, it'll be easier on everyone." He thinks people want to mess with him when he's at a bar. Believe me, no one wants to F with him.
Same with you. Nobody wants to mess with you. I'd bet most guys would love to have you watching their back.
Your attitude and tone will dictate how things play out, a sort of "you reap what you sow" kind of thing. With horses, there is a definite "carrot and stick " approach. I'd think it would be similar in your line of work.
Take what I say with a grain of salt, a sort of fatherly advice.
No doubt, you've got sand.

[SVT-40]

Agree with the bold part , however the rest of your post has a real " US v. Them " tone to it.

That's because he is posing the question to his fellow LEO's. Not anyone else.

No, as you say "Us vs Them".

Just a question ONLY focused at LEO's

I too sometimes wonder why stay?

Even in this LEO forum far to many times non LEO's feel the need to add their 2 cents worth.

Maybe non LEO's cannot understand this idea.

At work LEO's get all kinds of crap. From the public at large as well as management.

Off duty they want to relax and not be barraged with criticism. Since the LEO's here on Calguns are gun guys we want to relax here and not be criticized simply because we are LEO's.

Bottom line. This hobby and posting here is a vacation from the stresses of the job. Please don't ruin our vacation.

[Suvorov]

The problem, I believe, is not so much do cops belong on CalGuns. I think it has to do with the tone of some of the posts by known LEOs. When a known LEO makes a post saying that people should stop complaining about the high cap mag laws, or makes a post bragging about how he can carry concealed when the rest of us cannot, it can sometimes provoke a harsh response. I'm not saying that LEOs always provoke the negative responses they get, because they don't. However what I am saying is that some of the less mature among your ranks sometimes flaunt their exempt status in ways that the older and more experienced would perhaps not.

Is this a reason for people to make harsh judgments on LEOs and post hateful things about them? No, certainly not. However it should not be surprising that some of the reaction to these people is negative, and somewhat tarnishes the image of other LEOs on Calguns. These issues are also quite sensitive, especially to some military members on this site. Some of us have been on multiple combat tours, faced a determined enemy, and handled firearms in situations that would make most men cower. We are "sheepdogs" too, but we can't be afforded the same rights as LEOs because we are not the enforcing arm of civilian law.

Be that as it may. Whether you are military, civilian LEO, or just a civilian trying to make it through this world, these issues matter. Everyone among us should be afforded these rights, and it is a very sore spot when LEOs put smileys, or faces with tongues sticking out of them, when they are talking about rights they posses but the average citizen does not in open forums populated by people (Americans) who are naturally wary of authority.

Just my .02.

Can you show me an example of this from one of the well known LEOs here? RonSolo? LavGrunt? Retired? Yzernie? I don't ever recall seeing such a thing.

[Casual_Shooter]

I appreciate the input from LEO's. If you can look past the vocal few, it'd be nice if you (all LEO's) stayed.