Price Gouging

[Shumba]

As a LEO I just want to get something off my chest:

I believe that my brothers in blue on this site that use their unique position to purchase off roster guns and then take advantage of the ridiculous restrictions that California places on our non-LEO gun-loving patriots to sell them at 2 or 3 times the purchase price are no better than some of the criminals they've put behind bars. Ya'll should be ashamed of yourselves.

To those non-LEO gun buyers, I want to apologize. It's unfair that the State has set up this ridiculous system. And it's doubly unfair that some who wear the badge have taken advantage of it. Those of us in Law Enforcement are no better than you, and shouldn't be treated differently.

I see your point and can't disagree with it. The Roster should not exist. How many people have been injured, had an AD, etc. solely due to the fact that the features required by the Roster didn't exist on a handgun? If you follow the gun safety rules, a non-Roster gun is no more dangerous than a Roster listed gun as proven daily in every other state. Every law abiding CA resident should be able to buy any legal handgun they want (to include standard/high capacity magazines) in my opinion. People obeying the laws, are not the people we need to worry about (for the most part).

I am guilty of selling an off-Roster handgun for a price that may have been higher than my acquisition price. I am also guilty of selling nice guns, high priced fishing gear, high-end optics and other nice equipment for prices lower than I bought them for. I'm a terrible consumer and always think I need the newest, latest, greatest thing and then many times soon realize the item wasn't really that great or special and decide I should sell it and buy something else. This has happened over the years with a few off Roster guns as well as a lot of other items and when I decide I should sell something I check out the market price and list my items at a price that is hopefully close to what similar items are priced. When I buy, my intention is never to sell, but things change.

Something to consider with the concept that LEO should not benefit due to his/her LEO status. Have you ever taken/accepted an LEO discount on anything (food, products, equipment, services, mobile phone bill, etc.) that is not available to Joe citizen who does not have LEO status? I assume you may have sometime in your career. Seems like you can consider the concept somewhat similar in that you are benefiting due to your LEO status. There are also many On-Roster guns, CA approved long guns, etc. that I could buy with a LEO discount below the cost that Joe Citizen could buy (Blue Label Gen 3 Glock at ProForce, etc.). Sure, it could be a $2 discount on an item, a 5% discount at Turner's, a 20% manufacturer's discount on a high priced optic, etc. but based on your position above (someone benefiting due to LEO status), it seems like we should also be turning down all LEO discounts.

Please know that I am NOT disagreeing with you. I actually agree with your statement and applaud you for putting it out there and reminding LEO's of this:
Those of us in Law Enforcement are no better than you, and shouldn't be treated differently

Just saying that if we agree with your thoughts on this subject, maybe the concept should be more widely applied to all LEO/First Responder discounts. Should also apply to the "Brass Pass" when it comes to traffic infractions/citations, etc.

Anyway, don't mean to open a can of worms with this. Just saying that LEO's can be treated differently (both positively and negatively) than Joe Citizen and debating the concept of being treated the same should apply more widely than just the Off-Roster scenario

[esy]

I just got a red light ticket.

I could’ve easily hit up a bunch of Judges that I know and probably gotten it dropped. Did I? Nope, because I did it, I’m on camera, etc. Just paid the ridiculous $500 fine and traffic school.

Now I got to go sign up for some OT. :sigh:

[Old Marine]

I am not a LEO in any capacity, but I would like to add a Joe Citizen point if view.
There are guns the public would not have access to if it were not for Leo's selling them, even if they sell it at 3 times the price.

To me this is no different than someone buying a baseball card at a yard sale for a buck, all the while knowing it is worth hundreds.


Big deal, a Cop makes a few extra bucks! Who really cares? Not Joe Citizen who is buying it.
No one complains when shots are fired and that same Officer runs TOWARDS the sound of gun fire.
A California LEO gets a small perk, I aplaude that.
No different than me picking up a check for a couple of officers at lunch.

There are measures in place to keep it from being abused, so other than that, I see it as yet another way Officers protect and SERVE.


end of rant.
Joe Citizen

[Grimjack]

Something to consider with the concept that LEO should not benefit due to his/her LEO status. Have you ever taken/accepted an LEO discount on anything (food, products, equipment, services, mobile phone bill, etc.) that is not available to Joe citizen who does not have LEO status? I assume you may have sometime in your career. Seems like you can consider the concept somewhat similar in that you are benefiting due to your LEO status. There are also many On-Roster guns, CA approved long guns, etc. that I could buy with a LEO discount below the cost that Joe Citizen could buy (Blue Label Gen 3 Glock at ProForce, etc.). Sure, it could be a $2 discount on an item, a 5% discount at Turner's, a 20% manufacturer's discount on a high priced optic, etc. but based on your position above (someone benefiting due to LEO status), it seems like we should also be turning down all LEO discounts.

Please know that I am NOT disagreeing with you. I actually agree with your statement and applaud you for putting it out there and reminding LEO's of this:
Those of us in Law Enforcement are no better than you, and shouldn't be treated differently

Just saying that if we agree with your thoughts on this subject, maybe the concept should be more widely applied to all LEO/First Responder discounts. Should also apply to the "Brass Pass" when it comes to traffic infractions/citations, etc.

Anyway, don't mean to open a can of worms with this. Just saying that LEO's can be treated differently (both positively and negatively) than Joe Citizen and debating the concept of being treated the same should apply more widely than just the Off-Roster scenario

While I can understand how a discount would appear similar, when you dig a little deeper there is a difference. (Yes I have taken discounts when offered in the past, even though now I no longer do) The difference being is that discounts are offered by private companies, which are under no obligation to do so. They receive no benefit from doing it, and there are no consequences for not doing it. They are offered to other public sector "service" jobs like firefighters, EMS, and military.

On the other hand, the roster was created solely, in my opinion, to punish gun owners. It serves no useful purpose. Off roster guns sold in every other state in the country don't suddenly become dangerous when sold here. The LEOs that buy those guns and turn massive profits on them are taking advantage of their status and the laws that discriminate against other "classes" of citizens.

I'm frankly surprised that no one has made a legal case to either close the "roster loophole" or abolish the roster altogether.

[pacrat]

I'm frankly surprised that no one has made a legal case to either close the "roster loophole" or abolish the roster altogether.

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=812117

That exact battle has been making its way through the Courts for 10 yrs.

On the other hand, the roster was created solely, in my opinion, to punish gun owners. It serves no useful purpose. Off roster guns sold in every other state in the country don't suddenly become dangerous when sold here. The LEOs that buy those guns and turn massive profits on them are taking advantage of their status and the laws that discriminate against other "classes" of citizens.

As a citizens of Ca, I agree with and applaud you.

With the caveat that those "very few" cops who do this. Are a tiny part of a percentage point, of the overwhelming number of good cops.

In any "class" of people, there will always be some, who are less than honorable.

[rudigan]

Agree! Its 100% a buyers dictated market.

Too many "Sheep" willing to buy at a high price are the "problem", that they created.

OK with reaping what the open market bears, but this is not an open market. This is DOJ created cluster that subjectively gives those blessed with the "exempt" status access to goodies that we all want but cannot access.

OPs point is some of his brethren are using their law enforcement status to screw the peons, and we see it happen a lot. Agree or not, that's my belief/opinion on this jacked up system.

[vino68]

Thanks. Also the agent or officer in Santa Fe Springs was too greedy.

[chsk9]

I believe that legislators promote this two tiered system to divide and conquer in their quest to disarm the citizens of California. It should be strongly refuted by everyone who lives in the State.

[Drakulya]

I thought LE was limited to 6 sale transactions per year like the rest of us. So although they can buy as many guns as they want, I do believe they can legally only have 6 sales transactions per year. That's why the Pasadena LT was busted. If I remember correctly it was during a state review they found he had made over 200 transaction in a year. Anyone making more than 6 sales is considered a dealer by the state. Someone correct me if I am wrong but this was my understanding.

If officers can give us an opportunity to get a gun we normally would not have access to so be it. I have no problem with them taking time out of their day to help us out. If you want the gun you pay market value. If you don't then buy one of those available to California. It's supply and demand that drives the price. This applies to everything. An item isn't worth its asking price, it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Clearly a lot of folks are willing to pay. I am sure prices reduced as people negotiate better deals, but we don't get to see that.

[1911su16b870]

IMHO The CA roster is a defacto infringement on the 2A.

[kiyo21]

Hey, so since his post is here I was wondering if I could ask.
Would any roster exempt person be willing to help me with this
exact problem? I’m looking into a model that isn’t on the roster
but am trying to add to my collection for range use. I’d someday
like to compete in local steel target competitions also. The firearm
would only be for me and my collection, I only buy to own and every
gun I have ever owned is still in my possession to this day. I have all
my info and am aloud to own and purchase firearms legally. If this
sounds like a possibility I would greatly appreciate the help and would
definitely provide gas money or a nice lunch even a beer or two if
you’d like. I’m ask because I found the one I’m looking for but at the
price that is being asked I can’t afford it due to the price being
Almost triple what the gun is new.

[Rogue187]

What your asking sounds like your asking a LEO to straw purchase the firearm for you.
That illegal..

If your not allowed to purchase the firearm as it is off roster your only recourse is to look on the sale board or find someone selling the exact model your looking for.

You can get the firearm using the special exemptions.

Good Luck.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[vintagearms]

Its interesting to read the LE who are profiteers and those that are not.

[kiyo21]

What your asking sounds like your asking a LEO to straw purchase the firearm for you.
That illegal..

If your not allowed to purchase the firearm as it is off roster your only recourse is to look on the sale board or find someone selling the exact model your looking for.

You can get the firearm using the special exemptions.

Good Luck.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[roostersgt]

Its interesting to read the LE who are profiteers and those that are not.

There are a hell of a lot more LEOs who would never take advantage of their "perks" than most here could ever imagine. I don't personally know of any who are so hard up for cash that they'd risk their livelihood to make a couple hundred dollars, and take the time to actually go through all the BS in selling a firearm. Never made any sense to me why some did what they did. I'd never sell a firearm.