Tweet
There have been FOUR separate incidents reported here at Calguns of visits by DOJ and that they were suited up for action. Another member (a moderator?) said there were some others but that they were not authorized nor wanted to offer details.
I believe most departments or counties/cities do have protocols/procedures of when a no knock warrant is allowed.
Otherwise they are supposed to act like a civilized person interacting with another civilized person, ....and such a civilized person would not bash down your door, shoot your barking dog, and pull your screaming wife out of the house and handcuff her. They would have a clear definition of a high risk warrant where their protocol would then allow them to act this way and not be polite and notify you and show you the warrant as has been upheld in the court appeals system.
Unfortunately it appears that lawful gun owner's are now classified the same as armed felons as high risk when it comes to defining this risk/threat assessment where they get to suit up in their armor, handcuff people, and break things, (is it the color of the black guns we own?). I am thinking in the more rural areas if its the local LE you don't hear of this rude and impolite behavior and dress up for war fighting but sometimes when its an outside big city or Federal LE agency things do happen (Branch Davidian's, Ruby Ridge, the Bundy family)
In my lifetime I have had contact with LE over firearms twice at my residence, once for buying two complete M4 uppers off of ebay at a most excellent price that the NCIS came and collected from me saying they were government property and offered no other details other than it was not my property-ever-even if I bought it off of eBay. My best guess is they were brought back from Iraq by a marine-they were rather well used and showed a lot of wear and tear- but they would not tell me if my guess was right. They sent a bill later for the one of the uppers that I had welded the flash hider on saying it was destruction of government property requiring reimbursement-all by mail with a bill and an address to send my payment, and who to contact to adjudicate if I did not agree to their findings or could not afford to pay-not scary at all. I was not required to surrender the fitted out lower receiver with that upper. The second was long ago (1985??) ....it was a UZI parts kit bought off of Shotgun News when they frowned on the kits having all the full auto parts included, and politely asked me to surrender it to them as they were classifying it as a machine gun. Both times they called me in advance and asked to arrange for an appointment at my home with the offending items and told me I could have a lawyer present but that they only wanted my cooperation in surrendering the items...I would not face any legal implications. Today this would just be an LE tactic of lying to you to get more evidence against you-but back then I trusted what they said because LE was not yet known for lying to law abiding citizens and an enforcement tactic. They did not threaten me if I chose not to cooperate nor were they threatening in their demeanor-the ATF even suggested and alternative because the only enforcement they stated was if I was found with the parts kit in my possession ....and also said if I did not surrender it they recommended destroying it. Both times they came dressed as if they were going to Sunday Church. One of the ATF agents was a young lady fresh out of college wearing the tightest and shortest female business suit with high heals, hair, makeup, the whole bit-maybe they had court late that day or maybe they were just polite visitors at my home. Never saw a fritz helmet or boots or shooting goggles or bullet proof vests or any firearms being waived around- no black Ninja Costumes-no balaclavas. The visits were very cordial which encouraged me to reciprocate and cooperate as they did not treat me as a criminal that wanted to shoot them if I was given a chance so I did not feel nervous.
The reported unannounced maximum force visits of six DOJ agents dressed in their ninja assassin war costumes, coming to your work so all you co-workers can see, making a scene at your house for the benefit of the neighbors, ..... well that disgusts me. It is very nasty, mean spirited, rude, impolite, and uncalled for when visiting a law abiding citizens home or work when all they are trying too do follow the law for legal and lawful ownership.
I believe most departments or counties/cities do have protocols/procedures of when a no knock warrant is allowed.
Otherwise they are supposed to act like a civilized person interacting with another civilized person, ....and such a civilized person would not bash down your door, shoot your barking dog, and pull your screaming wife out of the house and handcuff her. They would have a clear definition of a high risk warrant where their protocol would then allow them to act this way and not be polite and notify you and show you the warrant as has been upheld in the court appeals system.
Unfortunately it appears that lawful gun owner's are now classified the same as armed felons as high risk when it comes to defining this risk/threat assessment where they get to suit up in their armor, handcuff people, and break things, (is it the color of the black guns we own?). I am thinking in the more rural areas if its the local LE you don't hear of this rude and impolite behavior and dress up for war fighting but sometimes when its an outside big city or Federal LE agency things do happen (Branch Davidian's, Ruby Ridge, the Bundy family)
In my lifetime I have had contact with LE over firearms twice at my residence, once for buying two complete M4 uppers off of ebay at a most excellent price that the NCIS came and collected from me saying they were government property and offered no other details other than it was not my property-ever-even if I bought it off of eBay. My best guess is they were brought back from Iraq by a marine-they were rather well used and showed a lot of wear and tear- but they would not tell me if my guess was right. They sent a bill later for the one of the uppers that I had welded the flash hider on saying it was destruction of government property requiring reimbursement-all by mail with a bill and an address to send my payment, and who to contact to adjudicate if I did not agree to their findings or could not afford to pay-not scary at all. I was not required to surrender the fitted out lower receiver with that upper. The second was long ago (1985??) ....it was a UZI parts kit bought off of Shotgun News when they frowned on the kits having all the full auto parts included, and politely asked me to surrender it to them as they were classifying it as a machine gun. Both times they called me in advance and asked to arrange for an appointment at my home with the offending items and told me I could have a lawyer present but that they only wanted my cooperation in surrendering the items...I would not face any legal implications. Today this would just be an LE tactic of lying to you to get more evidence against you-but back then I trusted what they said because LE was not yet known for lying to law abiding citizens and an enforcement tactic. They did not threaten me if I chose not to cooperate nor were they threatening in their demeanor-the ATF even suggested and alternative because the only enforcement they stated was if I was found with the parts kit in my possession ....and also said if I did not surrender it they recommended destroying it. Both times they came dressed as if they were going to Sunday Church. One of the ATF agents was a young lady fresh out of college wearing the tightest and shortest female business suit with high heals, hair, makeup, the whole bit-maybe they had court late that day or maybe they were just polite visitors at my home. Never saw a fritz helmet or boots or shooting goggles or bullet proof vests or any firearms being waived around- no black Ninja Costumes-no balaclavas. The visits were very cordial which encouraged me to reciprocate and cooperate as they did not treat me as a criminal that wanted to shoot them if I was given a chance so I did not feel nervous.
The reported unannounced maximum force visits of six DOJ agents dressed in their ninja assassin war costumes, coming to your work so all you co-workers can see, making a scene at your house for the benefit of the neighbors, ..... well that disgusts me. It is very nasty, mean spirited, rude, impolite, and uncalled for when visiting a law abiding citizens home or work when all they are trying too do follow the law for legal and lawful ownership.
Comment