Gov. Brown is no fool

[OleCuss]

Okay, just some thoughts on Jerry Brown.

1. Signed Amicus in favor of 2A. Check.

2. Signed AB610 to standardize 12050 PC. Check.

3. Vetoed bill to register ammo. Check.

As others have already said, long gun registration doesn't go into effect until 2014, that gives our side time to get it ruled unconstitutional. AB144 made carrying an unloaded handgun illegal, an issue that stood in the way of a ruling in our favor in Peruta. Now they're going to have to come up with an alternative to that which, in their mind satisfies, the right to bear arms. So what could that possibly be ?

Sorry, but I'm not seeing the bad side to this yet.

Even I am not quite that happy with recent events!

But over the years JB has done even more than you've noted above.

So far as his recent signings of anti-RKBA bills? I view that more as someone who worries more about how his troops look than how they fight. The intent is to do such and so - the fact that the effect may be the opposite is irrelevant to the intent.

But then, again, the fascist concept is that if your thoughts are pure and you are attempting to use government to bludgeon the populace into adherence to the approved thought processes - then everything will turn out right eventually. You may have to violate civil rights in the process, but in the end there will be more rights than if you hadn't.

In someways the approach looks almost like the symbolism is more important than the function but it is a bit deeper than that.

So a 12 year old is not competent to go and get a tan. But they are perfectly competent to choose to get an injected vaccination which could, indeed lead to severe complications. Fundamentally bizarre to say that they are competent in the one situation but not in the other - but in the fascist mind the one is a desired action and therefore they are competent to consent and the other action is not desired so they are incompetent to consent.

It's asinine, but it's how Sacramento works.

[The Shadow]

The dreamers keep dreaming.

Everyone keeps saying Chess, not Checkers. Have you ever sacrificed a pawn to divert the attention of your opponent, while you move your more important pieces for the win ?

These insignificant victories are like that.

[ivsamhell]

As long as it's insignificant crap, who cares.

it becomes a stalemate, we are busy fighting new legislation instead of advancing.

[ivsamhell]

Everyone keeps saying Chess, not Checkers. Have you ever sacrificed a pawn to divert the attention of your opponent, while you move your more important pieces for the win ?

These insignificant victories are like that.

It isn't a board game, there are no finite number of pawns.

[Bhobbs]

Everyone keeps saying Chess, not Checkers. Have you ever sacrificed a pawn to divert the attention of your opponent, while you move your more important pieces for the win ?

These insignificant victories are like that.

The difference is we have to make a million moves to take out one of their pawns while in the mean time they keep flooding the board with new pawns.

We are not on equal footing with the antis. They can pile as many bills as possible in our way while it takes us years to kill just one.

[The Shadow]

Because insignificant crap still has consequences. The UOC ban still strips people of one of their means of carry. It still takes time, money and effort to fight it. Stopping these bills before they become law is much more effective than spending time and money on "insignificant crap" that can be spent fighting the AW ban or the handgun roster.

Ah, but here's the beauty of that, when we win, we get that money back. This is a revolution of sorts, and we are fighting a battle of attrition. To date, we have made significant progress in ways that people didn't imagine a decade ago. And these little skirmishes are just part of the war.

No one ever won all of the battles, but we have to stay focused on winning the war.

Because of the complacency of our grandparents, parents, and us, we allowed this to devolve into what we have to fight now. We are in a cultural battle to win back our independence. We can't complicate this by fighting amongst ourselves.

[BAGunner]

Now they're going to have to come up with an alternative to that which, in their mind satisfies, the right to bear arms. So what could that possibly be ?

It would well be LUCC (locked unloaded concealed carry)

[OleCuss]

The difference is we have to make a million moves to take out one of their pawns while in the mean time they keep flooding the board with new pawns.

We are not on equal footing with the antis. They can pile as many bills as possible in our way while it takes us years to kill just one.

That has been mostly true but may not be true in the future.

What is going to start happening is that as we get a few more precedents under our belts we'll be able to start going to the relevant court and quickly and easily get injunctions to stop much of the stupidity.

We'll never stop all of the stupidity but it will get better. We'll even make some gains which will be recognized as such by just about everyone. But the fight will never really end - because stupid never ends.

But we have to get the precedents. That's why cases like Richards, Peruta, Nordyke, etc. are important.

Edit: Ab427 is actually an example of how the stupid will slow down. We have a relevant winning case which still has not finished all its appeals, but it was enough to get JB to kill AB427 - and it is likely not going to come back.

[radioburning]

The UOC ban still strips people of one of their means of carry. It still takes time, money and effort to fight it.

Who says anyone's gonna fight for UOC? I could give a rat's aasz about UOC if throwing it under the bus gives us a "CCW checkmate."

[Bhobbs]

Ah, but here's the beauty of that, when we win, we get that money back. This is a revolution of sorts, and we are fighting a battle of attrition. To date, we have made significant progress in ways that people didn't imagine a decade ago. And these little skirmishes are just part of the war.

No one ever won all of the battles, but we have to stay focused on winning the war.

Because of the complacency of our grandparents, parents, and us, we allowed this to devolve into what we have to fight now. We are in a cultural battle to win back our independence. We can't complicate this by fighting amongst ourselves.

We beat AB962 but they just reproposed it. It got vetoed this time. We have an uphill battle until the SCOTUS grants us a ruling that is actually strong enough to stop it. Even then we will have to fight these "insignificant" laws. The fact is we are the under dog with less power than the gov. The gov is owned by the antis. The more we win the better but we cannot compete against the machine.

I am not saying we give up but we cannot minimalize these laws. Getting over confident will set us back. Everyone was confident the latest Nordyke ruling was going to be big for us but we were sorely disappointed.

[Bhobbs]

Who says anyone's gonna fight for UOC? I could give a rat's aasz about UOC if throwing it under the bus gives us a "CCW checkmate."

What if it doesn't? You act like it has already happened but I expect you to be shocked when we lose again. The only court that will rule in our favor on LTC is the SCOTUS.

[The Shadow]

Even I am not quite that happy with recent events!

But over the years JB has done even more than you've noted above.

So far as his recent signings of anti-RKBA bills? I view that more as someone who worries more about how his troops look than how they fight. The intent is to do such and so - the fact that the effect may be the opposite is irrelevant to the intent.

But then, again, the fascist concept is that if your thoughts are pure and you are attempting to use government to bludgeon the populace into adherence to the approved thought processes - then everything will turn out right eventually. You may have to violate civil rights in the process, but in the end there will be more rights than if you hadn't.

In someways the approach looks almost like the symbolism is more important than the function but it is a bit deeper than that.

So a 12 year old is not competent to go and get a tan. But they are perfectly competent to choose to get an injected vaccination which could, indeed lead to severe complications. Fundamentally bizarre to say that they are competent in the one situation but not in the other - but in the fascist mind the one is a desired action and therefore they are competent to consent and the other action is not desired so they are incompetent to consent.

It's asinine, but it's how Sacramento works.

I don't consider Brown our Savior by any stretch of the imagination. But I also don't believe that Brown will be our undoing. Our fight in California is not the only battle for Independence, but it is our fight and becoming disillusioned only serves the anti's.

I'm not saying that I'm not concerned, but I do have faith in those who are fighting the battles in the courts. All you and I have to do is provide the logistics, and let them fire the well placed shots.

[CalBear]

Okay, just some thoughts on Jerry Brown.

I'd like to reassess some of his actions.

1. Signed Amicus in favor of 2A. Check.

This is true. BUT, remember the content is more important than the fact that he wrote the amicus. In the amicus, he said California essentially leads the nation in common sense gun laws, such as the safe handgun registry.

2. Signed AB610 to standardize 12050 PC. Check.

3. Vetoed bill to register ammo. Check.

Jerry is not anti gun. I keep telling people that. He does have some understanding of the Second Amendment. It's no surprise to me that he vetoed these two. #2 was probably a no-brainer to him. It's just fair. #3 he vetoed because it's still in litigation. He's shown a reluctance to interfere with the courts too much.

As others have already said, long gun registration doesn't go into effect until 2014, that gives our side time to get it ruled unconstitutional. AB144 made carrying an unloaded handgun illegal, an issue that stood in the way of a ruling in our favor in Peruta. Now they're going to have to come up with an alternative to that which, in their mind satisfies, the right to bear arms. So what could that possibly be ?

Sorry, but I'm not seeing the bad side to this yet.

The suggestion that the bills he signed have their upsides or "outs" is true. I agree with you. What I cannot get on board with however, is the HUGE leap that JB signed these bills to secretly help us. I totally disagree with that assertion. That we have potential outs for these speaks more to our progress in the courts than JB's position on gun laws.

I said above that JB isn't anti gun. I still believe that. Anti gun politicians veto bills like SB 610 and sign bills like the ammo bill just to stick it to gun owners, regardless of fairness or litigation. Several urban democrats did just that in the legislature this session. JB owns guns and gets that we have certain rights. Where most Cal Gunners and JB split is on gun control laws. JB believes the state has much more authority to enact gun control laws, and he believes they have far more positive effect than we do. He's a believer in the "common sense" gun laws mentioned in his amicus. We believe those laws are typically ineffective, if not unconstitutional.

[ivsamhell]

Who says anyone's gonna fight for UOC? I could give a rat's aasz about UOC if throwing it under the bus gives us a "CCW checkmate."

UOC was never a viable option, wasn't this angle already argued and struck down in the last nordyke?

[taperxz]

As an independent thinker i can tell you this

JB may not give us everything we want, what politician can? Some of you who claim to know the stripes of "moonbeam" call him an enemy of the 2A. You really need to stop listening to Mommys and Daddys of the colorful psychadelic 70's.

He IS the governor of CA! What do you expect? unzip his suit and watch Ron Paul jump out and say here i am i tricked you all?

This dynamic state has many issues, more than most countries. For instance if Sarah Palin (who i want to go hunting with) were running this state we would have all the gun rights in the world! Problem is, we would be eating our dead, and working for minimum wage. No one could shoot their guns because no one could afford ammo! Most of our land would be raped for profit and i guarantee SoCal would have NO freaking water flowing from the Great State Of Northern California!

its a five letter word. T-H-I-N-K