Miller v. Bonta 9th Ckt "assault weapons": Held for Duncan result 1-26-24

[Haplo]

Maybe and Maybe Not.

Judge Benitez will issue a second decision upon the remand.

If neither party elects to appeal that decision, then it will become final.

But the losing party does have the right of appeal back to the Ninth Circuit. There is certainly the potential for another trip through the appeal circuit before we get to a final ruling.

I'm quite confident that Judge Benitez will craft an excellent decision, just as he did the first time (and noting that he clearly authored that decision for the Supreme Court rather than the parties). I'm equally confident that Mr. Bonta will exercise his right of appeal. The "Jury is Out" (pun intended) with the Ninth Circuit. There are a lot of "Constitutionalists" on that court (more so than in times past). There are "Activist" judges who understand the rule of law, specifically the direction of a higher court, and there are "Activist" judges who are not particularly respectful of such direction. We'll have to see how it plays out.

IIAL and I believe you are right, the loser this time around will have an opportunity to appeal the decision. I wonder if the new decision, which is most certainly to overturn the AWB, will give a few days before the Notice of Appeal can be filed and any Order given. We only really need 1 day in which we are permitted to put our firearms back in standard configuration, similar to "freedom week", which was an entire week and gave us time to purchase millions of legal standard magazines.

The 9th Cir. may simply affirm the ruling, as reversal and submitting to the SCOTUS will risk overturning all AWB laws nationwide. At least affirming will contain the "damage" to 9th Cir. states only, which is still a lot of states.

Things are getting spicy! If the AWB goes down then most certainly the handgun roster cannot last much longer.

[BlueOvalBandit]

you might what to tell that to 127,000 us citizens that were imprisoned against their will. No charges, no due process, just labeled a risk to national security.

//Off topic rant

But it's cool, cause the Government apologized and gave those that were still alive $20k for their hardship and loss of property. I know my family was insulted by the "apology". They lost an 80 acre farm in Santa Ana, $20k was not even cents on the dollar to monetary loss.

//Sarcasm
Maybe newscum will return that land and lease it back from us like a certain beach.

Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk

[kcstott]

//Off topic rant

But it's cool, cause the Government apologized and gave those that were still alive $20k for their hardship and loss of property. I know my family was insulted by the "apology". They lost an 80 acre farm in Santa Ana, $20k was not even cents on the dollar to monetary loss.

//Sarcasm
Maybe newscum will return that land and lease it back from us like a certain beach.

Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk

I'm sorry for what happened to yours and many other families.
My point was that all these rights are mere privileges and the government can revoke them at will. These guys try to cite federal code on civil rights violations. all I can say is Good luck. this country has a very bad habit of doing what ever it chooses under the pretext of the greater good.

[TruOil]

Gents,



As for 42 USC 1983, you have to defeat "Qualified Immunity." Under Saucier v Katz, this would require you to show that the official's actions violated a "Clearly Established" right. That's gonna be pretty much impossible when they act in accordance with facially valid statutes.

You gotta be careful not to declare victory in the third quarter of the game.

Although local officials may be sued under section 1983, state officials are immune under the 11th Amendment. One of the long running "conflicts" between the state and federal courts in this state is that state courts have held that sheriffs are state elected officials, while federal courts have concluded that they are local officials since their funding comes from the counties not the states.

[cyphr02]

He also doesn't have any skin in the game, stealing from taxpayers to fund their case.

[RickD427]

Although local officials may be sued under section 1983, state officials are immune under the 11th Amendment. One of the long running "conflicts" between the state and federal courts in this state is that state courts have held that sheriffs are state elected officials, while federal courts have concluded that they are local officials since their funding comes from the counties not the states.

You're right. During the time that I was doing risk management stuff for LASD, my counterpart with the CHP often delighted in pointing this out.

[ar15barrels]

Although local officials may be sued under section 1983, state officials are immune under the 11th Amendment. One of the long running "conflicts" between the state and federal courts in this state is that state courts have held that sheriffs are state elected officials, while federal courts have concluded that they are local officials since their funding comes from the counties not the states.

It would seem that a Sheriff is locally elected since only the population of a specific county is polled to elect that county's sheriff.

I would only consider positions that all the citizens of the state vote on like Governor, Lieutenant Governor, Secretary of State, Controller, Treasurer and Attorney General to be state elected positions.

So the lesson learned here is that you sue the sheriff in federal court, not in ca state courts.

[JiuJitsu]

If Benitez rules a 2nd time in our favor as expected how likely do you guys think CA/Bonta will appeal up to the 9th? Or even SCOTUS?

I mean, they understand that if CA loses higher up then a pro-2A ruling potentially affects all the states in the 9th Circus or even the entire country at SCOTUS. Is that worth the risk for the anti-gun weenies?

[RickD427]

If Benitez rules a 2nd time in our favor as expected how likely do you guys think CA/Bonta will appeal up to the 9th? Or even SCOTUS?

I mean, they understand that if CA loses higher up then a pro-2A ruling potentially affects all the states in the 9th Circus or even the entire country at SCOTUS. Is that worth the risk for the anti-gun weenies?

I would expect an appeal. Mr. Bonta simply has too much political capital invested in the issue to simply accept an adverse trial court decision, even if his best judgement is to do so.

You make a good point that an adverse Ninth Circuit decision would have implications for the other states in the Ninth, but realistically, it's only Washington, Oregon and Hawaii that would suffer and I don't think they collectively have enough influence to sway Mr. Bonta, and I would be surprised to see Hawaii even make an attempt. They have the same political concerns as does Mr. Bonta.

[jwkincal]

If Benitez rules a 2nd time in our favor as expected how likely do you guys think CA/Bonta will appeal up to the 9th? Or even SCOTUS?

I mean, they understand that if CA loses higher up then a pro-2A ruling potentially affects all the states in the 9th Circus or even the entire country at SCOTUS. Is that worth the risk for the anti-gun weenies?

Chance of Benitez ruling in our favor: 100%
Chance of Bonta appealing: 100%
Chance of 9th Circuit taking appeal: ~65%
Chance of 9th Circuit overturning Benitez upon taking appeal: ~50%

Place your bets. The real question is: Will Benitez issue an instant stay on the enjoinder, or will he decide to make Bonta jump through the hoop of requesting it while the DOJ enforcement regime runs around like chickens with their heads cut off.

[RickD427]

Chance of Benitez ruling in our favor: 100%
Chance of Bonta appealing: 100%
Chance of 9th Circuit taking appeal: ~65%
Chance of 9th Circuit overturning Benitez upon taking appeal: ~50%

Place your bets. The real question is: Will Benitez issue an instant stay on the enjoinder, or will he decide to make Bonta jump through the hoop of requesting it while the DOJ enforcement regime runs around like chickens with their heads cut off.

The chance of the Ninth Circuit taking the appeal is 100%.

Parties have the right of appeal the the Ninth Circuit.

[jwkincal]

The chance of the Ninth Circuit taking the appeal is 100%.

Parties have the right of appeal the the Ninth Circuit.

Right, I should have said Chance of Sua Sponte En Banc Review of a favorable Ruling on Appeal; but I suppose Bonta would ask for it anyway.

[taperxz]

Chance of Benitez ruling in our favor: 100%
Chance of Bonta appealing: 100%
Chance of 9th Circuit taking appeal: ~65%
Chance of 9th Circuit overturning Benitez upon taking appeal: ~50%

Place your bets. The real question is: Will Benitez issue an instant stay on the enjoinder, or will he decide to make Bonta jump through the hoop of requesting it while the DOJ enforcement regime runs around like chickens with their heads cut off.

He will issue a PI because he knows he is doing exactly as the SCOTUS has directed him to do in a 2A case like this via NY/Bruen

[jwkincal]

He will issue a PI because he knows he is doing exactly as the SCOTUS has directed him to do in a 2A case like this via NY/Bruen

Did/can Miller ask for a PI?

I expect a Summary Injunction for sure; but he did that the first time and then immediately issued a stay against it for the appeal he knew was coming; this presumably because the AW laws are a lot more complex and nuanced than the LCM laws and the "Freedom Week" scenario would have gotten squirrely. But this time he might just let it play as a way of underscoring his vindication by SCOTUS in advance of the 9th Circuit attempting to circumvent it.

[taperxz]

Did/can Miller ask for a PI?

I expect a Summary Injunction for sure; but he did that the first time and then immediately issued a stay against it for the appeal he knew was coming; this presumably because the AW laws are a lot more complex and nuanced than the LCM laws and the "Freedom Week" scenario would have gotten squirrely. But this time he might just let it play as a way of underscoring his vindication by SCOTUS in advance of the 9th Circuit attempting to circumvent it.

Sure he can. It can also get stayed in Appeals. It still gives an hour and basically exonerates every CA AW in California and allow people to convert all there stuff back to free America style including Roberti Roos guns.

It would basically destroy the CA AW registry.