Prop 63 and the reloading community

[Desertdoc]

Playing devils advocate here. I get the sense that only about 5% of gunowners reload.

The goal of these laws is to make it as hard as possible to be a gun owner in CA as to make gun owners smaller and smaller minorities. I suspect they probably won't care about reloading because it isn't that impactful as a percentage of the population.

I agree with 95% of your post.

But, as an FYI...

Search for ATF and wetted Nitro-Cellulose.

[opos]

PM to who? Where will I find this thread? How will those people who want to get involved find this thread you speak of? What does it look like? What words does it start with? How will those who want to know find it? What if any help do you offer? Or do you just claim to know, while trolling along with your virtual dick, get it?

Well stud its like this. You know not a single thing about me. Because I may ask about things that are not obvious what-so-ever on this forum that I have not looked.

Are you here to point out how the lesser informed are stupid? Or are you here to help those that want to know?

You are showing your ***.

Get with the program. Shoot me a PM with good intel. Or do not.

PM inbound.

And another fvcking thing, please include a Mod AND an Admin. in your oh so eloquent reply to me. If you do not, I will just forward it on to them.

Ok so I answered your p/m...then read this...I did a simple search and within about a minute had these posts and threads (several of many) concerning your topic and also the issue of baiting Sacramento...You want to run to the mods that's fine with me..here's the link..also the second link here is a thread where you asked the same question and tried to get the same discussion going about 2 or 3 weeks ago...

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1246882&highlight=reloading+components

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1264360&highlight=reloading+components

[Desertdoc]

OPOS, PM replied to. I think we are good. If not, advise otherwise. PM or open as you see fit. I enjoy friendly informed debate, even if I am wrong. In fact, I will post openly that I am wrong, if that is the case.

Further, I do not recall each post I make, if I miss something, PLEASE remind me I have posted about the issue before.

V/R

Desertdoc

[Vicious_138]

FFL03 + COE holders are exempt from Prop 63 regulations regarding purchasing, transporting or importing ammo. Something to consider, plus then you can joyfully spend way too much money buying up C&Rs too.

Is this true?
I couldn't find it in the bill text. Also, an exemptions for CCW holders?
I have my C&R FFL, I need to get my COE.

[Desertdoc]

^^^^I have read here that the above is the case, however it may be time limited. I have not heard CCW holders have an exemption to the AMMO, provision. Just C&R/COE.

Have you heard otherwise?

Regards,

DD

[stilly]

Playing devils advocate here. I get the sense that only about 5% of gunowners reload.

The goal of these laws is to make it as hard as possible to be a gun owner in CA as to make gun owners smaller and smaller minorities. I suspect they probably won't care about reloading because it isn't that impactful as a percentage of the population.

You are seeing it backwards. I will not say more here.

[Vicious_138]

I think I found the sections for C&R + COE and CCW. I will have to cross reference the numbers on CCW, just don't have time right now.
There are other exemptions, I just took these 2 out for this post

(e) This section shall not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of ammunition to any of the following, if properly identified prior to the delivery of the ammunition by the vendor:
(8) A person who is licensed as a collector of firearms pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto, whose licensed premises are within this state, and who has a current certificate of eligibility issued by the department pursuant to Section 26710.
(19) A person who is authorized to carry loaded firearms pursuant to Section 25900, 25905, 25910, 25925, 26010, 26015, 26025, or 26030.

EDIT:
I looked up PC Sections 25900, 25905, 25910, 25925, 26010, 26015, 26025, or 26030, and they all refer to LEO, armed guards, military, and private investigators. So it appears there is no exemptions for CCW holder.
But there is an exemption for C&R + COE. The issue will be if any of the online vendors will actually ship ammo to CA even with C&R + COE. I am guessing they will not, since our CA laws are so damn convoluted.

[opos]

OPOS, PM replied to. I think we are good. If not, advise otherwise. PM or open as you see fit. I enjoy friendly informed debate, even if I am wrong. In fact, I will post openly that I am wrong, if that is the case.

Further, I do not recall each post I make, if I miss something, PLEASE remind me I have posted about the issue before.

V/R

Desertdoc

It's all cool..thanks for the p/m

[Capybara]

The issue will be if any of the online vendors will actually ship ammo to CA even with C&R + COE. I am guessing they will not, since our CA laws are so damn convoluted.

That may be true, but let's not assume. As soon as things settle down, I will be speaking with the owners of several ammo vendors I buy from. I am confident that at least some of them will still ship and sell to Californians with the correct paperwork as stated by the law. Giving up California sales could be a significant hit for some of them. Also, if you look in the fine print, many ammo vendors already deal with selling ammo to Illinois residents and verification of the FOID cards, an FFL03 + COE isn't that big of a deal for them to implement.

I have hope that at least some will. If not, I'll drive to Vegas and Havasu and buy a few thousand dollars worth per trip or out to Prescott to J&G. PITA, but not the end of the world. And of course, if you stock up with enough components to reload a few hundred thousand rounds, you may not need to buy ammo for quite a few years. I am mainly interested in cheap Shotgun ammo and .22, the rest I can make.

[mikeshan]

Any reloading workshops near San Luis Obispo, CA?

[cvigue]

Start stocking up now, a bit at a time.

I've been going about $1k a month in components, is that little enough?

[Sousuke]

That may be true, but let's not assume. As soon as things settle down, I will be speaking with the owners of several ammo vendors I buy from. I am confident that at least some of them will still ship and sell to Californians with the correct paperwork as stated by the law. Giving up California sales could be a significant hit for some of them. Also, if you look in the fine print, many ammo vendors already deal with selling ammo to Illinois residents and verification of the FOID cards, an FFL03 + COE isn't that big of a deal for them to implement.

I have hope that at least some will. If not, I'll drive to Vegas and Havasu and buy a few thousand dollars worth per trip or out to Prescott to J&G. PITA, but not the end of the world. And of course, if you stock up with enough components to reload a few hundred thousand rounds, you may not need to buy ammo for quite a few years. I am mainly interested in cheap Shotgun ammo and .22, the rest I can make.

Here are the companies I've reached out to:

AimSurplus - They said they will be drafting a policy which they will post on their website.

Sgammo - No reply

Rareammo - Lawyers are looking into it

MidwayUSA - I got a confusing reply...I would say they will not in the future.


I bet Ventura does given they are IN CA.

[3006mv]

And why are you only stockpiling now? should have started years ago.

[JagerDog]

I'm pretty sure they're aware of "ghost ammo".

It prolly doesn't matter to Newscums and such, but I doubt many gangbangers reload.

Maybe we shouldn't have a reloading forum. Then the gangbangers can't get ideas to put this higher on the radar. Maybe a secret handshake should be required to buy reloading books?

[BigBronco]

Even the thought of a hidden forum would not work. How would you get the word out in a way the tyrants would not be able to find it and join?