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[UN3178]

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[-hanko]

I was on my way to the range and I broke down on the side of the freeway. Before I could come to a complete stop a there was already a CHP patrol car behind me. I drive a F-250 so all my firearms were in the back seat in plain view.

All in all, everything went better than expected.

Cool starry bra.

Help me understand why the encounter should not have gone just as it went.

Maybe I'm a bit ignorant here in Idaho, but is the presence of weapons visible on the back seat PC for anything.

Did the Chippie call a tow for you??

[mabilis_matulis]

Cool!

[CAL.BAR]

Cool starry bra.

Help me understand why the encounter should not have gone just as it went.

Maybe I'm a bit ignorant here in Idaho, but is the presence of weapons visible on the back seat PC for anything.

Did the Chippie call a tow for you??

Why? B/C in CA - guns are SCARY. In a great many encounters, the mere mention of a firearm in the area calls for felony stop tactics. Cops will usually thereafter demand to inspect the firearm - upon seeing a usually very scary AR type "assault weapon" they often confiscate the weapon and arrest the person owning it. Only later to learn that they had no idea what they were doing and had no right to arrest the poor guy in the first place.

That's why. He got lucky and got one of the few CHP/cops in CA who aren't petrified of guns.

[ElvenSoul]

Congrats!

Do hope you can get your truck fixed!

[SoCalEnthusiast]

Why would you be scared? Were they loaded and ready to rock?

[IVC]

Maybe I'm a bit ignorant here in Idaho, but is the presence of weapons visible on the back seat PC for anything.

CA has a law that gives LEO-s right to inspect firearms to ensure they are unloaded. It's called "e-check" after the section of the law it came from (due to renumbering it's something else now, but we still call it an e-check.) That was the standard procedure when facing UOC-ers - check their firearms to ensure they are unloaded. It also applies to the cars and any other transportation of firearms.

To trigger an e-check the LEO has to *know* that there is a firearm in the car. If it's in the trunk and not visible the LEO has to trick you into saying that you have a firearm in the car, at which point you cannot refuse an e-check. However, if you don't answer the question or don't confirm that the firearm is there they cannot do anything.

When the firearms are visible, they can do the e-check without your consent because they *know* the firearm is there - they can see it. If it's just a gun container, I believe we have a case law that says LEO-s cannot assume there is a gun inside, but I'm not sure on that particular point.

[IVC]

I drive a F-250 so all my firearms were in the back seat in plain view.

A blanket will fix the "plain view" problem. You might want to minimize your chances of problems in the future.

[RickD427]

CA has a law that gives LEO-s right to inspect firearms to ensure they are unloaded. It's called "e-check" after the section of the law it came from (due to renumbering it's something else now, but we still call it an e-check.) That was the standard procedure when facing UOC-ers - check their firearms to ensure they are unloaded. It also applies to the cars and any other transportation of firearms.

To trigger an e-check the LEO has to *know* that there is a firearm in the car. If it's in the trunk and not visible the LEO has to trick you into saying that you have a firearm in the car, at which point you cannot refuse an e-check. However, if you don't answer the question or don't confirm that the firearm is there they cannot do anything.

When the firearms are visible, they can do the e-check without your consent because they *know* the firearm is there - they can see it. If it's just a gun container, I believe we have a case law that says LEO-s cannot assume there is a gun inside, but I'm not sure on that particular point.

IVC,

The authority for the "e-check" is provided by Penal Code section 25850(b). It was formerly provided by section 12031(e), hence the term "e-check."

The authority only applies inside incorporated cities, and in unincorporated areas where shooting is prohibited. There is no authority for an "e-check" in county area where shooting is permitted. Please note that shooting from a roadway is prohibited in all locations. That makes the "e-check" available to LEOs if you're on a roadway in an otherwise permitted area.

Even though firearm possession is not, by itself, illegal, courts have applied the same search and seizure law that applies to evidence and contraband, to the search for firearms in order to conduct an "e-check." That means the officer does not have to know there are firearms in the vehicle to conduct a lawful search, they only need probable cause to believe there are firearms in the vehicle. That probable cause can be provided from a number of sources. It does not need to come from driver statements.

There have been split cases over whether a gun case provides sufficient probable cause for a search. Some courts have upheld the search based on the "Single Purpose Container" rule (If it's gun case it probably contains a gun). Other courts have ruled that gun cases hold many things other than guns.

[junior40er]

Dri ing a ford truck myself I'm interested in knowing what went wrong.

[dskit]

I got pulled over by CHP while heading up to Cedarville a few years ago. I made a mistake by leaving a box of 22LR on my passenger seat - e-check ensued. Luckily, I had no AR's with me because...

A very good friend of mine had a county sheriff check his BB AR he was legally transporting, went nuts and confiscated EVERYTHING and threatened him with a FEL-O-NY. Thousands of $$$ in legal fees and months of stress finally got everything dropped and firearms returned.

[REH]

I got pulled over by CHP while heading up to Cedarville a few years ago. I made a mistake by leaving a box of 22LR on my passenger seat - e-check ensued. Luckily, I had no AR's with me because...

A very good friend of mine had a county sheriff check his BB AR he was legally transporting, went nuts and confiscated EVERYTHING and threatened him with a FEL-O-NY. Thousands of $$$ in legal fees and months of stress finally got everything dropped and firearms returned.

Mmmmmmmmmm sounds like a squirrel hunt to me

[VictorFranko]

Dri ing a ford truck myself I'm interested in knowing what went wrong.

It's a Ford (j/k)

____________________________________


OP, driving to the range 2-3 times a month, I didn't like carrying all my gear in the backseat of my truck because A) your CHP situation or a traffic violation and B) I wasn't able to stop anywhere where I could not keep my truck in sight.

I saved my pennies a bought a Retrax Pro rolling tonneau cover.
I leave the tonneau closed and locked and access the bed through the lockable tailgate. The tailgate acts as a nice table.
A cargo bar keeps all my gear at the rear of the bed, near the tailgate.
If stopped or broken down as in your situation, there is no need for anyone to know anything about what you are carrying. Run into the store for a few minutes? Everything is secure and out of sight.

[johnthomas]

Nobody like a LEO encounter anyway. The added stress of guns in the truck makes them nervous. The e-check can go wrong and come up as stolen or not in the system simply because of a misplaced number weather by the LEO or dispatcher. The Officer's mind set that day or attitude towards private gun ownership. From his point of view, does the driver look like a gang member? A druggie type? A regular guy? God help you if you have weak muscles in one of your eyes and that eye is looking somewhere else when it should be looking at the LEO, lol.
OP, glad everything turned out ok. You must have your car running again, you posting in the forum.

[MisplacedTexan]

There have been split cases over whether a gun case provides sufficient probable cause for a search. Some courts have upheld the search based on the "Single Purpose Container" rule (If it's gun case it probably contains a gun). Other courts have ruled that gun cases hold many things other than guns.

When I bought my first handgun, I didn't go out and get a gun case/ range bag. My son was just out of diapers at the time so I just started using the diaper bag. Plenty of storage, tons of pockets - fold out pad for field stripping - sturdy - and it doesn't look like a "gun" bag.

If anyone can see it, it just looks like what it is - a diaper bag (except for the lock on the zippers & 'D' ring).

Reading the post & the cop's ability on a stop to check makes feel a little less weird on toting my stuff around the way I do.