do I shoot to kill?

[Mata]

Let say after the burglar got shot and he was wounded, would he yell out I am wounded? Probably not. And what are you going to do next?

This is all very silly conjecture. Not enough information exists to make a decision based on the post. Is the threat still actively occurring?

Even if he says something, does not mean the threat is gone.

Hell, you could shoot him and he turns into a dancing leprechaun that offers to give you a pot of gold. And what are you going to do next?

[dieselpower]

Don't know if this has been said or not but,....

1) If you shoot to wound and end up killing the person you are guilty of manslaughter.

2) If you shoot a person when you are NOT in fear for your life, you are guilty of attempted murder or murder if they die. The fact that you think wounding a person is at the same level of threat as they pose against you... that is now used against you in court. The use of DEADLY force was NOT justified.

3) Shooting a person IS deadly force whether or not you kill them. If you shoot before that level of force is justified.... read #2 again...???

EDIT... Post # 38 sums this up nicely.

[tbc]

This is all very silly conjecture. Not enough information exists to make a decision based on the post. Is the threat still actively occurring?

Even if he says something, does not mean the threat is gone.

Hell, you could shoot him and he turns into a dancing leprechaun that offers to give you a pot of gold. And what are you going to do next?

Hmm. Maybe not enough information. Let me try again. If I shoot a burglar, I cannot control the situation in which whether I am going to wound or kill him. However, I can only sense that he is no longer a threat. Therefore, I shoot not to wound nor to kill but only to make an an attempt stopping the threat.

EDIT: LOL. I am trying too hard here. I should stay out of this thread.

Sent from IPhone

[DTatum]

If that's a concern, add some first-aid classes to your range training... once you're confident that the threat has been stopped, you can choose to render aid until PD and medics can arrive and take over. Simply knowing the steps to help prevent shock can mean the difference between the suspect going to prison, or the morgue. Police officers will often take the same approach: stopping the threat with deadly force, only to switch immediately into life-saving mode once the threat is stopped.

+1

I'm shooting to stop a threat. Ideally, I don't have any desire to kill anyone. But my ideals are second seat to protecting myself, family and loved ones. I'll say a prayer for both of us when the threat is stopped... If there's still a pulse, and its safe to do so, I'll do whatever is safe to see that no life is lost.

[bruceflinch]

I go to the range every other weekend. i have been shooting guns since middle school, i shoot AR-15, 1911, 12gauge, .270, .308, and now my 9mm. i was just wondering, because if someone were to get killed in my house I dont think i could still live in it.

Would that include your family because you shot to wound & the bad guy survived to still kill?

[voiceofreason]

+1 on failure drill

aka the "credit card"

Failure drill:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozambique_Drill

The target area of the head from the facial side described earlier in the thread is about the size of a credit card and is known in some shooting circles as the "credit card".

[Mata]

Hmm. Maybe not enough information. Let me try again. If I shoot a burglar, I cannot control the situation in which whether I am going to wound or kill him. However, I can only sense that he is no longer a threat. Therefore, I shoot not to wound nor to kill but only to make an an attempt stopping the threat.

EDIT: LOL. I am trying too hard here. I should stay out of this thread.

Sent from IPhone

Heh, I get what you're saying, but you can control shot placement. You can shoot the most efficiently possible.

[Sleighter]

I go to the range every other weekend. i have been shooting guns since middle school, i shoot AR-15, 1911, 12gauge, .270, .308, and now my 9mm. i was just wondering, because if someone were to get killed in my house I dont think i could still live in it.

I think too many of you are misinterpreting the OP and his last phrase. I'm not sure I could live in my place if someone were killed there either. It isn't even a factor in my decision making process though, just an unfortunate outcome. I'm sure that moving would be the least of my worries at that point.

[Oneaudiopro]

Don't listen to this. We do not shoot to wound or maim, we do not shoot to kill. we shoot until we feel the threat to our lives is stopped.

What is easier to explain to a court?
"I was shooting to wound this person"
"I was shooting to kill this person"
or
"I was shooting until the threat to my life or the lives of my family was stopped."

Absolutely don't listen to this unintelligible piece of info. You stop the threat by shooting to kill. You only shoot to wound if you're willing to lose your house, cars, bank accounts, savings, etc..

[negolien]

LOL

The standard of "shooting to stop the threat" is usually defined as "shoot center of mass, and keep shooting center of mass until the bad guy is no longer a threat to your life, or the lives of your family."

Posting that you should "put him/her down" will come back to haunt you if you ever have to shoot in self defense.

A vigilant DA will go through every post you have ever made on any gun related website, and try to paint a picture of "He was looking to put down anyone who broke into his house, see this post, he says so right there. He was intending to kill someone and was just waiting for the opportunity!"

By always referring to "shooting to stop the threat" you are simply making it clear that your intent is not to kill someone, your intent is simply to defend yourself. If the person you are defending yourself from dies from wounds sustained while you were trying to "stop the threat", then that is simply a secondary effect, not the primary purpose.

If you shoot your first round, miss the bad guy, and the bad guy yells "Don't shoot I give up!" and throws his hands in the air, you have successfully "shot to stop the threat", and the bad guy should be held at gunpoint until the police arrive. He shouldn't be shot through the chest because you were "shooting to kill".

If you shoot your first round, miss the bad guy, and the bad guy turns tail and runs away, you have successfully "shot to stop the threat", and you should remain at the ready until the police arrive. You should not chase the bad guy and shoot him in the back because you were "shooting to kill".

Yeah because they have you alter ego screen names and are gonna run your IP to see what websites you were on too

[g_conway]

You never shoot to kill. You only shoot to defend life.
Killing is a function of skill, luck, ammunition and time.
When you fire a weapon in self defense, death is always a possible result.
If you claim it as a goal, you could create far more problems than its worth.

I will never shoot to kill, or wound, or scare. I WILL shoot to defend myself and family, and I will shoot as often as needed until I feel the threat has been neutralised.

[adrenaline]

I was taught at a class two rounds to the thoracic cavity (upper chest), and if that doesn't "stop the threat," such as the guy goes down and stops coming, Then one to the head, and not the "hollywood headshot," the forehead. That is the hardest bone in the body and has a higher chance of deflection. The shot is a small rectangle that goes from both sides of the face and starts just below the eyebrows and ends around the bottom of the nose. You only shoot for the specified headshot if the first two don't "stop the threat." If he keeps coming it is either because he is 1) on drugs such as pcp, 2)wearing some type of body armor, or 3) a dedicated oponent, which means he will function out of hate or another motive long enough to get to you. In a panic situation it is difficult to controll fire, but gives you a thing to practice for to better your chances.

If shots to the upper chest area do not stop the threat because of potential armor, you would be better off shooting at the pelvic area...larger target area to hit. Breaking the pelvic bone would greatly affect if not halt mobility.

- Two to middle of the sternum (a few inches higher).
- Two or three at the pelvic region.
- End it with a head shot.

Back on topic....I'm shooting to stop the threat from advancing. If they die, that would be an unfortunate end result of defending the lives of my wife and three children.

My primary goal is to protect....not to kill. The side effect most likely would be death of the perpertrator, but that is not a choice I would make. That's between him and his creator.

[Oneaudiopro]

You never shoot to kill. You only shoot to defend life.
Killing is a function of skill, luck, ammunition and time.
When you fire a weapon in self defense, death is always a possible result.
If you claim it as a goal, you could create far more problems than its worth.

I will never shoot to kill, or wound, or scare. I WILL shoot to defend myself and family, and I will shoot as often as needed until I feel the threat has been neutralised.

??????????????..................You make absolutely no sense at all.

[dirty_530]

I will tell you I will not kill a person over inanimate objects. I have been to war and it taught me a lot of things one of them was I will not kill over belongings.

I have a California CCW and Nevada and carry all the time when out of bed. I use my weapon as a tool to dispatch sick and suffering animals as well as protection. If I have an avenue to retreat I will do so. The situation where I am in fear for my family or myself I will shoot until I neutralize the threat.

I would suggest reading the book On Killing by Dave Grossman. The shooting is just the start of the journey and you need to know what to expect and how to deal with it.

Hunting and going to the rifle range does not prepare you for a gun fight. I will continue to train with professional teachers and ask one question of all that are going to take my money and teach me. Have you ever been in a gun fight and how many times? If the answer is no they will only teach rifle range skills to me.

Respectfully,
Bill

^^^ Very well put, thank you for what you said.

[ubet]

I dont know about you guys, but I DONT WANT to shoot anybody....