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  • #16
    c.j.
    Member
    • Oct 2005
    • 116

    Originally posted by IrishPirate
    I wouldn't be surprised if he's expanding to other states.
    That question was asked while I was out there, and they indicated that this WAS the long-term goal, but they had a few plans first...first was completing the ranges as they'd like, then duplicating the entire setup on the opposite side of their property, all while building their dream conference center/hotel/restaurant(s).

    A recent email cited a goal of something like 200,000 students a year, and the math about the potential revenue came out to making $1,000 per student, so trying to get some of that money going into Pahrump is pretty high on the list...from there I expect they see how it works then start looking for land on the east coast. I'll be curious to see prices on-site when Pahrump isn't THAT far away, and they'll need to compete.

    But the membership change doesn't surprise me...I was looking through their history on the Way Back Machine and this isn't the first time they've changed some of the memberships.

    Since we're making predictions in this thread, here's mine...they're boosted membership numbers while shopping for a developer for the hotel/conference hall/restaurants/etc. in order to show them numbers of members who might be expected to visit. Those numbers sound more meaningful to someone who is going to invest money, rather than relying on public attendance numbers (compare selling 'We have 150,000 members!' vs. 'We had 14,000 students last year. This year? Well, we can't really know until they register'). At the moment, they don't have much, if any, debt for the facility as-is, and the next big step is to get the hotel stuff under way.

    As for no longer offering Diamond memberships, I'd expect something new but similar (Diamond, after all, is just about the same as the previous 'Gold' memberships). I'm not too concerned about trying to lock members out of classes (but remember that they're classes only at sites developed when the membership was purchased), but there are other ways to get a little more money (boost the 'background check' charge, for example).

    As for my wishes...hopefully they'll get some better more modern marketing who didn't cut their teeth on 2am tv sales pitches, and get a better web designer who can convince them to get to the point on their pages.

    Comment

    • #17
      zonzin
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2011
      • 860

      Originally posted by IrishPirate
      I wouldn't be surprised if he's expanding to other states. ....

      I sent Frontsight a note specifically asking about their expasion plans and Dr. Piazza replied back that they want to complete the Pahrump location first and then are considering an east coast facility. So it may be a while before you see an expansion.
      Last edited by zonzin; 06-07-2011, 7:23 AM.
      ΜΟΛΩΝ-ΛΑΒΕ - Go Greek. Lifetime member Kappa Kappa Bang (KKB) Fraternity

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      • #18
        PatriotnMore
        Calguns Addict
        • Nov 2007
        • 7068

        I hope they do finish the NV facilities, at minimum, as originally sold to the members and better. Then, develop new properties in other states, while limiting memberships at each facility, to what it can comfortably support, but offering cross facility use upgrades.

        The potential for FS is huge, but so is it's failure if not marketed properly, and promises are not kept.
        ‎"If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the General Welfare, the Government is no longer a limited one, possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one, subject to particular exceptions."
        --James Madison
        'Letter to Edmund Pendleton', 1792

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        • #19
          c.j.
          Member
          • Oct 2005
          • 116

          Just got the 'Final Offer'...basically $200 memberships that let you take 2-day and 4-day defensive handgun courses for life (there goes any value left on many of those certificates on eBay) along with the now standard 'Free' gun bonuses.

          We help U.S. players find legit Chicken Road game casinos with crypto, fast payouts, and provably fair gambling.


          The ever dropping prices makes me a little nervous about the business plan.

          Comment

          • #20
            AngelDecoys
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2008
            • 2393

            Originally posted by c.j.
            http://www.frontsight.com/lastchance.asp

            The ever dropping prices makes me a little nervous about the business plan.
            Keep in mind that before the last $500 push, FS was selling foreclosed Diamonds at $2000 (which was after the $250 push in Jan). I know a few who jumped at a $2000 membership. Even at 2k, that's a bargain. His prices fluctuate plain and simple. He's now at $200 but its only for 2 classes (instead of everything).

            I've been a member since before he had memberships. Bargains are not uncommon though typically in the past they were every 2 years. This latest drive to end lifetime memberships altogether doesn't surprise me. Like 24 hour fitness, or a ski resort, it simply makes more sense to offer limited memberships that expire after so many years (speculating). And perhaps an administration fee to transfer memberships. Anyway, there will be some type of offer in the future; but the terms may be radically different then before.

            BTW - If you're a Diamond, I wouldn't worry about getting into future classes at FS. Were Naish to add something like shooting from a helicopter, taking ANY future class is already part of your membership.
            Last edited by AngelDecoys; 06-10-2011, 9:11 PM. Reason: add
            Manteca Sportsmen General website.
            MS 2012 General Schedule thread look here.
            Women's Classes at the Manteca Sportsmen (2012 Schedule posted)
            Indoor Winter Rimfire Shoot. Information here

            Comment

            • #21
              AngelDecoys
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2008
              • 2393

              Originally posted by JohnP
              I don't think they're going to go out of business just because they're offering low cost memberships. The only thing that doesn't add up is that those two classes are the most crowded.
              Those 2 classes are their bread and butter. I spoke with Wes during my last visit. Consider, they are now renting between 75-100 handguns for every 4 day course at $350 each. Rental guns must use FS bought ammo (which is pricey without a membership). Even if that exaggerated and its just 50 guns every 4 days, that's far more revenue than it costs to run those classes. They pay for themselves many times over.
              Last edited by AngelDecoys; 06-10-2011, 9:11 PM.
              Manteca Sportsmen General website.
              MS 2012 General Schedule thread look here.
              Women's Classes at the Manteca Sportsmen (2012 Schedule posted)
              Indoor Winter Rimfire Shoot. Information here

              Comment

              • #22
                AngelDecoys
                Senior Member
                • Jan 2008
                • 2393

                Originally posted by GW
                Just think how big that Front Sight Monument is going to be to fit all those First Family names to be engraved on it
                LOL. A giant statue of Naish Piazza holding an AR aloft into the air. All made from recycled brass. 125 thousand names etched around the base.

                Personally, I always try and ask what it will look like when attending Brad always says we can ask that question later. Always later hehe.
                Manteca Sportsmen General website.
                MS 2012 General Schedule thread look here.
                Women's Classes at the Manteca Sportsmen (2012 Schedule posted)
                Indoor Winter Rimfire Shoot. Information here

                Comment

                • #23
                  AngelDecoys
                  Senior Member
                  • Jan 2008
                  • 2393

                  Originally posted by JohnP
                  I don't think I'll have a problem finding people who want Diamonds....even with this offer out there.
                  You won't have any problem selling them this summer. At least to anyone who values training. I've got it posted down at my range and a few other spots as well. Given that supply of available Diamond memberships is now limited; as in sold out from FS directly (only spares from current members available), I would imagine someone selling would charge a premium.

                  I would think that the current market value to be somewhere around $2000 (all things considered?). Or lower if someone just wants them gone. If FS never offers lifetime memberships again, at some point people will consider $2000 as cheap.
                  Manteca Sportsmen General website.
                  MS 2012 General Schedule thread look here.
                  Women's Classes at the Manteca Sportsmen (2012 Schedule posted)
                  Indoor Winter Rimfire Shoot. Information here

                  Comment

                  • #24
                    One78Shovel
                    Veteran Member
                    • Jan 2011
                    • 2962

                    This place is going to morph from a zoo to just down right a mad house.

                    Thanks but no thanks.

                    -178S

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