Bipod vs bags

[alpha_romeo_XV]

The issue of using the mag on an AR15 as a point of support, either against an object or holding it with your hand, can absolutely cause a jam when shooting rapid fire. How do I know? Because I've had it happen to me on more than one occasion.

You can read about certain mag brands or just the follower being preferred for reliability. Which point to the mag being critical in reliable feeding.

Ive replied in other threads about "fixed mags" as a option to avoid registering will give you a rifle that is going to have feed problems. I found out why years ago with the Fab10 and Carbon15 first hand.

You can check for yourself that after a mag is inserted into the well it is not totally rigid locked in place but rather has a small amount of wiggle. That is actually a good thing when the bolt is trying to strip a round and chamber it in a tight tolerance chamber. When you fix/hold the by any means you may have put it just out of alignment needed.

You will see a few AR15 match competitors support their rifle with hand under the mag. This is because they're shooting single shot and the round was already chambered. Bolt will only lock back after shot is fired and not try to strip and chamber another round. As in pic below, this is OK for single load operation - allowing shooter to get support of left elbow against his chest.

[smoothy8500]

If rested on the mag, the AR15 is less likely to jam than other platforms, like the M1A/M14. There's a ledge inside the AR15 magwell that coincides with the notch on the magazine front to prevent oversinsertion. Not saying "it can't happen", it is less likely. Perhaps your mag had a peened notch or slot for the mag release.

[desertrider]

I prefer to shoot off a bag, pack, or butt pouch as opposed to a bipod.

I have bipods, but will use a bag instead if it is available.

A bag is more stable in my opinion.

[smoothy8500]

And to answer the question, for me sandbags are better than a bipod. The bipod seems to require more focus on consistent pre-load of the legs to maintain accuracy.

[RiskyBusiness]

Gotta stick with these 30/10s for now since I just got them. 20/10's were hard to find and almost triple the cost. As for the advice I'm just going to send back the bipod and stick with the bag as I felt more comfortable with the stability.

[ElvenSoul]

Op go to Appleseed!

[1 SIG fan]

I've trained with the guys who train metro swat. I trust them. (But more experience then your average calgunner eh)
But to eliminate my FUD crap response I injected words to make it possible. Not saying it's definitive.

Could depend on the mag but the stories have been around for years..

http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/forums/5536-advanced-marksman/14170688-will-accuracy-suffer-from-resting-on-the-magazine-on-a-semi

[Wordupmybrotha]

I've trained with the guys who train metro swat. I trust them. (But more experience then your average calgunner eh)
But to eliminate my FUD crap response I injected words to make it possible. Not saying it's definitive.

Could depend on the mag but the stories have been around for years..

http://www.scout.com/military/sniper...zine-on-a-semi

If my understanding of your link is correct, it IS A MYTH that resting on the mag causes malfunctions?

[1 SIG fan]

Or Magpul marketing. It said they tightened up the mags to eliminate failures from looser style GI mags??

[Wordupmybrotha]

Thats common knowledge in the Army at least. Ive been told that for your almost a decade in the military.

Also OP get some 20rnd mags. All my SPR's are running them, and as a general rule you want your bi-pods as low as possible when firing from the prone.

Found this on YouTube. For what it's worth, this Marine's view is that resting the mag on the ground is a myth. Also, holding the mag wouldn't cause malfunctions, but may affect accuracy due to oscillation of the muzzle.

https://youtu.be/Pf0km--Ag8c

Rob Ski is shooting fine with the mag well grip without a malfunction.

https://youtu.be/If7tCahoKS0

[RiskyBusiness]

If you want to learn to shoot a rifle, get off the bench.

Most ranges have a rimfire section with no benches....this ia where you learn to shoot a rifle, a 22lr, a box of ammo, no bench, slow fire and a "every shot counts
" mentality.

bench, standing, on ground. I want to learn it all but i've only got >300 rounds in so i dont want to reach too high so soon. I understand shooting standing is a whole new world compared to bench and i just want to feel comfortable with one position first.

[EndoDef]

Found this on YouTube. For what it's worth, this Marine's view is that resting the mag on the ground is a myth. Also, holding the mag wouldn't cause malfunctions, but may affect accuracy due to oscillation of the muzzle.

https://youtu.be/Pf0km--Ag8c

Rob Ski is shooting fine with the mag well grip without a malfunction.

https://youtu.be/If7tCahoKS0

Sorry, I haven't served in the Army. Don't know if it's true or not. There's no FUD in the army?

I mean Fudd is everywhere honestly

I really don't have any first hand experiences nor have I see any due to someone holding the mag because it was like taboo to do it.

[CouchOperator]

I mean Fudd is everywhere honestly

I really don't have any first hand experiences nor have I see any due to someone holding the mag because it was like taboo to do it.

You dont have first hand experience putting a rifle on the ground rested on the mag? Like....at all? Ever?

[desertrider]

I mean Fudd is everywhere honestly

I really don't have any first hand experiences nor have I see any due to someone holding the mag because it was like taboo to do it.

You dont have first hand experience putting a rifle on the ground rested on the mag? Like....at all? Ever?

I'll support Endo's claim that holding by the mag or using the mag as a weight bearing contact point while shooting is taboo. I don't have first hand knowledge of malfunctions being the result, but that's what I was taught.

I've been shooting AR's since the 90's, and was advised by an active duty Marine stationed at El Toro (I worked in Lake Forest at the time) before I bought my first AR not to acquire either practice as a habit.

That's not to say I haven't shot AR's while grasping the magwell of the lower receiver, but I have never consciously held the mag or placed the rifle on the mag for support while shooting.

Here's a bad example of me shooting off a bag. Totally unrealistic for field use because I'm using a sand bag on top of my shooters rest, but with 20rd mags with an AR (resting), or 20rd mags with a FAL (firing) you can easily see that the mag is nowhere near touching the ground. A backpack or butt pouch can also support the rifle without the mag touching the ground.

[CouchOperator]

I'll support Endo's claim that holding by the mag or using the mag as a weight bearing contact point while shooting is taboo. I don't have first hand knowledge of malfunctions being the result, but that's what I was taught.

I've been shooting AR's since the 90's, and was advised by an active duty Marine stationed at El Toro (I worked in Lake Forest at the time) before I bought my first AR not to acquire either practice as a habit.

That's not to say I haven't shot AR's while grasping the magwell of the lower receiver, but I have never consciously held the mag or placed the rifle on the mag for support while shooting.

Here's a bad example of me shooting off a bag. Totally unrealistic for field use because I'm using a sand bag on top of my shooters rest, but with 20rd mags with an AR (resting), or 20rd mags with a FAL (firing) you can easily see that the mag is nowhere near touching the ground. A backpack or butt pouch can also support the rifle without the mag touching the ground.

I call shenanigans. A properly functioning rifle will not choke on a mag rested on the ground. Until you have done it, please refrain from including your conjecture into this discussion.

Endo is also severely misguided by tradition and false information