35% fee for not passing background check?

[husdat]

I just saw this ad:

http://www.armslist.com/posts/5865740/los-angeles-california-handguns-for-sale-trade--sig-229-elite-stainless

Is that guy for real? What authority does he have charging that 35% of $2000? And is that $2000 price for real?

[SkyHawk]

A failed background check in a PPT (private sale) can be a major hassle for the seller. He doesn't need any authority. He told buyers up front, so they agree to it when they agree to purchase. It's called a contract. Don't enter into one if you don't like the terms.

If the buyer fails background, the seller has to come back to the FFL, days or weeks later, to hassle with retrieving the firearm, arrange the refund for the buyer, and start all over from scratch. Don't buy in a PPT unless you are pretty sure you will pass.

Yes, the price is a real asking price, for a rare in CA off roster all-steel Sig. It is just his starting price. He'd probably take less. Worth at least $1200+ though, and could easily get more.

I notice you are planning to move into CA soon. You've got a rude awakening coming, this is just a little taste. When it comes to desirable, off roster handguns - the seller is in the drivers seat, not the buyer. Bring what you want with you, then you don't have to worry about it. But don't bring stainless P229 thinking you will get $2k for them, you wont. Not super desirable even if rare, except to hard core Sig fans.

[DDscar]

I would do the same if someone wasted my time and they weren't able to pass the background check.

[hermosabeach]

Most sellers are ignorant that some buyers fail the background

Then they want a full refund...

35%!seems ok with me

[husdat]

How can he charge that fee? Thru the FFL dealer?

[DDscar]

You've never bought a gun before thru PPT? That's HIS cash price. You're paying the FFL the DROS fee and other small fees. That 2K price is the money that someone will pay him not the FFL. They can care less how much someone sells a gun for

[billped]

He doesn't "charge a fee". He has the cash in hand.

[jdben92883]

If the buyer fails the background check the seller gets the gun back and he has the buyer's money. The FFL doesn't handle any money in a PPT. The seller wouldn't "charge" anything, he'd simply just refund the buyer 65%. By rights he could keep the entire amount paid and refund nothing to the buyer.

How can he charge that fee? Thru the FFL dealer?

[SkyHawk]

How can he charge that fee? Thru the FFL dealer?

You will learn when you get to CA. It goes like this:

We meet at a FFL, you look over the gun I have and decide to buy.

You hand me the cash. The FFL does not get involved in the money exchange, they aren't running an escrow service. You do your paperwork and we both leave, and ideally I never see you again related to this exchange.

Then ten days go by or 20 or maybe 30, we both find out you failed background check, because BACKGROUND CHECKS ARE NOT INSTANT IN CA AND THERE IS A MINIMUM TEN DAY WAIT TO PICKUP FIREARMS AFTER PURCHASE.

So now I have to take off work again, find babysitter for kids, whatever, and slog through LA traffic once again to the FFL, wait around for them to get to me, retrieve the firearm dealing with whatever BS paperwork they will put me through, meet you somehow, and give you the cash back - maybe the cash I needed and already used to pay my rent, and couldn't hold on to for three weeks just to see if you were a felon or had a restraining order or were out on bail, or what not, then slog my way back home and start all over finding a buyer from scratch, to go to the FFL again to sell, rinse wash and repeat.

Starting to get the picture? Major hassle. Takes up a lot of my time because you can't pass background. My time is not cheap, especially my spare time. So I keep 35% for my hassle. Most dealers also charge a restock fee if you dont pass background.

So in the real world as a seller here, I only deal with low feedback users at a FFL that is ten minutes from me. Period. You come to me. And if you fail background, I don't charge you because it is only an extra 30 mins of my time to deal with it. But if you have me drive 2 hours to your FFL and you fail the background check, well that is going to cost you something. Now I got 4 more hours in the car on top of the 4 hours it took to get there and back the day we first met, and whatever time standing around in your FFL to get my gun back.

The moral of the story is, don't buy in a private sale unless you are as sure as a person can be, that you will pass the background check.

[stevemac]

Not unreasonable, and not the first time I've seen terms like that.

[tradecraft]

Don't buy from me, I have worse terms (sometimes) to cover the cost of a flight back to pick up your/my denied crap. It really weeds out the 0 itrader folks.

[stormtrooperx]

Geez, you'd think the price tag would already weed out the folks who couldn't pass the background check. But given how often this happens, no wonder many sellers require the buyer comes to their FFL.

[AKSOG]

The DOJ and their information is so sketchy, I would never commit to that.

[Merc1138]

He doesn't "charge a fee". He has the cash in hand.

Exactly, there's nothing to charge, he simply returns the cash less the 35%. Personally, if for some reason I were to sell guns, I'd probably do something similar. As long as the seller is up front about it, it's a non-issue. A buyer can file a PFEC if they aren't sure they'll pass a background check, and while people do get a delay for random BS reasons sometimes, it's a rarity to get an outright denial without being at least vaguely aware of the circumstances that caused it if you've bought a firearm within the past few years(there are some people who haven't bought anything since the 70's and might have done something 30 years ago and actually forgot about it... but that's what the PFEC is for).

As far as the seller...
He's got to go back to the FFL(which may not be just up the street), do more paperwork(and if I remember right, wait again), then find a place to meet the buyer again who is likely pissed off, hand over a bunch of money he's been sitting on for a month(assuming it wasn't a quick denial), then re-list the ad and have to wait till he gets another interested buyer and hope it's not a repeat of the same BS with a different person.

[husdat]

35% * $2000 = $700. That's a lot.