Buckshot vs Birdshot for HD . . . Here we go again.

[AAShooter]

I am in the buckshot camp but thought this video was instructive.

[Condorguns]

Nice. I am and have been firmly in the bird shot team.

[Sactown23]

Buck, but I use a 20 gauge, and I don't think that bird will do the trick.

[Condorguns]

At close range even 20 ga bird makes a hell of a hole.

[Sactown23]

I only question the penetration. There's no doubt it'll make hole. In fact, when loaded for HD, I run 2 birds followed by buck. Not the most popular thing to do, but in the end, this conversation ends up being a round and round. I did find the following to be informative. The main reason for the 20 is my wife. She's uncomfortable with a 12, and I'm away from home for over half the year.

http://theboxotruth.com/docs/bot22.htm

[NapalmCheese]

All this video shows is that birdshot up close has a really tight pattern and doesn't go through walls. The guys go on to say that being shot with birdshot "will significantly affect someone's ability to hurt you".

That doesn't necessarily mean stop them.

As soon as someone shows me video of a ballistic gel encased heart and rib cage, covered in sweatshirt, getting shot with birdshot such that multiple pellets go through the heart I'll switch to birdshot for defense.

I would also tentatively accept a large hole to the lungs provided that the wound to the lungs is such that at least one lung would almost immediately fill with fluid and/or permanently deflate.

[bruss01]

I go with buckshot exclusively.

I'm convinced that for defensive purposes it has a very effective ballistic profile.

Overpenetration (from a shotgun pellet) does not concern me. Effective terminal ballistics concerns me greatly.

It's very defensible in court as this is what the overwhelming majority of police who use shotguns choose as their ammo load out.

In my opinion (backed up by box-o-truth) bird shot is for birds... literally.

[-hanko]

At close range even 20 ga bird makes a hell of a hole.

...and works very well if you're bothered by birds in the house.

Otherwise, a video devoid of scientific method or reasoning past the second grade level. No mention of how bird shot actually works in stopping a threat.

The old rule of using the largest bullet you can comfortably control, with 18 inches or so of penetration, applies here.

[PoorRichRichard]

Slugs, because I want to be able to see the second bad guy through the hole I shot in the first bad guy

[alfred1222]

Why not both?? i have 4 bird followed by 4 buck.

[-hanko]

Why not both?? i have 4 bird followed by 4 buck.

Because you may not have time to get to the 5th shell if the first 4 just knock the 20 pound dummy on his back?

[meaty-btz]

In Detroit a half-pint lightweight of a teen was shot point blank 3-4 times including a point blank shot to the head. By point blank I mean less than 6".

While the injuries were grizzly and nasty to look at, and he would have eventually died from blood loss without help, none of them were "disabling". In fact he was able to run for help and was mostly suffering from symptoms that match up with severe shock rather than crippling wounds.

One of the shots was also point blank to the chest and this kid was thin enough to blow away in a strong wind.. still the pellets did not penetrate his lungs or heart but only created nasty surface wounds. The worst injury was to his spindly arm where his lack of flesh allowed arterial damage from the blast.

Anyone who has the ability to run/stagger several blocks after three point blank execution style shots also has plenty of ability to kill you if they are armed.

Remember unarmed he survived. Death was quite a long time away.. bleed out. He also was not incapacitated severely and could stand and get away. A man with a knife with those injuries can still kill you as could one with a gun.

As for missing.. DON'T MISS. Missing is as hazardous to your health as using something that will just piss off someone high on drugs or hate as both won't do squat to stop the threat. Quite frankly you NEVER wan't him to get a shot off or an opening with his knife because usually that will be the end of you. This isn't the movies, on the two way range both people get hit and it isn't pretty.

[ChuckDizzle]

Find a happy medium with some #1-4 buckshot. #4 puts something like two dozen balls downrange at roughly .22 cal each.

[therealnickb]

God forbid I'm ever in a gunfight. But if it happens, I hope I'm up against "birdshot guy".

[omgwtfbbq]

00 Buck. That is all.

I am a big proponent of picking the equipment that best fits your life (your skill, your home layout, weapon etc). For me, it's just me and the fiance in a small apartment and the layout is such that if I took a shot towards the entryway/down the hall way, it would be parallel to the neighbor's wall. I'm not concerned with overpenetration as I am with making sure the bad guy goes down with as few shots possible.