Testing OO Buck for HD - Need Advice

[-hanko]

Straight bull puckey on both counts. The Best Defense show on Outdoor channel contradicted both those wivestails along with several articles in Gun Digest and American Rifleman..

Anecdotal stories are one thing. The need for consistent penetration is another.

The internet info on racking the gun has been around for a while.

Take a training class after reading 831shooter's post. Or, try to understand why professionals use buckshot v. birdshot.

hth

-hanko

[therza2071]

Straight bull puckey on both counts. The Best Defense show on Outdoor channel contradicted both those wivestails along with several articles in Gun Digest and American Rifleman..

What's bull puckey about it?

Birdshot is a very poor defensive load.

[MAC USMC]

As a retired LEO with well over 35 years experience I have seen many gunshot wounds and fatal shootings, many inflicted by police officers. The investigation and detailed review of such shooting scenes is revealing and thought provoking. I believe PRACTICE with your weapon will provide you with familiarity, skill and the mind set needed to protect yourself and your family. I would suggest that you shoot your weapon at night to gain some insight also.

Take a look at the FBI FIREARMS WOUND info at www. firearmstactical.com for some very revealing data. A shotgun is an extremely effective killing device, more so than many believe. I would prefer it over most other weapons due to its' versatility and power. DO NOT over look slug rounds, in particular the sabot type slug which has sufficient penetration to stop a car engine. My personal shotgun has four OO buck followed by slugs.

If you desire a much tighter shot pattern take a look at the Vangcomp barrels or complete weapons. I have a 12 guage Remington 870 with the Vangcomp barrel which tightens my groups so much I could make lethal hits at extreme ranges. This is NOT for hunting purposes.This barrel modification reduces muzzle flash and recoil and vastly improves accuracy with buck shot.

GOOD LUCK AND STAY SAFE!

[negolien]

It's straight crap and has been debunked many times.. It's one thing to be at distance and shoot someone with birdshot it's another to be at 3-7 yards max distance and hit someone in the face with #8. Anyone shot at that distance will go down.

You use whatever you want but telling someone in an apt or that has children in a room next to theirs to use 3 1/2 magnum 000 buckshots stupid. Racking the slide on a SG for those attuned to firearms usage serves as a good deterent but if you want to go all rambo and wish to kill someone go right ahead /shrug.

I would defend myself if I had to but I'd rather not have to shoot someone that's the differance between forum warriors and real life people prepared to defend themselves if they HAD too I guess.

[1911su16b870]

Federal 00 buck FCS.

[OldShooter32]

I would stay away from 00 and use #4 for home; it has the most mass without the (over) penetration you will get with the larger pellets. Shot a lot of 00 as a cop and was surprised at what it would do at longer range. Stick to #4...

[Mr. Beretta]

Federal LE132 00 or Federal LE132 1B.

The stuff is the cat's meow.

Either will perform as requested.

[CaliforniaLiberal]

I think it's amazing how hot these shotgun threads get. Month after month, year after year. Never run out of steam. Same old ideas hashed over and hashed again.

Birdshot, buckshot, #4 Buck. Rocksalt! Rack your slide and scare them off, remain stealthy and spring upon your enemy unexpectedly. Flashlights! Bayonets on shotguns! Remington, Mossberg, antique single shots, coach guns. Home defense coach guns with accessory rails!

You're a worthless piece of sh*t if you don't take a tactical shotgun training class at least four times a year. Front Sight. Practice, practice, practice. I clear my house in the dark at least once a week by 'slicing the pie.' 'I clear my house blindfolded every night before bedtime.'

Over penetration of walls, under penetration of bad guys. FBI standards, Box O' Truth gel blocks, sheetrock and water jugs.

Read and learn all you can about shotguns. Go out shooting. Take a class.

Please don't get all dogmatic and upset about it.



I have a Mossberg 590. Sometimes I put a bayonet on it, but never a flashlight. Easier to just turn on a light. I never practice clearing my house. I have cheap buckshot in it.

Once I used the bayonet to cut an apple pie at Thanksgiving Dinner. Worked great.

[NYCShooter]

If you desire a much tighter shot pattern take a look at the Vangcomp barrels or complete weapons. I have a 12 guage Remington 870 with the Vangcomp barrel which tightens my groups so much I could make lethal hits at extreme ranges. This is NOT for hunting purposes.This barrel modification reduces muzzle flash and recoil and vastly improves accuracy with buck shot.

I did a VC barrel several years ago, but the latest shot shell technology has pretty much obsoleted the need for it today. I can get tighter patterns through a regular barrel using Federal w/FliteControl or Hornady TAP than I could using a VC barrel. In addition, I found that the FC and TAP loads actually patterned worse through the VC barrel. And, I would never port a barrel, unless I though my shotgun wasn't already loud enough. I also thought that muzzle flash was worse.

Likewise, I wouldn't purchase a complete VC gun, but would purchase an Express and simply upgrade a few minor parts for about $30 (forged extractor, carrier dog follower spring, magazine spring). The polymer trigger guard on the Express is more durable than the pressed metal found on the Police, and both models now use the identical sear spring.

The only aftermarket barrel work that I find compelling is the King Armory muzzle brake/suppressor. This tightens patterns for all loads, and reduces muzzle flash and recoil. http://kingarmory.com/king-armory-pr...h-suppressors/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xa9lrc2z58Y&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PL43171332EEB51C25

[Ron-Solo]

Having survived two gunfights (one against an AK47) where the shotgun save my life, I would NEVER consider any game load for home defense. I've seen the difference in the wounds and stopping power between 00B and 4B. If you can't hit your target in an HD situation with 9 pellets of 00 Buck, train until you can.

My personal HD shotgun is an Ithaca Model 37 with four rounds of Federal LE 00 Buck, with an empty chamber. This is the way most LEA's carry their shotguns in the patrol car. You have to hit the slide release, rack the slide, and take the safety off and then you're ready. Only takes a second, and is the safest way to prevent accidental discharges.

And way too much worry about over penetration of 00 Buck in my opinion...... At close range such as a HD situation, all 9 pellets should enter the suspect and stay there.

When the adrenalin is pumping, you won't even notice the noise or muzzle flash. I know first hand.

[BigDogatPlay]

I think it's amazing how hot these shotgun threads get. Month after month, year after year. Never run out of steam. Same old ideas hashed over and hashed again.

^^^^^
Yes it does seem like that from time to time. You make some valid points and although some might get a little butthurt, I certainly wouldn't. Free exchange of ideas.

Having survived two gunfights (one against an AK47) where the shotgun save my life, I would NEVER consider any game load for home defense. I've seen the difference in the woulds and stopping power between 00B and 4B. If you can't hit your target in an HD situation with 9 pellets of 00 Buck, train until you can.

My personal HD shotgun is an Ithaca Model 37 with four rounds of Federal LE 00 Buck, with an empty chamber. This is the way most LEA's carry their shotguns in the patrol car. You have to hit the slide release, rack the slide, and take the safety off and then you're ready. Only takes a second, and is the safest way to prevent accidental discharges.

And way too much worry about over penetration of 00 Buck in my opinion...... At close range such as a HD situation, all 9 pellets should enter the suspect and stay there.

When the adrenalin is pumping, you won't even notice the noise or muzzle flash. I know first hand.

^^^^^ The real world ^^^^^

Along with some other posts from long service and / or retired LEOs, as well as .mil who've been there and done that in this discussion, the insight above is golden.

[/ thread]

[therza2071]

It's straight crap and has been debunked many times.. It's one thing to be at distance and shoot someone with birdshot it's another to be at 3-7 yards max distance and hit someone in the face with #8. Anyone shot at that distance will go down.

You use whatever you want but telling someone in an apt or that has children in a room next to theirs to use 3 1/2 magnum 000 buckshots stupid. Racking the slide on a SG for those attuned to firearms usage serves as a good deterent but if you want to go all rambo and wish to kill someone go right ahead /shrug.

I would defend myself if I had to but I'd rather not have to shoot someone that's the differance between forum warriors and real life people prepared to defend themselves if they HAD too I guess.

That's unrealistic. You talk about not wanting to harm anybody in any adjacent rooms, but you're going to aim for something as small as an intruder's head, during an adrenaline dump, probably at night?

I personally do not care what you load your shotgun with, but it's a bit irresponsible of you to be touting birdshot as a good defensive load, because it isn't.