Ruger 10/22 frustrations

[RawHP]

Most cycling issues with the 10-22 come down to two basic things, the guide rod spring and the hammer spring. Remember that the bolt must not only push back on the recoil spring but must also cock the hammer. Most of the time the hammer springs are stiff and the bolt rear face has very little mechanical advantage to cocking the hammer back. That is because the squared off back end engages the hammer closer to the hammer pivot pin than a radiused bolt. By radiusing in the rear of the bolt, it gives more mechanical advantage to the cocking process and allows full retraction of the bolt resulting in significantly less if any stove piping. Also full travel of the bolt gives it more kinetic energy to strip off the next round and chamber it resulting in less failure to feed issues. Radiusing the rear of the bolt will also allow the use of lower subsonic rounds which tend to be significantly more precise. I would also use a rubber buffer of some sorts should you use higher velocity ammunition resulting in greater recoil.
Extractor issues tend to be overblown and really cause issues when you can't remove a round from the chamber. Usually the discharge of the round is enough to blow itself out of the chamber.

The important thing for people to note about rediusing the bolt, if they choose to do it themselves (fairly easy if you have a good bench grinder or bench sander) is to understand how the geometry of the bolt factors into the rest of the rifle's function, not just cycling. If you remove too much metal on the lower lobe, below the bolt stop, you can create a potential out of battery discharge situation. The lobe stops the hammer from striking the firing pin when the bolt is slightly out of battery.

It doesn't take a lot of radiusing to improve cycling, but more radiusing is not better. The bolt may cycle a well when the radiusing is too agressive, until something goes wrong and you're picking brass out of your hand, or worse.

https://1022companion.wordpress.com/2016/01/24/radiusing-the-bolt/

[DAVO]

Agree with many of the recommendations made so far. From reading the thread sounds like you are at an appleseed shoot right now shooting the HV stuff.

After 700+ rounds its initial break in has been done-I recommend you pull it apart and note where the wear spots are. The best hint at the location of friction spots (what you are trying to reduce) is where you actually see wear on your own gun parts. The effects of friction are cumulative so being thorough isn't a bad idea and besides, it will make the gun easier to clean later.

A scotch brite pad on the interior of the receiver and any spots of wear on the bolt is a great idea, including the rear where it hits the hammer. Also the top of the hammer where the bolt rides over it and the upper surface of the rail if you can get to it. I dont recommend a dremel (felt tip and jewelers rouge or flitz metal polish) for the aluminum receiver, but it will make short work of the bolt and hammer.

Heres an example of a cleaned up hammer surface and polished receiver...


If you havent yet, it wouldn't hurt to clean the barrel and extractor channel, and clean/polish the chamber-but the last part will require removing the barrel-which isn't hard but you may not want to do it. It will probably require you rezeroing your rifle.

Good call on getting a new guide rod, mine is still stock but I did polish it up. A lighter weight recoil spring will help with all all loads, and on that note a recoil buffer is not a bad idea, it will lessen the "clickety clack" during cycling and potentially prevent damage to your receiver with all loads. Cheap insurance, and not the cause of stove pipes.

Ruger uses some gunky oil in its trigger mechanisms, I believe more to prevent rust long term but its not the best for functioning. If you haven't, I recommend cleaning out the trigger group as well.

Finally, as mentioned look into a VQ exact edge extractor, its the same model used in both the 10/22 and 22/45 (sometimes its cheaper to buy the part as a 22/45 or Mark II/III extractor but its the same part).

When you change it out be sure to clean the channel the spring rides in as well. I was getting perhaps 1-2 per 100 rounds stovepiping but after this mod its closer to 1 in 1000 rounds stovepiping. It was definitive in getting my 10/22 more reliable about 12 years ago and its still going strong. Stock ruger extractors are slightly smaller, dont have the nice sharp edges, and are softer steel so they dull relatively quickly.

[SFCRangerDoc]

Quick update from as today:

After a thorough cleaning of the receiver and chamber and taking Emory paper to the receiver/bolt/guide rod and putting back in the polymer bolt buffer it seems we may have made some progress. The wife shot her first day with only a single double feed and no stovepipes. We were using minimags so that likely helped too. I'm going to clean it again real good tonight and then once my parts come in swap out the guide rod and extractor

[RawHP]

Quick update from as today:

After a thorough cleaning of the receiver and chamber and taking Emory paper to the receiver/bolt/guide rod and putting back in the polymer bolt buffer it seems we may have made some progress. The wife shot her first day with only a single double feed and no stovepipes. We were using minimags so that likely helped too. I'm going to clean it again real good tonight and then once my parts come in swap out the guide rod and extractor

I guess if you didn't try the Federal AutoMatch, you won't know if you were fully successful, but at least you didn't get any stove pipes. That said, if you had a double feed with CCI MiniMags, which is unusual, then I'd suggest really concentrating on cleaning the chamber even more thoroughly. Put some Kroil or Hoppes on the chamber cleaning tool you made, scrub it good, but leave the solvent inside for 10 or 20 minutes to work. Then scrub it again, and clean the bore.

If you haven't done that in the past, then chances are the crud has built up in that area and baked itself on, since it sometimes takes more than a few swipes with a patch or bore brush to remove it, especially since you're shooting some pretty dirty bulk ammo.

Here's an article that talks about what's happening, and why that area collects the most crud, especially in blow back designs like the 10/22 (not just the carbon ring, but also in the rest of the chamber). See the section about 1/4 of the way down on the "Black Ring":

http://www.rrdvegas.com/rimfire-cleaning.html

I use my chamber cleaning brush a few times during each range session to make sure nothing ever builds up. Less work later when doing the routine cleaning.

[SFCRangerDoc]

I guess if you didn't try the Federal AutoMatch, you won't know if you were fully successful, but at least you didn't get any stove pipes. That said, if you had a double feed with CCI MiniMags, which is unusual, then I'd suggest really concentrating on cleaning the chamber even more thoroughly. Put some Kroil or Hoppes on the chamber cleaning tool you made, scrub it good, but leave the solvent inside for 10 or 20 minutes to work. Then scrub it again, and clean the bore.

If you haven't done that in the past, then chances are the crud has built up in that area and baked itself on, since it sometimes takes more than a few swipes with a patch or bore brush to remove it, especially since you're shooting some pretty dirty bulk ammo.

Here's an article that talks about what's happening, and why that area collects the most crud, especially in blow back designs like the 10/22 (not just the carbon ring, but also in the rest of the chamber). See the section about 1/4 of the way down on the "Black Ring":

http://www.rrdvegas.com/rimfire-cleaning.html

I use my chamber cleaning brush a few times during each range session to make sure nothing ever builds up. Less work later when doing the routine cleaning.

We had some stovepiping today with mini mag's Even with my thorough scrubbing of the chamber last night...however it was weird i took the rifle and ran 2 aqt's back to back with it with Remington golden bullet right after my wife gave up and sat out a string and I not a single bit of problem. She went back to shooting and didn't have a problem the rest of the day...both with mini-mags or golden bullet. it just doesn't seem to have any rhyme or reason as to why it stovepipes. a full day of AS saturday with no stoves and only a single double feed (im saying that one was mags), and then a cleaning last night and half a day today with out any stoves... then a bunch of stoves in a row...and then nothing the rest of the day...MADDENING I TELL YA!! :P

[RawHP]

We had some stovepiping today with mini mag's Even with my thorough scrubbing of the chamber last night...however it was weird i took the rifle and ran 2 aqt's back to back with it with Remington golden bullet right after my wife gave up and sat out a string and I not a single bit of problem. She went back to shooting and didn't have a problem the rest of the day...both with mini-mags or golden bullet. it just doesn't seem to have any rhyme or reason as to why it stovepipes. a full day of AS saturday with no stoves and only a single double feed (im saying that one was mags), and then a cleaning last night and half a day today with out any stoves... then a bunch of stoves in a row...and then nothing the rest of the day...MADDENING I TELL YA!! :P

I've done these mods even on my Volquartsen extractor since I've been shortening/modifying the chamber of my Green Mountain barrel to get a little bit more accuracy (my quest for consistent sub-MOA at 100 yards). The tip of my extractor is so sharp now that it can cut your finger. Since you have a new Ruger replacement, you could always take a shot at modding the old one.

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5584584&postcount=8

[GUNNTZ]

I fully understand where you are at with your rifle. My original 10/22 had all of your symptoms and it felt like they would never end. First three things I did was to check barrel alignment, proper tightening of the v-block and bolt head space. All 10/22 rifles seem to have one or more of these issues. Personally, I would start by checking how the barrel is seated into the receiver, if there's any gap pull the barrel and inspect. V-block, ensure that the tightening sequence is followed; torque to spec and use blue loctite on threads. Headspace, this one might need the assistance of a qualified gunsmith. I had one of my bolts sent out for headspacing and the other I just bought a kidd bolt assembly. This solved most of my issues with ftf/fte. Both of my 10/22's now have the following: kidd bolts(Headspaced factory now laying in drawer), kidd buffer, kidd guide rods and kidd receiver screw pins. Neither has had an issue since I installed these parts. The quality of new generation 10/22's stink.

[Mutant]

Just hit it with a hammer, many places, while yelling swear words and scaring the dog. It has worked for me.

[SFCRangerDoc]

Just hit it with a hammer, may places, while yelling swear words and scaring the dog. It has worked for me.

ahahahahahaha honestly im about to!

[45R]

Here is a photo of a Ruger 10/22 extractor and an aftermarket one.

I had a 10/22 that had issues with stove pipes. I ended up getting a factory extractor from Ruger and the rifle continued to have issues. Ended up going with an aftermarket extractor and problem solved.

[ronnie.coleman.39982]

Has anybody just thought to call Ruger? They have outstanding customer service and will address the problem. They don't want people shooting their guns when they don't work.

[tboyer]

For reference

[SFCRangerDoc]

Has anybody just thought to call Ruger? They have outstanding customer service and will address the problem. They don't want people shooting their guns when they don't work.

Yeah that's my last resort though. I'd rather not have my wife be rifle less for however long it takes ruger to fix it (assuming they actually do something more than just change out the extractor and spring and guide rod and send it back). I've got the extractor showing up tomorrow and then im going to drop in the guide rod and spring and extractor and then have her torture it at the range.

Sent from my VK810 4G using Tapatalk

[SFCRangerDoc]

So i got my Volq extractor and spring today and the first thing i noticed is the Volq extractor spring is quite a bit shorter than the factory spring...buy quite a bit more...



Volq on top factory on bottom for both the springs and ext...

Is this normal??

[RawHP]

So i got my Volq extractor and spring today and the first thing i noticed is the Volq extractor spring is quite a bit shorter than the factory spring...buy quite a bit more...



Volq on top factory on bottom for both the springs and ext...

Is this normal??

I've seen a few posts before about keeping the factory spring and just installing the extractor. I think it's up to you, but you could try one, manually place a round in the bolt (bolt out of the rifle) and shake it around a little to see if it stays in place, then try the same with the other. I'm pretty sure I stuck with the stock spring. The Volquartsen spring is a different rate, but not necessarily better.