AK & CR

[NOTABIKER]

reading up on Enterprise Arms AKs. i think they use NDS receivers. now if they use original hammer forged barrels i will be happy. i guess a chrome lined USA barrel will be ok. i do not think they come with a scope mound on the side . i wish they did.

[6mmintl]

I don't really care about the AK rifle itself as inaccurate as it is with its iron sight system , its the mindset it imparts to the owners that degrades the possibility to try shooting more accurately at distances beyond 50/100 yards.

Its supposed to be a 300 meter gun but I cannot say that it 35 years of shooting on public ranges that I have ever seen anyone shoot out to at least 200 yards.

[knucklehead0202]

the ak was designed with a similar mindset as the lee enfields, which was not that it's a precision tool, but to get enough lead in the air that it's bound to hit something. they are crude and simple for a reason; because it works and will continue to work. like any tool you have a choice to make, do you want the super-fancy one that you're afraid to damage and may not work all the time, or the beat-up ugly one that always works? I know what choice I'd make. there's a romance to these crude commie guns, a character that no AR will ever have, nevermind the proven reliability. I don't own an AK yet, although I do have a vz-58, which is also very neat. once I get it un-tacticooled it should be a neat shooter.

[NOTABIKER]

I am one of those that mostly just enjoys shooting them. i do not get into accuracy. for some reason precession shooting seems like a lot of work. i do not think i own one rifle except maybe my finn M-39 that you could consider accurate. and with my eyes it is going to waste.
in my mind taking a old C&R to the range is like taking a nice old hot rod for a Sunday ride . no need to punch it or lay rubber, just enjoy it for what it WAS.
all i want to do with my AK is go threw cheap tula ammo and hit the gong at 100 yards. then go home and clean and admire it. nothing more.

[Quiet]

Please do not connet this rifle to the Las Vegas rifles. They are not the same.

There were three companies named Arsenal that make AK type rifles.
Recently one of those companies changed their name to avoid confusion.

Arsenal (Bulgaria) is now FIME Group.
Arsenal Inc (USA, NV, Las Vegas)
Arsenal USA (USA, TX, Houston)

[meaty-btz]

Off the rack, a properly built AK has the same MOA as an arsenaled AR. The issue is with the shooter more or less.
Most people don't get proper cheek weld or placement when using the Warsaw Stock Length, proper position has you kissing the back of the receiver.

Can an AR be built to be more accurate than an AK? Yeah. You can build a more accurate AK as a well. For a reliable battle rifle an AK is pretty tough to beat in an theater of conflict.
My favorite video is of the South African arms disposal team, they dig up a cache of weapons including an AK. The AK is rusted shut, he knocks the BC loose, loads some rusted up ammo in it.. and it runs full auto flawlessly. Try that with an AR.

the ak was designed with a similar mindset as the lee enfields, which was not that it's a precision tool, but to get enough lead in the air that it's bound to hit something. they are crude and simple for a reason; because it works and will continue to work. like any tool you have a choice to make, do you want the super-fancy one that you're afraid to damage and may not work all the time, or the beat-up ugly one that always works? I know what choice I'd make. there's a romance to these crude commie guns, a character that no AR will ever have, nevermind the proven reliability. I don't own an AK yet, although I do have a vz-58, which is also very neat. once I get it un-tacticooled it should be a neat shooter.

[19K]

Off the rack, a properly built AK has the same MOA as an arsenaled AR. The issue is with the shooter more or less.
Most people don't get proper cheek weld or placement when using the Warsaw Stock Length, proper position has you kissing the back of the receiver.

Can an AR be built to be more accurate than an AK? Yeah. You can build a more accurate AK as a well. For a reliable battle rifle an AK is pretty tough to beat in an theater of conflict.
My favorite video is of the South African arms disposal team, they dig up a cache of weapons including an AK. The AK is rusted shut, he knocks the BC loose, loads some rusted up ammo in it.. and it runs full auto flawlessly. Try that with an AR.

you cannot beat that.

[Baboosh]

I don't really care about the AK rifle itself as inaccurate as it is with its iron sight system , its the mindset it imparts to the owners that degrades the possibility to try shooting more accurately at distances beyond 50/100 yards.

Its supposed to be a 300 meter gun but I cannot say that it 35 years of shooting on public ranges that I have ever seen anyone shoot out to at least 200 yards.

Built a Romy and took it to the range and was smacking steel at 215 yard 7/10 times and this was with the original barrel from 1980.

The rifles are not inaccurate and the iron sights work perfectly.

Come to our C&R shoot and we can venture out to the back ranges and you can hear the ping of the steel at over 200 yards

[shda5582]

Built a Romy and took it to the range and was smacking steel at 215 yard 7/10 times and this was with the original barrel from 1980.

The rifles are not inaccurate and the iron sights work perfectly.

Come to our C&R shoot and we can venture out to the back ranges and you can hear the ping of the steel at over 200 yards

We're not allowed on the back ranges if we're just a limited member, right? Is there a way that we can get back there with a full member in tow? If so, I'd love to try my Mosin out to 200 yards to see if I'm as good as I am at 100 with it.

[raven290]

Built a Romy and took it to the range and was smacking steel at 215 yard 7/10 times and this was with the original barrel from 1980.

The rifles are not inaccurate and the iron sights work perfectly.

Come to our C&R shoot and we can venture out to the back ranges and you can hear the ping of the steel at over 200 yards

One of the translated Russian manuals for the AKM that I saw says that 5" groups from prone was the standard with these weapons. I also have a Romy and I was getting 4" groups from a sitting position at my local outdoor range on my last trip. There's nothing wrong with these rifles with regard to accuracy.

[NOTABIKER]

Sell the Enterprise Arms AK and get a real Euro one, made with either genuine original Cold War era Commie parts on a new receiver at the original factory ,or with new parts made in the original Cold War era former Commie factory. These days, other than some scarce and costly stuff, this means generally a WASR-10, Serbian O-PAP, or Polish Pioneer Arms "Sporter".

The O-PAPS are all new Serbian production parts with a surplus stock set, the Romanian and Polish rifles are original military parts with a new Romanian or Polish made semi-auto receiver.

Because I am a collector whose primary interest is vintage military and other historical arms, the WASR is my first choice since these are military rifles reassembled on a new semi-auto receiver at the original factory that made the rifle . The Draco pistols are built up using original military parts on a new legal AIMR submachinegun receiver that has not been been drilled for the infamous 3rd pin. I currently own 4 Romanian AK's - an early WASR-10 (NOT a WASR-10/63), a WASR-10/63, a WASR-10/63 underfolder (these are no longer made and imported, and are getting rather scarce and quite collectable) and a Draco pistol (also no longer imported and getting scarce and collectable).

before i put my AK in dros i took a quick look at it. it has the triangle stamp with a arrow in it and was made in 1971. So it should have the better materials and chrome lined parts.

[peppermintman]

We're not allowed on the back ranges if we're just a limited member, right? Is there a way that we can get back there with a full member in tow? If so, I'd love to try my Mosin out to 200 yards to see if I'm as good as I am at 100 with it.

Just take a trip up the road to L ytle. Get there early and you can shoot 200 yards no problem.

The triangle is a plus so you got an early model. Good for you.

[Dan_Eastvale]

I think what turns me off to the commie stuff isn't so much that they are commie, but more the lack of craftsmanship. Everything I have from commie manufacturers is rough looking, rough finished, etc. even my Bakial Makorov has lousy finish work. I just don't feel the pride in workmanship shows in any of them.

I still appreciate them as part of my collection though.

I guess the "crude, rough" look of these commie military weapons results from the fact that they were never intended to be sporting arms. They didn't need to be attractive because private citizens weren't buying them. Who did they have to impress? No one. Budgets were also limited and weapons needed to be manufactured quickly. Functionality and cheapness was job one.

I really don't understand why the more affluent western countries felt the need to produce "nicer" looking military small arms. Even the East German Makarov was a much nicer finish...(more western culture than eastern + a German love of craftsmanship). Maybe we (in the US) were just used to nicer looking guns because of our history/heritage?

[NOTABIKER]

all i see is the beauty of something made for war that always works. i look at a mosin and see how plain and basic it is built. many less parts than a mauser or springfield. give me simple and function every time. Swiss K-31s and Swedish mausers are beautiful rifles nether had to prove themselves in combat.

[6mmintl]

Im in NorCal, don't get down south, shoot from Gonzales to Sacramento with mostly pre 1890 military rifles and cast bullets/irons.

Cant get an AK or SKS shooter to come out to 200 to try big silhouette targets (3-6 MOA 200-500 meters) with ball ammo, cast, or handloaded ammo with scopes let alone irons.

I know there are a few ak's and sks's in the bay area.