Why not CMP?

[Dooder]

The CMP process requires that you get your FFL03, and your COE, and join an affiliated club. Many (myself included), have taken that route. It's a hassle (the COE Live Scan is, at least) but it's not really difficult. If you go through an FFL01 you are violating the CMP's officiall rules of sale.

If you follow the rules, you are a Collector. You are bound to not engage in a firearms business. You can buy and sell, even at a large profit (in my non-legal opinion). But you can't engage in business and, again in my opinion, arbitrage is way-way-way out of bounds.

CMP doesn't require a 03 & COE. The rules state that it has to go through a licensed dealer if the CMP member does not have these. But thats not my point, just wanted to clarify.

So most of us here in this thread have gone through the process to become CMP eligible and are 03 & COE holders. While we can admit that its not all that much trouble, it's enough that most people won't take the journey. I've talked about 03 & COE and CMP in great detail with many people and literally zero have actually gone through with it.

I used to share the same feelings as you. But came to realize a lot of things. First is that I've spoonfed information and links about the process to people and they still don't care. They'd rather pay more for whatever piece they can find, not from be but from a shop or gun show. A lot of members don't care about the spirit of CMP and only see it as a method to buy M1's. I was disappointed one time when I was sharing my clinic and mini match experience with another member and they voiced disinterest in that and only wanted to buy rifles.

Those of us that are part of the process have much more on the line than someone who just wants to pay money. We have our book to maintain, we pay not only for the gun but also for CFARS. We're on the DOJ's radar as we have an FFL from the ATF and COE from the state. We're not just a consumer anymore. Although audits may not happen to 03's, we agree to them by being an FFL. But we carry more responsibility. A lot of people don't want to deal with that and would rather pay more money to get something and be done.

Another thing is that CMP folk are screwing each other too. Take a look at the CMP Forum marketplace. Service grades are selling for over $1k on there as well.

As stated before, people will pay more something specific. I'd like to see a listing in this marketplace for a "CMP Service Grade M1, luck of the draw, no pictures. Case included" and see if that'll fetch $1k. Joe without a 03\COE who transfers in a Service Grade will be paying $1k anyways. Tax + transfer + DROS is probably around $200.

And finally I feel that the spirit of the CMP has long been lost and has become about pedalling M1's and the creation of a false market. The members overcharge their own, it's blatant that members are flipping, so I don't get upset or disappointed anymore. It is what it is.

[capt14k]

The CMP limit is still 8.

In Free America the Rifle is still shipped directly to the buyer and the cost shipped is $650 for a field grade SA/HRA and $750 for a service grade SA/HRA.

Yes it is scummy to order 8 Garands, then order 8 in your wife's name, and 8 in each parents name. Then put them on gunbroker and get between $1250-$2500. Yes I have personally seen $750 CMP rifles sell for $2500 on gunbroker.

Why are these sellers scum because they are gaining the system. The purpose of cheap Garands is to promote shooting sports, for that is the purpose of the CMP. Our parents and grandparents paid for these Garands via their tax dollars. CMP is self funded as far as rebuilding them, but they get the rifles for free. This is possible because Americans already paid for them.

Don't be surprised if those flipping Garands on gunbroker find themselves arrested by the new Administration. That flipping is called selling firearms without a license. For those that have a FFL01 and are flipping Garands; the CMP should cut them off immediately.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[John Browning]

Gaming the system? Scum suckers?

You would be much happier in a country whose only freedoms are freedom from capitalism and freedom from personal choice. What a sad bunch of anti-freedom folks.

[brianm767]

Here is my opinion.

I'd say a fair price is no more than the CMP price plus tax, assuming you got a run-of-the-mill rifle. again in my opinion,

To me that's like hiring an Auto broker and telling them to find you a car, then paying them exactly what they paid for it once its brought to you.

Don't get me wrong, I 100% agree with you as far as people using the CMP basically as a wholesale supplier to "just buy rifles to flip at a huge mark up" I disagree with this process but only because this is not what the CMP's intended purpose is, and if your only doing this, to me, that's conducting the business of selling firearms.

But I have no issue with collectors selling off what doesn't meet their needs for their collections at a fair profit for their time and effort. And I guess every one may have a different opinion of what a "Fair Profit" is.

Field grades at $1100, seems a bit high to me. But this is America, it is a capitalist country, and thank God for that. If I don't like the price I just move on, but more power to the seller.

Like I mentioned earlier, the last Service Grade SA Garands I sold off at $900, was actually a loss for me considering my expenses.

[capt14k]

Gaming the system? Scum suckers?



You would be much happier in a country whose only freedoms are freedom from capitalism and freedom from personal choice. What a sad bunch of anti-freedom folks.

Not anti freedom. Buy all the Garands you want through others channels and flip away. The purpose of CMP selling Garands that my parents and Grandparents paid for is to promote shooting sports, flipping them doesn't seem to meet that mission statement.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[brianm767]

Not anti freedom. Buy all the Garands you want through others channels and flip away. The purpose of CMP selling Garands that my parents and Grandparents paid for is to promote shooting sports, flipping them doesn't seem to meet that mission statement.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

I respect your opinion and agree with you on certain aspects of it.

But please keep me in mind if you ever sell a CMP rifle, ill happily pay you what you paid for it, infact I'm going to oder some field grades soon, do you have any you want to sell for $650? Or Service grades for $750, if so we can help each other out. It will save me the wait.

[John Browning]

I need someone to sell me the $950 WWII Correct Grade they bought about 20 years ago, and if I pay a dollar more I am going to throw a tantrum on the internet! Also, someone owes me a P51 Mustang for the $500 they sold them for in 1946. My taxes paid for that, and my great uncle was KIA as a Mustang pilot.

Some of you guys are an embarrassment to the American male with your sense of entitlement and fever dreams of some dude getting arrested selling his property for...clutch your pearls....what someone is willing to pay for it in a free exchange of goods for money!

CMP is free to charge what they want and they do.

[capt14k]

I respect your opinion and agree with you on certain aspects of it.



But please keep me in mind if you ever sell a CMP rifle, ill happily pay you what you paid for it, infact I'm going to oder some field grades soon, do you have any you want to sell for $650? Or Service grades for $750, if so we can help each other out. It will save me the wait.

I don't have any right now. Last Service Grade I had was SA WWII mixmaster. Sold it for what I had into it $800 + shipping. $750 CMP + $50 transfer (no direct shipment in NJ). I have a Winchester FG and a SA/HRA Service Grade on order. I had older guys help me out when I started collecting by selling me stuff at what they paid. I have done the same myself plenty of times for younger collectors. Of course I have sold ones at a profit too. The CMP rifles I am not buying to sell at a profit, so yes I would sell to a newer collector for what I have into it, if it is not what I am looking for. It's not like anyone lays out money for 4 months while waiting for rifles from CMP (you get charged when it ships), so I don't see the need make anything on the 5 minutes it takes to fill out paperwork and mail it in.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[capt14k]

I need someone to sell me the $950 WWII Correct Grade they bought about 20 years ago, and if I pay a dollar more I am going to throw a tantrum on the internet! Also, someone owes me a P51 Mustang for the $500 they sold them for in 1946. My taxes paid for that, and my great uncle was KIA as a Mustang pilot.



Some of you guys are an embarrassment to the American male with your sense of entitlement and fever dreams of some dude getting arrested selling his property for...clutch your pearls....what someone is willing to pay for it in a free exchange of goods for money!



CMP is free to charge what they want and they do.

You are comparing Apples and Oranges, but it's good to know where certain people stand. That's why there are two price levels amongst collectors. The gunbroker pricing, and the collector friend pricing because you know it will come back around.

With the new Administration I certainly wouldn't be flipping rifles on gunbroker without a license. Especially ones with a paper trail from a quasi governmental organization. Selling something you had for years at a profit I don't think ATF would consider selling for profit without a license. Buying 8 rifles from CMP at $750 each and immediately selling them for $1500 each I think they may call that selling for profit without a license.

CMP is regulated by law to sell at fair market value. 36 U.S. Code 40732 (a) (b). Which they do.

[fatfreadiescat]

I bought the 4 field grade rifles that were put for sale last night
I've been dealing in garands all the way back to the DCM days (3 years for the first one)
Have bought dozens from CMP (garands, 1903a3, carbine etc.)
Had the curio and relic licence (after a year boxed up every piece of paper they sent me and returned it to them)
The reason I paid $1100 apiece for 4 field grades is because I wanted them and had the cash.

[teenspirit]

Many people might not realize that only US citizens can buy from CMP. I have seen some people want to buy from CMP but because they are not US citizens they can only buy from secondary market.

[Ora Serrata]

Funny how nobody has mentioned that they're currently sold out of everything but Field Grades right now.

Yes, they'll eventually assemble more, but who knows when they'll catch up. Even the Field Grades say the wait is 14-16 weeks. A lot of people want what they want "right now".

BTW: when was the last time anyone went into an average gun store and priced a Garand? A couple years ago, pre-pandemic, I was in a LGS and saw one. I asked the price and it was $2400, for a run of the mill Springfield.

[Spyder]

Auctions are pretty much the ultimate decider of true fair market value, wouldn't you think? Numerous people all coming to a pretty unanimous decision about how much they are willing, or not willing, to pay for an item which they have the ability and option to choose to spend as much as they want on. Or not, if they don't want.

[Ora Serrata]

Problem with auctions is a lot of bidders get caught up in the moment and overbid. I used to get done pretty good deals at auctions. Last year or two people are bidding up even easy to get stuff. Like $900 for a run of the mill Bundeswehr Walther P1 at a recent auction I was in.

[McGuiver]