Talked AR15 w/DOJ, ATF and Orange county sheriff's today

[slambo]

No more than 15 minutes ago I took my AR 15 lower apart.
Why?
I talked to the range trainer, Greg, at the Orange County Sheriff's Dept. Range. I told him that I ws interested in trying to get my AR15 signed off as legal....
Boy did I gat an ear full. He got really nasty with me, I told him all I wanted to do was make the gun legal. I even made reference to the Bullett Button the law on the DOJ and he really blew up on me.
He said that the only way to make a AR15 legal is to weld on the mag. There is no other way.
I made reference to the law that the DOJ has here in the site, he blasted that as not law and that come January 1st, there is going to be a ruling coming from the DOJ in reference to the BB and that they(BB)are going to be illegal.
At this point I would like to go backwards and say that Agent Jeff Aleman with DOJ made no reference to the BB other than,"NO CASE LAW AS OF YET CONCERNING THE Bullett Button".
I have been refered to their department expert named "IGGIE CHIN" and will be calling him tomorrow.
Jeff recomended that I take apart my lower until I hear from Iggie.
Let's go back one more stop, I talked with the ATF firearms division, agent Pat Mohoney. He is the one that passed me on to Jeff at the DOJ. Pat told me the same thing, take the weapon apart and get clear direction from the DOJ.
Now I go back again to the last guy I spoke to, the trainer from the Sheriff's range and how adament he was that I could be arrested for having an assault weapon if the magazine was not welded.

"WHAT IS THE DEAL?"

I would love to hear your input and take on all of this.

Thanks,

Steve

[MikeK]

[Flux Capacitor]

hmmm

[jkasandiego]

[Samuel Adams]

Not to suprising considering who our AG is. I'm sure he will make his own laws until someone/group has the balls to take him throught he court system.

[jjperl]

They're just bitter because their stupid laws have loopholes you can run a train through and because they are losing control.

[thefurball]

Ask the nice LEO to quote you the regulation (by title, part and section please) that states "weld" as the "only" acceptable method of securing a magazine.

My wager is that he can't come up with it and will opt for bluster instead.

[rkt88edmo]

"come January 1st" just doesn't have that catchy ring to it.

[RobG]

[soopafly]

This is an ongoing problem with DOJ. You might want to relate your experience to TMLLP:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=75305

[G17GUY]

"come January 1st" just doesn't have that catchy ring to it.

we will know for sure in TWO weeks!

[sen24]

If it was so illegal, interesting he didnt arrest you right there.

[bwiese]

Steve,

Asking a sheriff's office for 'signoff' is irrelevant. That cop doesn't know what the hell he's talking about either.

An OLL w/fixed mag, or one properly configured with a MonsterMan grip, a U15 stock (or gripless) to be compliant with SB23 (12276.1) is legal according to the letter of the law, which is all that is applicable.

There is no case law on these BECAUSE ALL CASES GET DISMISSED and never get thru the system.

The DOJ was not able to submit its regulatory change, either - where they tried to criminalize such matters - since it was illegal and the Office of Admin. Law would've stopped it. Ask yourself this question: if it's illegal why did they have to try to create a new regulation?

Other recent cases filed w/regard to OLL rifles that DOJ 'drove' into local DAs hands resulted in either 'we ain't gonna file, there's no crime', or the judge says, "what the hell, why can't the DOJ come up with adequate responses?"

Hell, LA's DA office will not even take DOJ-filed gun cases - after they got burned with the Pomona 'sting' operation of a coupla years ago (all charges dropped).

Iggy Chinn, the DOJ's 'expert', is provably incompetent and certainly unsupervised. The BoFfers have a supposed gun guy acting like a lawyer, and their lawyer acting like a gun guy. Kinda like having your chef for a plumber, and a plumber for your chef: sh*t moves, but in the wrong direction.

Chinn himself has testified that he is just a 'gun plumber' (years ago, he worked nights at a Oakland's Siegel's gunshop years ago for pocket money). In one case he testified in, a judge admonished him for not knowing "apples from oranges".

There's over 2+ telephone books' thick worth of material on Iggy Chinn (as well as large amount on other DOJ FD/BoF staffers) - including conflicting testimony, actions appearing perjurious if investigated further, and wholly wild-assed behaviors including approval of Evan's *listed* welded-up receivers. That just adds to the incompetence exhibited in the early 2000s Pomona gunshow sting where he asserted standalone HK pistol grips were illegal, along with the whole Robinson Arms M96 seizure scandal (because they couldn't read phrasing of 12276.1PC).

There's even testimony from Iggy where he says (in short) that a magazine requiring a tool for removal is not a detachable magazine. That testimony was actually used in at least one case dismissal.

If these guys were so (or any) good, they could get the AG's office to file these cases without resorting to "the 58 DAs". The AG files cases independently of local DAs all the time.

Instead, the DOJ FD/BoF can't even meet the AG office's internal case filing standards, so they've tried to troll off a few of these cases to 29-year-old junior DA girls in boondocks offices where they think the 'offender' can't get decent legal representation. The junior DA girl thinks she's got an 'evil gunrunner' on her hands, and has never held a gun in her overprotected little life so she doesn't know s**t from shinola.

I myself would love to be arrested by Iggy Chinn, as his added personal touch on such cases elevates the ease of, and radically lowers the cost of, a good defense...

[WokMaster1]

Steve, why do you do this to yourself? Don't we have enough info on here that at least give you a hint that DOJ is not to be trusted?

If you must, then at least send Iggy our best regards.

[bwiese]

Not to suprising considering who our AG is. I'm sure he will make his own laws until someone/group has the balls to take him through the court system.

Not true.

If you only knew...