PTR-91 ejection problem

[fcastle]

Hello Fellow CalGunners,

I have a problem and I would like your thoughts and feedback on it.

I have a brand new PTR-91 KFM4 (that's the 16" barrel with the 6-position M4 type stock). I have fired only commercial 308 ammo through it, and even with commercial ammo, after only 15-20 rounds, the empty brass do not eject. They get stuck in the chamber. And by stuck, I mean so bad that I have to kick the bolt open.

By the way, when it does eject, it ejects perfectly. My point is the thing doesn't even pull the empties out of the chamber, and I've checked the bolt over, too. That's all good- the bolt seems correctly spaced, the rollers are good, etc.

I've thoroughly cleaned the chamber with the proper HK chamber brush, even had it professionally cleaned using sonic wave bath, which is a technique that cleans the gun thoroughly. Still the problem persists- after the first 15-20 (or 25) rounds, the problem is back- empty brass does not eject- they don't even want to come out of the chamber!

I contacted PTR and they said, well, certain ammo does not work through our rifles. They cite ammo that has a lacquer finish doesn't work (but I only used commercial ammo!). They sent me a nice list of ammo do's and don'ts, and they claim that you can only use 308 ammo, no 7.62, no surplus, etc. They haven't offered any further explanation than that.

Now, I'm not an expert on HKs or the G3, but it seems to me that a 'battle rifle' copy of the famous G3 should be able to handle less than pristine commercial ammo. I do know, however, that the original G3s were tough as nails and could fire anything you fed through them. I'm told the HK91s are the same and do not have these problems.

So, fellow CalGunners- what is your opinion? What should I do? I would appreciate any and all comments or ideas.

Thanks very much,

[NSR500]

How old is your PTR? There was a batch with tight chambers out there.

[NSR500]

Nevermind... I just re-read your post and you day that it is new. But the problem sounds like the problem a batch of older one had. I'd push to have it sent back so they can check the chamber and flutes.

[fcastle]

Thanks NSR.

I don't know how old it is- I bought it in June '09, and it was probably with the vendor for a while, but I don't know how long.

By brand new what I meant was that it was not used.

[NSR500]

Try some milsurp or steel cased ammo in your PTR to see if it has a problem. Commercial brass is thinner/softer so maybe it is expanding really tight into the chamber.
I've seen properly chambered and functioning CETME ejecting brass even without an extractor.

[Barney Gumble]

Read this thread: http://hkpro.com/forum/showthread.php?t=110771

[97F1504RAD]

What brand of commercial .308 re you using. I would get some American Eagle or Remington UMC and try that. If the rifle still malfunctions on those two brands then get back in touch with PTR and tell them it will not function with those brands since those are two of the brands they suggest. The problem is the chamber in the newer PTR's does not have the flutes cut as deeply as a HK91/G3. The barrels are made by TC and have very tight tolerances. This also appears to be sporadic with which rifles it effects and which it doesn't. Also the rifle will shoot 7.62x51 just not some brands here is a link to that info.

I know before i purchased mine I sent them a email asking if 7.62x51 could be shot out of the rifle and was told yes but that certain brands do cause issues.
What are the first 4 digits of your serial number? Is it a AWXXXX series?

http://www.ptr91.com/techinfo.html#ammunition

[Sig357]

Milsurp runs great in my ptr. However, it does not like commercial ammo.

[a1fabweld]

That sucks. I have a friend who had similar problems with a batch of German surplus about a year ago. The cases wouldn't get lodged in there though like yours. Fortunately for me, all 4 of my PTR's have fed & ejected 100%.

[lehn20]

It should run anything and everything. If not, sent it back.
It is a battlerifle. I refuse to believe in only certain ammo should be used. BS IMO.

[97F1504RAD]

Actually the PTR is not considered a "Battle Rifle" They market it as a Target Rifle. Not saying I agree but that is what they have chosen to do. And they have made a few manufacturing mistakes that seem to prevent them from running anything and everything.

Here is the ammo warning that comes with the rifel and is posted on the site.

Ammunition:
PTR 91 INC, Rifles are newly manufactured and are made to exacting standards and close tolerances. These rifles are made to function with commercial factory.308 cal ammunition. We do not recommend the use of reloads or of surplus ammunition. If surplus ammunition is used beware that this ammunition varies from manufacturer to manufacture, lot to lot, year to year, components used and processes in manufacturing. All this ammunition is not made to exact specification. We have found that some of this ammunition has caused problems in our rifles because they use a tar like sealant in their water proofing. When this ammunition is used in our rifles the sealant melts and coats the chamber. This causes failures to extract and to chamber. Afterwards any ammunition that is used will have the same problem if the chamber and the bore are not cleaned thoroughly. We have found surplus ammunition from the following countries/manufactures that have caused this problem in our rifles. That we know of at this time.


South African

Winchester white boxes marked 7.62,

Venezuela Cavim

Austrian (Hirtenberger)

Some lots of German

British (under powered) will not cycle action

Indian (Over powered)

If you have used this ammunition and have had problems you need to clean the chamber and the bore out thoroughly before using any other ammunition. Then try commercial .308 like Federal 150gr fmj or Remington 150 gr fmj to function test the rifle.


Note: If a rifle is returned to us for repair due to extraction and feeding problems and it is determined that it is caused by the use of these types of ammunition, the owner will be charged gunsmith time, ammunition cost and returned shipping.

Also DSA has this same warning on the FAL's so it's not just PTR.

http://www.dsarms.com/ammowarn.asp

[Whiterook]

Id send it in, I built a g3 clone on virgin fmp parts kit and it eats anything I feed it including 150 american eagle and 150 wolf. And I will put it up against any ranch mini 14 in a shell winging contest.

[wash]

Wow, a fluted chamber and you still get stuck cases?

I thought the beauty of the HK was that it would eat anything (and chew up the brass).

I've had good success with South African 7.62x51 in my FAL's, it seems to burn pretty clean.

[Barney Gumble]

Wow, a fluted chamber and you still get stuck cases?

I thought the beauty of the HK was that it would eat anything (and chew up the brass).

I've had good success with South African 7.62x51 in my FAL's, it seems to burn pretty clean.

Yes but it's not an HK.

[sd1023x]

Thats a lame excuse blaming ammunition for function of the weapon. SA and Hirtenberger is some pretty nice surplus. I have a JLD Axxxx and I have shot nothing but hirtenberger and SA it is one of my go to battle rifles.

Think it is BS when a manufacturer excludes an entire range of ammunition, maybe one or two brands it didn't like, I'd understand, but saying all surplus? On their website they advertise the caliber as 7.62mm NATO/.308. That is obviously false.