Recommendation for beginner

[milotrain]

Service rifle. Start with irons. The whole point of the national matches and the CMP is for what you want to do.

In budget
Right fundamentals
223
No load development needed

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http://pacifictoolandgauge.com/barre...e-actions.html and a Boyds stock.

[diver160651]

I-500 yards and eventually long range precision around 1000 yards plus.

Funny how today we just toss out "long range precision around 1000 yards plus" as a chip shot. I really would recommend - jumping off the forums for a bit and search up the different long range shooting disciplines and match types available that take place in the ranges interest you .. Not that you'd be, be shooting matches, but the styles require a different approach to what "might interest you in the future". You can as easily learn the fundamentals on a medium weight 308 as you can a low weight 223..

Don't let the cost of crappy 223 pull you into a 4MOA rabbet hole! You'll be learning VERY little then - You'll need to compare match grade ammo costs in both and they will cost very similar.

Get the $349 Remington 700 from Dicks or Sportsmans Warehouse as it is the world's most versatile action. If you decide you want some other type of shooting sport it will work.
The others mentioned for the most part are not upgradable or don't transition into other types of shooting like the 700 does.

Lynn and I are almost polar opposites with our approach to long and extended long range shooting. Lynn needs an F350 to pack around his gear and I need a backpack. He's interested in more in precision and I, in accuracy. The equipment required is different. Yet, for the most part, we both often use 700 based actions. The 700 really is the most versatile almost like the AR is (barrels being a bit harder to change).

So, while Lynn approach may be different than mine, I could not agree more with his advice.

He might go on to add a caliber like the 308 and a barrel weight, like the varmint etc..IDK

If thats how you go, the stock setup will perform very well for all the distances mentioned. The 26" heaver barrel will help soften the recoil for your learning phase, the twist will run good ammo and they tend to be shooters out of the box. As you grow and deiced what direction you like, you might choose a stock that better supports that discipline, then a trigger... Glass more specific to your passion and then re-barrel in the same or another caliber.

Lastly on glass - you can get real carried away. JMP might have a 9K scope and like me, a bunch of 2K+,3K+ ones. BTW I also have a 200 scope that has proper subtensions, while not as good as the above, it is pleasant clear, and isn't going to make you miss a steel target in first set of ranges you mentioned. That said, that cheap scope would be just junk if you wanted to shoot a bench rest comp or wanted to shoot a lot past 1K, my scopes all of them are also not good for benchrest. So when you hear people saying get "good glass" or "buy once cry once" ~ I am not always sure that makes sense until you know what you really want it for.

.. If you Knew you wanted to shoot lets say PRS, I might say a Ruger RPR 6.5 at the very top of your budget.. let it sit in your closet and borrow a few for a $ 200 FFP scope thats going to last you until a few months until you can gather more funds.. Sell it for $100 bucks.. so what look at it like a cheap rental until you gather more capitol.. Generally the scopes cost around 2K+ for that type of event.

But you really don't know, so go with the SPS, good ammo and maybe a training class - but be careful there too..

Short story - +1 to Lynn's recommendation to the 700.

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Funny how today we just toss out "long range precision around 1000 yards plus" as a chip shot. I really would recommend - jumping off the forums for a bit and search up the different long range shooting disciplines and match types available that take place in the ranges interest you .. Not that you'd be, be shooting matches, but the styles require a different approach to what "might interest you in the future". You can as easily learn the fundamentals on a medium weight 308 as you can a low weight 223..

Don't let the cost of crappy 223 pull you into a 4MOA rabbet hole! You'll be learning VERY little then - You'll need to compare match grade ammo costs in both and they will cost very similar.
.

223 bullets and brass cost quite a bit less than 308 bullets and brass. 223 also uses quite a bit less powder than the 308.

[diver160651]

223 bullets and brass cost quite a bit less than 308 bullets and brass. 223 also uses quite a bit less powder than the 308.

So is he now budgeting Reloading gear and supply stock? BTW I like many have many many thousands in reloading gear - and a lot tight up in supplies, but I also know it is cheaper to shoot commercial match grade than it is to reload my best loads. One reason to shoot factory, might be training, this next flight is an example.. I'll be shooting the same ammo as the guys I am working with. It will be issued, ammo aka FGMM. It may also be because you travel etc.. ammo does not always make it somehow.

There are reasons we reload, but it isn't a good fit for the OP as a beginner with the level of rifle he'll end up with and his budget, is it?

So 223 FGMM 69gr runs fairly close to 18 BX with the 308 FFMs 168's (they will shoot fine to 1 k out to a 26" barrel) is about 18bx with the 175s only $2 more.. That was my point.

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So is he now budgeting Reloading gear and supply stock? BTW I like many have many many thousands in reloading gear - and a lot tight up in supplies, but I also know it is cheaper to shoot commercial match grade than it is to reload my best loads.

There are reasons we reload but it isn't a good fit for the OP as a beginner with the level of rifle he'll end up with and his budget, is it?

So 223 FGMM 69gr runs fairly close to 18 BX with the 308 FFMs 168's (they will shoot fine to 1 k out to a 26" barrel) is about 18bx with the 175s only $2 more.. That was my point.

If op wants that level of rifle to shoot its best for lowest cost, reload.

[MissiontoMars]

I want to start mid range shooting 200-500 yards and eventually long range precision around 1000 yards plus. I want to start with 223 bolt action gun, until i get use to the fundamentals and will upgrade higher caliber. Basically i will train with this rifle. My budget is around $800-1200 range with scope.

I would appreciate the help in choosing the right bolt action rifle for my needs. What can you guys recommend?

Thank you in advance.

Hi Glocklife,

Great that you are thinking of getting into this type of shooting. I am no shooting expert by any means, but consistently make shots around 150-200 yards and beyond with good results.

What I am an expert in, is having a tight budget due to other goals, hobbies and responsibilities(3 kids = I'm poor), so I totally understand the need to set a budget and stick to it. Sometimes budgeting means limitations, but that's life, right?

I think you have some great options these days, though:

1. Ruger American Ranch
2. Ruger American Predator
3. Savage Axis
4. Howa 1500
5. Mossberg MVP
6. Used versions of any of those

Those guns will do the job, and as long as you have:

1. some quality scope rings from a major brand
2. any scope from Leopold, Vortex, Burris, Nikon, etc.

My prediction is that you will do just fine out to 200 yards and possibly beyond.

You'll eventually run up against the limits of that equipment, but then again, if you do your part, you'll probably have the pleasure of making a 500-600 yard shot with equipment that "shouldn't" be able to do the job.

5.56/.223 is a great, inexpensive place to start, with lots of readily available ammo, and you'll know soon enough if you'll want to move up a .30 caliber bullet.

[MissiontoMars]

Service rifle. Start with irons. The whole point of the national matches and the CMP is for what you want to do.

In budget
Right fundamentals
223
No load development needed

Good advice.

[diver160651]

If op wants that level of rifle to shoot its best for lowest cost, reload.

You tell me how much better, the SPS 308 varmint will shoot with reloads over FGMM.

Now you tell me how securing Varget, a noticeable better bullet than the 175SMK, brass, primers and the time it takes will be less $$.. No way, unless you are unemployed.. Now stack on the reloading gear, load development costs.. and learning curve.

Out of the people I have worked with shooting a 700 308 -- very very few have reloads that have a lower ES/SD and shoot noticeably better than the FGMM out of them..

This is cominimg from a die-hard reloader... so no way is saying 223 components are cheaper and that why you should buy a 223 - makes much sense.. now, if the op wants to shoot cheap crappy ammo and spray at 1K+, or loves the 223 for other reasons thats a different topic

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You tell me how much better, the SPS 308 varmint will shoot with reloads over FGMM.

Now you tell me how securing Varget, a noticeable better bullet than the 175SMK, brass, primers and the time it takes will be less $$.. No way, unless you are unemployed.. Now stack on the reloading gear, load development costs.. and learning curve.

Out of the people I have worked with shooting a 700 308 -- very very few have reloads that have a lower ES/SD and shoot noticeably better than the FGMM out of them..

This is cominimg from a die-hard reloader... so no way is saying 223 components are cheaper and that why you should buy a 223 - makes much sense.. now, if the op wants to shoot cheap crappy ammo and spray at 1K+, or loves the 223 for other reasons thats a different topic

OP wants to shoot 223 to 500 yards not spray cheap crappy ammo to 1000 yards. The cost for 223 components is less and you can't figure the time it takes unless 308 reloads faster than 223.

[glocklife34]

Im actually very familiar with reloading. I reload my own ammunition but difference is i only load pistol ammunitions. Never tried loading a rifle ammunition but i definitely can reload since i have wide variety of equipment. But time would be the biggest factor reloading rifle.

For the budget, the reason for the low budget is it will be my first bolt action rifle and i honestly dont know what i want yet. But i would eventually know what i want once i start with something. But planning to squeeze my budget for a good scope since i can grow with the optic, as adviced. Maybe a nightforce or a vortex viper pst gen 2.

And the reason i chose .223 is due to nearby ranges only limited to 100-300 yards, i dont know if i get 6.5cr it would be a overkill for the ranges im shooting with to begin with, but i plan to shoot maybe sac valley for longer range once i know what im doing.

[diver160651]

Recommendation for beginner

Fundamentals are fast to learn if you have the correct setup and coach.

learning the proper set up to create good dope and implement it because your interest take you away from shooting paper, out of position shooting or Learning the nuances of long range precision load development, is a different story.

Running the trigger a short range is easy

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[tsoiky]

Recommendation for beginner

And the reason i chose .223 is due to nearby ranges only limited to 100-300 yards, i dont know if i get 6.5cr it would be a overkill for the ranges im shooting with to begin with, but i plan to shoot maybe sac valley for longer range once i know what im doing.

Shooting 6.5 for 100-300 yards range is overkill. Too boring, too easy.

That's why my Tikka Tac A1 6.5 is for the 1000 yards. Wearing a Tier 1 scope, IOR Valdada Recon.

Within 500 yards, I just use my Howa HCR in 223. Wearing SWFA SS 12x42 scope. This SS scope worth every penny. This is the only $300 scope you can trust in the tracking/turret. Glass is clear.



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[tsoiky]

REX recommendation


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[NorCalFocus]

Here's my .02

.223 is great out to about 400, 500 is doable but it requires heavier bullets. Heavier match grade bullets are pretty important to fighting the wind and getting consistent hits at 500 yards.

Now here's the issue. Most factory 223 bolt actions do not have twist rates designed for these bullets. My selection on rifle would be based largely in part to what the twist rate of the barrel is.

I to think the 700 is a great platform to start with. I believe that the 700 tactical with a 20" barrel comes with a faster twist rate too.

If you do decide to go with a 700 short action and want to upgrade the stock for cheap shoot me a PM. I have a Boyds stock sitting here.