Using a modified g19 (salient/ zev) for concealed carry

[NiteQwill]

I would choose a Zev gun over a Salient any day of the week, including Sundays.

Their (Salient) guns were available for shooting at the Shooting Fair and during SHOT show.

[Mossy Man]

The people that have stated that don't own one, never have owned one, never handled one. I've asked people to provide evidence that Salient Arms Glocks don't run. Everyone seems to be butt hurt for some reason whenever Salients guns are brought up in a thread/post and are quick to jump on the bandwagon saying they make a worthless product.

So far no one has shown first hand evidence that their firearms don't run. As I've stated in a previous thread my range buddy owns 3 Tier 1 Salients and they have no problems with them.

I challenge anyone who makes these claims to prove me wrong. I just don't understand where people are getting their info from besides that they heard it from there daddy's uncles high school friends cousins.

I'm not going to argue with you on that; you might be right.

But I don't need to buy a Springfield M1A and experience problems with it first hand before I believe all the stories on the internet about them.

I'll go ahead and take their word for it; if that means I miss out on an awesome product then so be it. That's what free market is about.

[Click Boom]

The idea is funny, because if you need to shoot someone and it's gotten to the point of them taking it as permanent evidence, losing that modded pistol is going to be the least (expensive) of your problems.

[Press Check]

I have SAI's Tier 1 fire control group in a G4 G19 and have not had a single hiccup, and do not suspect that I will.

Of course, anything that has more than one moving part is going to experience a mechanical failure at some point, and if SAI pistols are inherently finicky, or prone to mechanical issues, it is not being published by their owners. Of course, you hear the "my buddy" stories, or an account from an onlooker at a class.

If I had $3,000 Glock that was finicky or failing at every turn, trust me, I would be online complaining about it, as would many others.

[chronixskm]

Agreed, it is a free market, yet people want to cry and moan about how Salient charges $2000 for their modifications on a $500 Glock. No one is forcing anyone to send them a check. I've searched the internet all over trying to find first hand info on Salients not running, so far can't find anything but that doesn't stop people from spreading the rumor.

[Mossy Man]

Agreed, it is a free market, yet people want to cry and moan about how Salient charges $2000 for their modifications on a $500 Glock. No one is forcing anyone to send them a check. I've searched the internet all over trying to find first hand info on Salients not running, so far can't find anything but that doesn't stop people from spreading the rumor.

I think to be fair though, nobody's getting the salient work for a carry gun.

I'm sure they're excellent for what they're meant for.

That being said, a 1000hp track car would make a terrible daily driver

[ruchik]

Quote from Randy Lee regarding the Apex Tactical kits in M&P's:

Hi,

The trigger as it was originally designed and sprung would yield a pull around 3.5 lbs. On some guns it would be 3 or slightly less. We felt that due to the elimination of pre travel and the reduced sensitivity to pressure when adrenalized, the trigger posed a significant risk to our liability insurance if we did not recommend it be used for competition only. Since then we have had a stronger sear spring made (included in the FSS kit)that increases trigger pull weight. If all the springs in the kit are used, the pull weight is typically right around 5 lbs which seems to be an acceptable weight by many administrators who understand how trigger pull quality can affect the officer's ability to hit things on demand.The problem is that many do not have the newer sear blocks or haven't had their existing blocks modified to accept the new spring and plunger, or choose to mix and match springs to yield the pull weight less than what the full kit provides. As we cannot control what the end user does, we have to protect ourselves from the lowest common denominator.


If and when Smith chooses to offer our kits in their guns, we will be able to change the liability warning.


-Randy

Parts that say "for competition use only" are usually meant to protect the manufacturer against idiots. That being said, there really are some competition-only parts not because of potential civil suits, but because of the nature of the modifications. For example, a 2.5 lb trigger on a 1911, disabled trigger safety tab on a Glock trigger, etc.

[NYT]

op, i would not recommend that as your ccw.

Agreed, it is a free market, yet people want to cry and moan about how Salient charges $2000 for their modifications on a $500 Glock. No one is forcing anyone to send them a check. I've searched the internet all over trying to find first hand info on Salients not running, so far can't find anything but that doesn't stop people from spreading the rumor.

of course you have found examples. i posted mine in another thread here that i believe you were on talking about "your buddies tier 1s". you just specifically do not want to recognize these posts because it would burst your bubble.

there is a reason people hear stories and then relate them on the internet. it isnt about a brothers best friends sisters cousin or any nonsense like that, it is because it happened, they saw it and are reporting what they saw. actually finding someone who has these weapons and runs them hard is the problem here. every one i know that has one either barely shoots or has sold them. i believe in the other thread you mentioned that costa shoots the piss out of his yet as i stated before, that is not accurate.

if i spent 2500 on a glock and had it fail in a class i would be extremely embarrassed and not want to publicize my stupidity on a firearm forum. especially when a lot of calgun members come down so hard on other calgun members. can you even imagine what the replies to their threads would read? talk about worthless.

[SoCalEnthusiast]

You just have to mandle it!, enough said!

[penguinofsleep]

if an expensive gun is the gun you can best defend yourself with, go for it IF the gun is reliable. how much is your life worth to you? doesn't mean you need a $3k pistol or even a $1k pistol to carry, but the gun you use best is the one most likely to keep you safe/alive, and if being alive costs an extra $2k, so be it. that's still a lot less than medical/funeral bills cost if something goes wrong b/c you picked a tool you just can't use very well. with that being said, i wouldn't carry a salient glock.

in terms of mods, i've always heard from those that i feel know what they are talking about:
- common practice
ex: if you have a 10+lb trigger and reduce it to 5-6lb, that is most likely going to be OK as quite a few popular models come in at 5-6lb. if you take a 5lb trigger down to 12oz with a short reset so you can simulate full auto easily, that most likely isn't going to end well as it isn't common practice. extreme examples yes, but hopefully this makes the idea clear.
- individual comfort level.
ex: if a 5lb trigger being too light makes you worry and decreases your effectiveness at keeping yourself alive, get a heavier trigger. if you can't handle 12lb b/c it's too heavy and worrying about throwing a shot off and harming an innocent screws you up to where you really do start missing and increasing risk, it's advisable to go reduce the weight to a comfortable level (within standard practice).

and yes, anytime a firearm is involved, legal risk is involved. but i'd imagine if you are drawing a gun, your immediate well being and life is (or is very likely) on the line and you probably already feel that your life is worth more than several thousand dollars of potential legal risk (or else you probably wouldn't be relying on a firearm).

[chronixskm]

op, i would not recommend that as your ccw.



of course you have found examples. i posted mine in another thread here that i believe you were on talking about "your buddies tier 1s". you just specifically do not want to recognize these posts because it would burst your bubble.

there is a reason people hear stories and then relate them on the internet. it isnt about a brothers best friends sisters cousin or any nonsense like that, it is because it happened, they saw it and are reporting what they saw. actually finding someone who has these weapons and runs them hard is the problem here. every one i know that has one either barely shoots or has sold them. i believe in the other thread you mentioned that costa shoots the piss out of his yet as i stated before, that is not accurate.

if i spent 2500 on a glock and had it fail in a class i would be extremely embarrassed and not want to publicize my stupidity on a firearm forum. especially when a lot of calgun members come down so hard on other calgun members. can you even imagine what the replies to their threads would read? talk about worthless.

I read your post as well as others and they were duly noted. I don't work for Salient Arms, they don't pay me, they don't sponsor me. No idea why you think it would burst my bubble in any way. I don't own one, yet.

As far as the Costa class goes, that may have been the case for you. Costa lends his handguns out at will during many classes, a lot of students get to shoot his personal handguns. Like I said, that may have not been the case at your class.

You think spending $2500 on a Glock is any different from people spending $3500 on semi-custom 1911's? Read 1911 forums there's plenty of people posting problems with Wilsons, Nighthawks, Baers, Browns, etc. The reason I wouldn't post about it is because I don't look for firearm problems on Internet forums, I go to the manufacturer.

As I stated before, I'm looking for first hand experience on these so called "problems" with Salient guns not running. I WANT to find first hand problems with these guns but unfortunately just not seeing anything yet. People who do not own one love to chime in and poop all over this company. Whether people like it or not Salient has a 4 month wait time on their Tier packages.

[Sharp Shooter]

You just have to mandle it!, enough said!

SoCalIdiot, I said it before and I'll say it again, you really shouldn't let your 14 year old brother log into your CalGuns account.

[Funtimes]

So much stuff about weight, how about when the attorneys argue that when you miss your target and hit another individual that it took too much pull with your trigger finger and had it been a lighter trigger the firearm would have discharged earlier and you would not have pulled off target as much?

You have NY Cops that said 5 was too low, dept increases weight - they still 'accidentally' shoot people.

No matter what the weight of your trigger, it would be easiest to just pin you with simple questions on why your finger was on the trigger if you didn't mean to kill / injure the person(remember your firearm safety rules!).

Pick what works for you and lets you be as accurate as possible with reliability.

[mjmagee67]

When your life depends on it.. A box stock G19 with std. 5lb tigger for the WIN! CCW is about defending your or someone else's life. Not to "carry your favorite trophy or competition gun. A CCW gun should be a "tool gun".

^^^^This^^^^

If a stock gun is good enough for police, HRT, special forces, et,al then it's good enough for you. I own many gun that I have set up JUST for USPSA & Gun Nation, that is just what those guns are for, they are comp guns only. My CCW gun is a box stock S&W Airwieght 38 SPL revolver, the only gun on my CCW!!!! To me my CCW is to give me space allow me and my family to get away, it's not about a long drawn out Hollywood style shoot out. One or two shots retreat to cover reassess, reload with my one speed strip if needed , call 911,

[Sharp Shooter]

^^^ LOL !! SoCalIdiot doesn't give a crap what this thread, or any other, is about.

He just got his first Glock two months ago, a new G30... and that's ALL that matters to him.

And No, he has zero experience carrying... But, he sure likes to hand out lots of advice to others.

You should make all those SoCalIdiot quotes your permanent signature.