Smith & Wesson, quality or catastrophe?

[Freq18Hz]

I'm considering getting a S&W 686 and was reading reviews on this gun and the company earlier today. My brother has this gun and likes it a lot. There are some articles I read that imply that quality has slipped at Smith & Wesson. I'm curious, do people on this site think that S&W Still makes a high quality product?

PS this article from www.chuckhawks.com was probably the most negative one I read. I'm not sure when this article was written but wow! What a hit job.

Please do not post whole articles or substantial quotes from articles - see http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=363956

We are stillSee the stickies http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=394912

// Librarian

It's all relative op. Smith and Wesson still makes quality revolvers (compared to other manufactures). Their quality however, is a far cry from what it used to be. Since they changed hands, their quality has steadily gone down since the late 80's.

Some of this is due to gun laws, some due to manufacturing changes. Their old revolvers used to be 100% forged. Now they use cast metal, and some MIM.

In short, their old pistols had tighter tolerances, and were built stronger, without locks that can fail.


-Freq

[morrcarr67]

It looks like there is a problem on the S&W forum and the Admin has a new policy

Members of the S&W forum are greeted by this warning. The S&W faithful have been complaining about the lack of quality of the new production revolvers. Many say that they will not purchase any current production gun but will seek quality used S&W revolvers made in 1998 or earlier. MIM parts, 2 piece barrels, barrel sleeves, no case hardened triggers and hammers, a decline in fit and finish, and hefty price increases seem to be the reasons for the dissatisfaction.
It seems that the management at S&W wants to lower cost to increase profits. Perhaps with Taurus management focusing on quality there may be reversal in market position in the works.

[COLOR=RED ]WARNING! [/COLOR]
We have a new policy on Bashing Current Production Guns.
You are strongly advised to click the link below and read the sticky.
Click: Bashing, Crying, and Whining
Ignorance of this policy won't save you.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-revolvers-1980-present/354030-bashing-crying-whining.html

[nikki#2]

I'm considering getting a S&W 686...

There are some articles I read that imply that quality has slipped at Smith & Wesson...

I'm curious, do people on this site think that S&W Still makes a high quality product?

Absolutely.

Saw that article years ago when researching my first S&W firearm (a classic Model 17 .22LR 'Masterpiece'). While there's no date on the article, it's known that S&W's quality
declined in the 80's after the Wesson's sold the company to Bangor Punta Alegre Sugar Corporation. Since 1997, when F.H. Tomkins PLC purchased the company, and continuing
with the Saf-T-Hammer Corp purchase in 2001 and subsequent IPO, QC has definitely improved.

Here's my 4" 686-CS1, manufactured in 1991 and my 4" 617-6 10-shot .22LR, manufactured in 2008... A great pair to own, BTW. For cheap training, I transfer the Crimson Trace laser grips off the 686
and onto the 617. I have removed the side-plates off both revolvers for inspection, spring replacement and light stoning (under the watchful eye of an experienced member on this site).
Based on my observation & ownership, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase a new 686. Both revolvers are high-quality, with internals reminiscent of a Swiss watch.

I now own several S&W firearms and I've used their Customer Service a few times and have sent two firearms in for servicing. I believe they have the best CS in the industry.
Lifetime warranty, shipping both ways. What's not to like?

Go for it!

[Sandiegosurf1]

Here's the link for the chuck Hawk piece of Smith & Wesson.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/smith-wesson_dark.htm

[Sandiegosurf1]

Say what you will. One gun with multiple issues doesn't condemn a whole company's product, but try this little experiment:

Google "Smith & Wesson quality control issues" and take a peek as to what comes up. You'll never guess what the first gun listed is.

Yep, I see that....a 686 unfortunately.

[JTROKS]

686+, 586, 66, 640, 5906 & 6906, all keepers. Nothing wrong with them.

[ChuckDizzle]

Yes, quality has slipped. Has it slipped to the point where the guns are no longer worth buying? Not at all.

If you get a chance to handle an older Smith and Wesson and a new one side by side you likely would not even notice the difference. However, with some close inspection I have experienced you will notice.

I have a Model 19-6 and a 637 that was bought new just about a year ago (last year's tax return splurchase). Looking very closely, might even need a magnified glass, you can see that the cuts on the frame of the 637 are very slightly jagged because the resolution of whatever method of cutting was maxed out. It looks slightly like a staircase under magnification. By comparison the 19-6 is almost magically smooth, and in some places the fit is so good you can't see the cut with the naked eye, an it almost looks bonded under magnification.

Now my next observation may have to do with one being old school blued steel and the other being an "Airweight" frame, but after thousands of rounds through the 19-6, and a 10th of those being magnums which are supposed to kill this K-frame, it still has a tighter lock up in the cylinder, and less play on the front of the cylinder latch (I believe this is technically called the yoke), than my year old 637 which has maybe 1000 rounds through it and about 200 +p.

Now all that being said the little 637 is still a GREAT gun, especially because I think I paid around $350 for it. I would like to get a new 686 under a magnified glass to make a more realistic comparison. While I suspect it may not be as refined as my 19, I doubt quality has slipped to the point of making it not worth buying.

[Bill Steele]

I have never had a S&W revolver that wasn't a tack driver.

I own only one late model S&W today, a current version Model 29, it is a terrific gun. A while back I had a 686+ (current production version) and it was flawless. I traded that gun for a completely different style of gun, not because I was unhappy with it in any way.

The bad news is it sounds like your question may become a moot one for the masses here in CA.

[Tarn_Helm]

Top Quality S&W M&P from 1948

I have never had a S&W revolver that wasn't a tack driver.

I own only one late model S&W today, a current version Model 29, it is a terrific gun. A while back I had a 686+ (current production version) and it was flawless. I traded that gun for a completely different style of gun, not because I was unhappy with it in any way.

The bad news is it sounds like your question may become a moot one for the masses here in CA.

Bill, Your experience sounds like mine.

But to all those here who own or have owned a substandard S&W, I'm sorry for you.

I got an S&W letter for my 2-inch barrel, round butt pre-Model 10, the original "Military & Police."

It shipped in March of 1948 to a hardware store in Signal Hill, CA.

It is the most accurate handgun I own.

'Nuff said.

[Cactus_Tim]

I pick up my 686+ Monday afternoon. I'll be taking a close look at it after reading this thread. Hoping to be pleased with the test drive.

[ptgarcia]

Look, all manufacturers of mass produced firearms have changed materials, manufacturing methods, and designs over the years. You can argue if these changes are for the better or not, but everything changes. Neither Smith & Wesson, Colt or Springfield make them like they used to, but they all still make fine guns. They all put out turds every once in a while but so what, every company does. Buy one, and the chances of getting one with issues are small, but if it does S&W will fix it. I don't care what gun you buy there is no guaranty it will be perfect.

Paul